FTB - Back to Work Edition - Pension Plan Puppets

FTB - Back to Work Edition

by Chemmy on Jan 5, 2009 9:08 AM EST Comment 92 comments

Gotta hustle through this FTB today:

Cox Bloc wants you to know the polls are still open for Mittenstringer of the Year.
loser domi wants you to check out one of her other writing gigs, as well as some LOLeafs.
Norte has a new post up about ... I don't know actually.
Foster Hewitt wants to remind you to buy a Chevrolet. Check out other great historical pictures at Vintage Leafs.
It's Tokarski tonight. I can't wait to see the boys complete the drive for five.
haha the sens suck.

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Sports And The City

A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...

by eyebleaf on Jan 5, 2009 10:02 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Re: Sens

A little bird tells me that Craig Hartsburg told a friend that the players simply refuse to play a system, and that “I’ve never coached a bigger bunch of babies in my life”.

Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.

by Down Goes Brown on Jan 5, 2009 10:53 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Really?

That is very interesting and not that surprising. From watching the sens and reading Scarlett Ice and Five For Smiting it sures sounds like they are just doing whatever they feel like.

Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.

by PPP on Jan 5, 2009 11:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It’s one thing to tune a coach out… the Leafs will do it to Wilson eventually, probably sooner than later. It happens to Burns everywhere he goes. It’s part of the job.

But the Sens seem to tune coaches out immediately. They did it to Pollack, to Murray (more or less) and now they haven’t even given Hartsburg a chance. He walked in one day one and they were already not listening.

But Alfie is still a great leader, right? No reason to give that another look-see…

Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.

by Down Goes Brown on Jan 5, 2009 12:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The only problem with enjoying the Sens’ collapse is the possibility that they will draft higher than us in June. That would not be nice.

by lb71 on Jan 5, 2009 11:32 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Yeah

It kind of sucks but they’ll probably draft in the 5+ range (barring some unforseen collapse) and miss out on the franchise players. Hopefully they’ll ruin whoever they draft. Plus, the Heatley, Spezza, Alfie, Fisher contracts make it very hard to improve the team.

Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.

by PPP on Jan 5, 2009 11:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

if only...

there was some way to get the sens stink off of Fisher…it seems to be impacting his game now.

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 11:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The Sens will trade at least one of their bug three and at least one of either Vermette, Volchenkov or Fisher in an attempt to rebuild. One of the big three has to go for them to do anything, but loosing any of the others will cripple them hilariously.

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 12:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Spezza

is my guess to go. He’s not someone you can build a team around, but he can rack up the points. I just have no idea who’d take him. Florida?

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 12:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

He’s young and can score. I wouldn’t give up big assets for him, but I would take Spezza if Ottawa was jammed up and needed to dump salary fast.

Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.

by Chemmy on Jan 5, 2009 12:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

he won't go...

because of what you pointed out, he;s not a building block. He also won’t be traded because he’s being paid as a cornerstone franchise player. $7M a year is steep for any team. You’re talking more than Luongo, more than Datsyuk, more than Morrow, more than Kopitar…

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

What?

He gets 7 million? A year? Wow. This salary cap thing sure has kept things in check. That’s not insane at all.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Murray

really made a mess of the Sens.
I still can’t believe how much Fisher gets paid. He’s a solid player, but not worth anything more than $3 mill.

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 12:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

does he have an NTC too? cause that would be hilarity

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 12:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

He does, but it doesn’t kick in until next season which is why they may be desperate to deal him now.

And it’s not just $7M, it’s $7M for the next seven years.

Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.

by Down Goes Brown on Jan 5, 2009 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

that's Spezza

who only has a NTC that kicks in next season.
Do you know if Fisher does?

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 4:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Sorry, you’re right I misread the question.

According to this page, Fisher has the dreaded no-movement clause until 2011, at which point it becomes a limited no-trade.

Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.

by Down Goes Brown on Jan 5, 2009 5:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I should mention that I see a few errors on that page, so Fisher’s status may not be 100% accurate.

Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.

by Down Goes Brown on Jan 5, 2009 5:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

interesting

so the Sens are really screwed, then, for a long time.

Sweet.

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 5:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But at least they have the 27th best prospects in the NHL.

Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.

by Down Goes Brown on Jan 5, 2009 5:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Heatly is a more viable option because, he can given any line mate who can pass at a third liner level, put up 30 goals easy.
Spezza needs a pure finnisher to be fully effective.
Alfredson probably wont go because Sens fans would burn down the SBC

god I hope he gets traded

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 12:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i don't see heatley moving...

in fact, i don’t see any of the “big three” going anywhere.

guys like fisher, volchenkov and vermette are more likely to be moved.

