Did somebody just trade another draft pick??? Remain calm.
by daoust on Jan 8, 2009 9:19 AM EST
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PrintEditor's Note: Dauost takes a look at the draft picks that have been moved by Cliff Fletcher and Brian Burke in the upcoming entry drafts. It even has a nice chart.
There's been a lot of talk lately about all those sweet, sweet draft picks the Leafs can't seem to stop trading away. It's like there's a sickness that afflicts all Leafs GMs and there's no known cure. In reading blogs and forums though, it's pretty clear no one really seems to know what's been gained or lost in the post-JFJ era, so I thought I'd take a stab at sorting it out myself. Is this a throwback to the long ago days of trading away multiple picks for aging vets like Owen Nolan, Brian Leetch, and Vesa Toskala (ok, that wasn't so long ago)? Or was old Cliffy more prudent than he's getting credit for? I wonder...
The chart below shows all of the transactions (I think) since JFJ was fired, but here's a summary of what picks were gained and lost in the 2008-2010 drafts...
2008 draft --- 3 picks in - 2 out = up 1 for 2008 (2nd, used for Jimmy Hayes)
2009 draft --- 1 pick in - 2 out = down 1 for 2009 (2nd, used to upgrade to Schenn) NOTE: 4th round pick in 09 was also traded away as part of the Toskala trade (along with the 1st and 2nd in 07 --- well played JFJ).
2010 draft --- 0 in - 3 out = down 3 for 2010 (2nd, Grabovski trade; 4th, McCabe trade; Conditional 6th, May trade)
OVERALL --- 4 picks in, 7 out --- down 3 for 2008-2010 (down 2 on Cliff's watch, 1 on Burke's)
So 'net-net', Cliff cost us 2 draft picks. He got us apparent duds Hollweg and Mayers, but he also moved up to draft Schenn, got a solid young prospect in Grabovski, got rid of McCabe's monstrosity of a contract while bringing in a reasonable replacement, and got rid of a lot of the dead weight / dressing room problems. Good job? Bad job? Discuss.
The May trade is a bit of a head-scratcher, but probably irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. I suspect Burke just didn't want to watch a bunch of lightweights for the rest of the season. I can't blame him really.
| Picks received | Picks given away | ||||||||
| Toronto traded | Toronto Received | 2008 | 2009 | 2010 | Total | 2008 | 2009 | 2010 | Total |
| Hal Gill | 2008 2nd; 2009 5th | 2nd | 5th | 2 | 0 | ||||
| Wade Belak | 2008 5th | 5th | 1 | 0 | |||||
| Chad Kilger | 2008 3rd | 3rd | 1 | 0 | |||||
| 2008 3rd (from fla) | Jamal Mayers | 0 | 3rd | 1 | |||||
| 2009 5th (from pitt) | Ryan Hollweg | 0 | 5th | 1 | |||||
| 2008 3rd, 2009 2rd, | Luke Schenn | 0 | 3rd | 2nd | 2 | ||||
| Bryan McCabe; 2010 4th | Mike VanRyn | 0 | 4th | 1 | |||||
| Greg Pateryn; 2010 2nd | Mikhail Grabovski | 0 | 2nd | 1 | |||||
| Carla Cola, Alex Steen | Lee Stempniak | 0 | 0 | ||||||
| Conditional 2010 6th | Brad May | 0 | 6th | 1 | |||||
| 3 | 1 | 0 | 4 | 2 | 2 | 3 | 7 | ||
Notes:
Toronto used the 5th pick from the Belak trade to pick Jerome Flaake.
The Islanders had an option in the Schenn Trade: Toronto's 2nd in 08 + 3rd in 09, or their 3rd in 08 + 2nd in 09. They chose the latter.
For the purposes of the chart, i didn't include the swap of 1st round picks in the 08 draft.
PensionPlanPuppets.com is a fan community that allows members to post their own thoughts and opinions on the Toronto Maple Leafs and hockey in general. These views and thoughts may not be shared by the editor of PensionPlanPuppets.com.
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another footnote...
JFJ had previously traded our 2008 2nd round pick for Phoenix’s 2008 5th round pick in the Brendan Bell-Yanic Perreault swap…
I really like this graphic and would love to see one that covers all of the moves JFJ made (or not to pile on any work a continuum of sorts that shows/compares/illustrates the tenures of Quinn to JFJ to Fletcher).
I think it would be surprising to see just how many picks were moved out of town and how few player for player swaps were made during JFJ’s five years as GM.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
I did this one pretty quickly just to cover the post-JFJ era, but plans are already in the works for a more elaborate tracker that goes back to the Quinn era. I’m a bit of a spreadsheet nerd, I’m surprised I’ve waited this long to put this together actually. I’ll be sure to share when my masterpiece is completed…
Great to hear
Nice post. It’ll be interesting to see how Burke re-stocks the picks.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jan 8, 2009 9:20 AM EST up reply actions
I think it looks great and would love to see more.
If it’s helpful, I put together a list of draft picks traded/acquired by Quinn and JFJ exactly one year ago (what are the odds?): http://bitterleaf.blogspot.com/2007/01/draft-schmaft.html (I think the comments pointed out any missed/incorrect transactions)
I also summarized Fletcher’s moves (not including Steen/Cola for Stempniak): http://bitterleaf.blogspot.com/2008/09/cliff-fletchers-asset-management.html
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
Fancy is my middle name. If there was a way to post Excel files I could blow the fancy top off of this here blog.
Well...
You could always have a downloadable copy on 4shared or something like that so we can see your Excel wizardry.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Wow.
Rec’d.
But definitely messing things up for the rest of us with your “facts” and “evidence”.
jrwendelman
The Artist Formerly Known as "Junior", who blogs at heroesinrehab.ca/blog
"But if someone so eager to engage into fist talk, we can always meet after season end in Minsk." (Mikhail Grabovski and a well-meaning but not particularly skillful translator)
Yeah, sorry about that. I’ve definitely irked a lot of people over the years by introducing ‘facts’ into hockey discussions. I don’t know why, but I just really like them.
Did you know that your gut has more nerve endings than your brain? That’s why great men like George Bush and Stephen Colbert trust it the most.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Unfortunately
Most of them are involved in telling you “I’m hungry” or “that just gave you gas”
Leaf, the universe and everything.
or “I shouldn’t have eaten that…”
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
OK
So how’d you do the chart? That would be a useful (if not terribly time-consuming) addition to the Leaf of the Day….
Leaf, the universe and everything.
It looks like he did it in excel and then made a jpeg out of it.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
How does one do that?
I know the screen capture method, which only produces massive gif files. How do you get the jpg?
Leaf, the universe and everything.
Nope
Just read the code. That’s a table there – one of the nifty new functions made available, methinks.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
i think...
i just copied and pasted straight from excel? either that, or i copied it from excel into word, and then into here. i can’t remember to be honest… i tried a few different ways in order to make it look half-decent. i tried the ‘save as image’ route but didn’t have any luck.
I see the code so I would guess it came from Excel. Looks good either way.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Care to make another nifty chart
and then tell us poor saps how you pulled it off?
Getting nowhere. Can’t get colour, though if I cut and paste the code from your post, it works. I just can’t reproduce it.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
i’m not being coy – i really don’t know how i did it. i’ll try it again tonight while watching the game and see if i can recreate it.
Could be even running into a version problem. You have version x of excel, I have y, yours works and mine won’t.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
Could be even running into a version problem. You have version x, I have y, yours works and mine won’t.
God, the number of times I’ve been told that at the end of a date.
Seriously though, this is a great post, despite its dangerous use of facts and charts.
Lighthouse Hockey: an SB Nation New York Islanders blog with hip issues.
needs a cover letter...
did you get the memo about the TPS reports…?
gotta have a cover sheet on your TPS reports.
I’ll get you a copy of that memo
"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jan 8, 2009 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
Great post
daoust. Well done.
A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...
The real reason we got May
Is because we’re facing the Habs tonight for the first time since Cockstopolous drilled MVR from behind. My guess is, May is there to destroy him and then deal with Laracque. At least I hope there are a ton of fireworks tonight.
you May...
be on to something….
"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jan 8, 2009 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
One of the conditions of the trade is that if May doesn’t re-sign with Toronto the Leafs don’t have to give up the 6th rounder, which makes the trade that much better.
www.hockeyfights.com
interesting...
does that mean we have to offer him a contract and he reject it…?
it can’t be as simple as letting him walk gets us a player for a few months and our pick back?
"You do dat, you go to da box, you know, uh, two minutes by yourself, and you feel shame, you know, and then you get free."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jan 8, 2009 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
That would be.
The most awesome thing ever
I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it. - Dogbert
The Ducks get two things out of that trade:
- a tiny bit of cap relief from a player they’re not using, and;
- a bit of “classy” karma for letting May go and play somewhere if he’s not in their future plans
Now… what happens if the Leafs trade him at the deadline?
Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.
by Down Goes Brown on Jan 9, 2009 5:07 PM EST up reply actions
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