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 12:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But how do you change the chemistry/makeup of the team if the big three stay?

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree that it is hard to see any of em going, but I’m sure Muckler will have his hand forced and either give him away for nothing or take a huge gamble on a Gaborik or something like that and further cripple the team.
Either way, he’s not gonna get face value unless he can swindle Tampa or Florida for something viable

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

ott has gerber coming off the books next year, and kuba. that’s 6M in savings right there…if they buy a decent headstrong goaltender who could be a real locker room presence, that might be enough…

still, they brought in Smith for his leadership qualities, but it sounds like nothing’s changed.

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think probably nothing short of total teardown will change things in Ottawa. They’ve got it into their heads that they are just awesome and don’t need anyone’s advice. There is no cure but the fire.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

fire is the clenser, and ligthing anything senator related on fire is aces in my books

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

it will be

glorious to watch, but not this year… because this is the Leaf’s firesale year. They can wait.

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

'zactly

we put the “everything must go” plan into action first, so it is our turn!

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Gah, I just want Burke to do something, like NOW. Something small to wet my whistle.
Hell, have Cujo retire, that would be nice

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I know

I’ve been hoping since the 27th that I would wake up one morning and find the miracle trade had happened….
but nothing so far.

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

it would be awesome to see...

burke trades hollweg and mayers straight up for rick nash. follwed by..

burke trades deveaux and sifers for kovalchuk straight up…

a boy can dream.

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Cujo and Toskala, for Luongo.
Blake and Newbury for Getzlaf!

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

that'd be sweet...our first line would be

Kovy-Getzlaf-Nash
Kubina-Kaberle
Luongo

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Luongo’s groin is blown (TWSS!) and I bet it’ll be an issue for him for a while, if not the rest of his career.

I’m sorta sad the Leafs couldn’tve done something to get Labarbera, I watched him in a few games for LA and was impressed by his size + speed.

by LeafFanInVan on Jan 5, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

you watched the wrong games...

he’s JS Aubin all over…except it’s not happening to the leafs.

LaHanna Barbera will play well until it matters, then he’ll implode at the worst possible time and take every one on the team down with him…

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 2:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think he could have filled the gap quite ably, allowing the leafs to not embarass themselves while giving toskala the choice starts to showcase himself before foisting him off on some team.

Could he really be any worse than the Toskala/Cujo tandem? Also he does make some really spectacular saves, and that helps boost morale and make the games more exciting.. Rather than some feeble attempt to glove a puck or the slo-mo crease action of cujo..

by LeafFanInVan on Jan 5, 2009 2:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i thought...

we should have traded Toskala for Turco straight up while Dallas was still struggling.

Marty was lights out against Van last night…

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 2:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Marty always rocks it against the canucks, it seems.

Turco for Tosk would be awesome but that’d never happen, pipe dream! Even when Dallas was in the terlet they wouldn’t make that trade..

by LeafFanInVan on Jan 5, 2009 2:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

hull

convinced them to sign avery…

stranger things have happened. at the time, everyone was pointing their finger at turco saying his play was the issue (which it was, but avery had a huge impact on the dressing room….)

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I couldn’t see it happening, but I guess it would be possible.. He seems like Modano though, one of the faces of the franchise who will probably be there for his entire career.

by LeafFanInVan on Jan 5, 2009 2:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I want him to do something

but not just any old thing. I hate the “do something just to do something” move. Be smart about it, don’t just trade and dump willy nilly. I figure he’s a planning something, so I can wait.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

BUT I WANT IT NOW! NOW! NOW! NOW!

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I know you do Jared, but sometimes waiting makes it even better.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

pssssh

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Anticipation hightens the pleasure.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

he is!

he’s planning on getting 1st overall on draft day.

ya’ll don’t believe me, but you’ll see…oh you’ll see…

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

you’re tenting your fingers arnt you?

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

nope...

stroking the beard….

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

given that alfie is captain until he’s dead or retires…i see no change in that team until 2013…

talking about worthless captains…what the hell has gotten into crosby?

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

all his whining has turned into epic hissy fits, it reminds me of Jagr.

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

no idea about Jagr

but Sid needs a good slap, punching a guy in the nuts, and then jumping a guy in the faceoff? I have no idea what’s going on with him, but if he keeps this up I want him nowhere near the 2010 team.

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think he’s snapped, what with no one to defend him and all. Plus, he’s young and doesn’t handle the being pushed around well. Hopefully he’ll either get a defender, or grow up, because he is starting to make me ill with the idiocy.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

especially

with how overexposed he is.
Maybe part of the problem is Therrien. I think if the losing streak continues, he’ll go.
But yes, the Pens need some people in that locker room with a voice, to take some of the pressure of Sid.

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You’re probably right. He needs a bit less exposure, me thinks. And yes, Therrien may lose his job if this continues.

Yeah, he’s a good player, but he can’t do everything by himself, so the Pens best get him some help with that. And no, I don’t mean more Malkin. Someone like a Roberts-type, like blurr said.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i know!

Avery!

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Bwahahaha!

That would be the best comedy ever. Sid would lose his mind, and call everyone sloppy seconds, and the two of them would wreck the town of Pittsburgh. Someone get on that!

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 2:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Avery with crosby?

My cock knocker senses are tingling…

Making stuff up since real Leafs news is far too depressing

by loser domi on Jan 5, 2009 2:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Shanahan???

I can’t think of many options out there…

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i know...

he’s their “captain” and his play has been absolutely embarrassing. he needs guys like roberts and recchi around to keep him on an even keel.

i really think we’re witnessing the beginning of a britney spears-esque meltdown for the guy

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks

now I’m picturing Crosby skating around the ice, showing off his junk because he’s not wearing a cup. Shudder.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Now I have a hilarious mental image of Crosbny with a shaved head attacking Pierre McQuire with an umbrella

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

thanks...

now i do to

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

haha

me too, and I love it.

I would love an image of anything attacking McGuire…

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

MONSTER!!!!!MONSTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

/whack whack whack
/thud

(pierre lies dead in a pool of his own blood while sid silently rocks back and forth stroking his bloodied umbrella)

the end

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

you forgot

“and we all lived happily ever after”

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Fisher

makes $6mill. That’s more of an unmoveable contract than Blake at $4 mill.

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The hell?

What are they smoking in Ottawa? And how can I get me some?

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

it's all about cap hit...

fisher’s is 4.2M…

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

This whole cap hit vs actual salary thing is confusing to me.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i believe...

it’s avg value of the contract over the term of the contract.

for eg: alfie makes 5.5M this, then 9M next, but the way his contract works, over the entire span of it, he’s only a 4.5M cap hit. that’s actually reasonable for a guy like him…

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

except

that he’s getting up there in years and although he’s been quite the player, do you think a team would take a risk on him now?

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

well...

we’re paying blake pretty much the same amount, and as much as i hate alfie, he’s better than blake.

my biggest worry would be durability. his contract was to ensure he retires a sen, so good for them. his last year he only makes like $1M

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

well yeah

but I think it’s obvious that Alfie won’t be going anywhere. Neitehr will Blakey, but at least there’s no letter on his chest and Burke has no sentimental attachment to him, so he could be buried in the minors if need be.

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Attn: Brian Burke

I love it when you bury things in the minors.

Regards,

Mabel

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, I guess that makes sense

Thanks for the ’splanation.

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

pleasure's all mine

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I have no doubt that it is...

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

true, but that kinda takes him out of the running for small market semi sucky teams like Columbus or Nashville that may want a playoff push now

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

it's still

way too much money for what he brings to the table.
I take it his contract is front-loaded then – when does the salary get below his cap hit?

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

2012

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

ouch

that’s a lot of years of sens suckiness to come…

by Karina on Jan 5, 2009 1:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

ya...

i’ve said it before. i secretly like mike fisher, but not at that cost. that’s like handzus in LA. way too much money for a checking forward. if Fisher had a little more offensive upside, he’d almost be worth it, but he’s a glorified 3rd liner playing 2nd line center…

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I have similar feelings about Volchenkov, dude is a warrior.
I have no idea what his salary or cap hit are though

Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 5, 2009 1:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

he's around $2M i believe...

absolutely worth it. he’d be a steal. he’s got top2 potential as a shut down d man. i secretly like him as well…shhh don’t tell anybody

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Ummmm

you ‘secretly’ like a lot of Sens. What’s up with that? Don’t you know the Leafs have a better record than them over the past year?

I'm not jaded, I'm just realistic.

by Mabel on Jan 5, 2009 1:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

they have a few decent players...

hidden behind their sucky top line guys. i can appreciate a good hockey player, regardless the team.

i’m not saying they should win the cup or anything, i’m actually saying that if they put more focus on good players like fisher (the guy’s a saint, seriously, he’d be a way better captain than alfie..) i’d probably just hate them, and not loathe them

"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock

by blurr1974 on Jan 5, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs