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Around SBN: Explaining Jeremy Lin's Early, Surprising Success

Brian Burke has the go-ahead to send any Leafs player to the minors -- essentially burying National Hockey League contracts -- without clearing it with his bosses or the board of directors of Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment Ltd.

And that could happen as soon as this week.

Chemmy Update: Nothing happened what a total shock!

blurr1974 Update: Look up poopy pants.

about 2 years ago G-gravatart_tiny blurr1974 301 comments 0 recs  | 

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So did he just get this permission, or has this been possible all season?

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 10:48 AM EST reply actions  

id imagine that he finally cleared it now, but could have at any point if he wanted to

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 10:49 AM EST up reply actions  

Interesting

A few will have to clear waivers no?

by PLAYOFFS!!!1 on Nov 24, 2009 10:48 AM EST reply actions  

The question is...

who goes down? Are we gonna see Schenn finally go down? Is Blake due for a Marlies stint? Who knows?

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 10:48 AM EST reply actions  

the thing i worry about with blake is if someone claims him on the way back up, leaving us with a 2 mil cap hit for the rest of this year and the next 2

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 10:50 AM EST up reply actions  

If we send Blake down we won’t call him up.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 10:51 AM EST up reply actions  

someone was saying that we can only bury him for one year

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 10:54 AM EST up reply actions  

how is that possible?

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 10:55 AM EST up reply actions  

no idea, something to do with the CBA or something,

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 10:56 AM EST up reply actions  

Burke said elsewhere they won’t send Blake down.

by Leaf in Habland on Nov 24, 2009 3:22 PM EST up reply actions  

yea he told steve simmons that blake is working too hard to be sent down…..

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 3:46 PM EST up reply actions  

How do the CHL rules apply to Schenn now? Last season he couldn’t have been sent to the AHL, but this season is he allowed to go to the AHL because he already spent a full year in the NHL?

If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...

by Rob Parker on Nov 24, 2009 6:12 PM EST up reply actions  

last year

he had to go to junior because of his age…

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 6:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Isn’t he still Junior eligible though? I know I’m firmly on your territory so I’m really just looking for clarification. My understanding is that Junior eligible players that are drafted from the CHL cannot go to the AHL until their normal Junior eligibility expires (i.e. overage eligibility doesn’t count). Does that rule become void if a CHL eligible player spends a full year in the NHL?

If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...

by Rob Parker on Nov 24, 2009 6:30 PM EST up reply actions  

looking for it

I’ll post something if I find it…

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 6:46 PM EST up reply actions  

here's a portion of the CBA
Section 8.7 Age 18 and 19 Players

a. During the firs two seasons next succeeding the draft of an age 18 Player, the Club he signs an SPC with must first offer him to the Club from which he was claimed before it may Loan him.

b. During the first season next succeeding the draft of an age 19 Player or a Player who reaches his 19th birthday between September 16 and December 31, inclusive, of the year of the Entry Draft, the Club he signs an SPC with must first offer him to the club from which he was claimed before it may Loan him.
 
c. During the seasons set for in (a) and (b) above, the age 18 and age 19 Player, respectively, may be Loaned to the minor league team affiliate of his club when his Junior team is no longer in competition and provided he has been listed on the Club’s minor league eligibility list.

Is Luke not 20? It seems to me that it may be his age that is prohibitive…. unless he’s 19, in which case he can’t go to the AHL, I don’t think, he’d have to go back to the Kelowna Rockets.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 6:58 PM EST up reply actions  

He turned 20 in November and is AHL eligible.

Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...

by mf37 on Nov 24, 2009 7:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Which calendar applies? Sept. 15 like a lot of the other hockey calendars, or the NHL season, or the true calendar year? Schenn would have been in his last real year of CHL eligibility this year right? I didn’t think there was any overlap between AHL and CHL eligibility except for the overage years. By Karina’s post Schenn looks to me like his CHL team would have rights of first refusal. He was 19 when this season starts and it looks to me like that’s the important factor.

If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...

by Rob Parker on Nov 24, 2009 7:55 PM EST up reply actions  

the dates for the birthday are given as between September 16 and December 31, so given that he turned 20 between those dates this year, I would agree with mf37’s assessment.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 11:34 PM EST up reply actions  

We should call the major radio and tv stations so they aren’t alarmed by the gian hamster ball rolling down Lakeshore from the ACC to the Ricoh.

Resident Capologist

by clrkaitken on Nov 24, 2009 10:49 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

@DHSpeedwagon: I wonder what changes the Leafs won’t make but will talk about making tommorow.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 10:50 AM EST reply actions  

Sorry, was this article from this week? Or was it from the pre-season, when he said the same thing? Or the summer… or last April… or when he took over…

Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.

by Down Goes Brown on Nov 24, 2009 10:50 AM EST reply actions  

See above.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 10:51 AM EST up reply actions  

well, burke was much more patient with the vets than we thought he would be, that combined witht he fact that we really didnt have anything better on the farm until now

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 10:51 AM EST up reply actions  

If we get Sopel...

you’d better enjoy Schenn while it lasts, because once Komisarek comes back, I have serious doubts Schenn will stay with the top club.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 10:53 AM EST reply actions  

I’m really against sending Schenn down.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions  

agreed, although I am not opposed to him seeing some pressbox time

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions  

it’s simply a numbers issue. Out of the 8 defensemen on the roster, he’s #7 right now. If they get Sopel, and Komisarek comes back OK, then Schenn is either in the press box or the Marlies.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions  

Brent Sopel is terrible. If we play Brent Sopel over one of our own prospects I give up.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:08 AM EST up reply actions  

Wouldn't it be embarrasing

for the supposed “face of the franchise”, the one whose face is plastered all over Leafs ads and such, to be sent down to the Marlies? Just my thoughts.

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 11:09 AM EST up reply actions  

not if he deserves it or needs it to improve, it just isnt at that point yet

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Sorry, but right now the face of the franchise is of Toskala looking up at the scoreboard after he got beat high glove side again.

Resident Capologist

by clrkaitken on Nov 24, 2009 11:11 AM EST up reply actions  

Toskala has to be an NHL player’s wet dream. A goalie who gives you glove side high constantly.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:11 AM EST up reply actions  

going glove side always makes you feel fancy

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:12 AM EST up reply actions  

What if he goes stick?

He’s fancy. He’ll go glove.

They call me Splodeybones.

by SkinnyFish on Nov 24, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions  

Especially when the goalie doesn’t even move.

Is Toskala’s sore groin the reason he can’t lift his left arm?

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions  

the groin muscles connected to the elbow

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:14 AM EST up reply actions  

guh!

Simple Human anatomy!

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by Kevin Sellathamby on Nov 24, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions  

isn't

that the point of accountability??

lets keep Schenn up in the majors and keep giving him ice time because he’s the future of the franchise?

c’mon

by PLAYOFFS!!!1 on Nov 24, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions  

they cant worry about that stuff, that stuff works itself out once the team is good

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions  

I really don’t see this happening. I can’t see Schenn riding buses with minor leaguers. If he needs to find his confidence, he’ll find it up here. OLAS is a very fine talent who is going to be a great player and hopefully a cornerstone of this franchise someday. I just don’t see him being sent down to scrap it out with minor leaguers prospects and NHL castoffs and playing in towns like Grand Rapids and Abbotsford.

At the moment, Schenn’s been looking good paired with Gunnarson.

by general borschevsky on Nov 24, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions  

That's the way it should be

None of this Schenn-XLB bullcrap. If anything, Luke would benefit more sitting in the press box for a game or two, than playing in the AHL. It’s not like the Marlies’ record is any better than ours.

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 11:39 AM EST up reply actions  

yes it is

8 7 1 with 2 OTL

That’s a lot better than our record.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 11:40 AM EST up reply actions  

schenn would probably play much better for the Marlies, But that would be more or less from the lower talent level (of his opponents) than any sort of alteration in his play. Will that give him the confidence he needs to get his groove back? Maybe, but it could shatter his mind and make it worse too

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Would Schenn's "better play" down in the minors

be as a result of his own doing, or the skill level (or lack thereof) that the AHL has. And also, if AHL time would destroy Schenn’s confidence, then (as PLAYOFFS!!!1 noted) he isn’t the player we thought he was.

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 11:45 AM EST up reply actions  

i think he is still, he is just having the much talked about softmore slump. It happens. I am willing to give him a season pass as long as he has a good game every now and then (which he has)
if he sucks next year, then ill start to worry about schenn

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions  

We’ve discussed this before, so i’ll not go into it here, but I strongly believe Leaf fans need to dampen their expectations for Schenn’s career.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 11:53 AM EST up reply actions  

well i must have missed that convo so i must ask why?

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:53 AM EST up reply actions  

Imagine

if he didn’t have a sophomore slump this season? The love-in that was last season would’ve continued.

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 11:54 AM EST up reply actions  

I don’t think his skating is good enough to be a top 4 defenseman. Obviously, his decision making has been questionable, but that can be attributed to youth. He has limited hockey IQ when it comes to offensive hockey, which severely hurts his career potential. I also don’t think he’s all that physical (at least compared to expectations of how he should play).

Basically, people shouldn’t expect more than Jason Smith out of Schenn. Which isn’t bad. But he’s not OLAS.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:00 PM EST up reply actions  

i really dont want to hear that……… schenn could very well still become olas…

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 12:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Let me add that I would LOVE to be wrong about Schenn.

But I just don’t see it.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Schenn has proven time and time again that he can physically dominate a game. So far his play this season has been the anomaly.
His offensive game, while not game breaking has also proven half decent in the past, He can make a good first pass and has shown the ability to truck through the neutral zone with the puck and dish to a streaking winger.
He will never be the fleetest of skaters but his skating again, isnt as poor as people keep saying.
I don’t see any problem with thinking he could be another Adam Foote or Robin Regher.
His poor play doesnt seem based off of any certain lack of skill rather than bad decision making and over thinking the plays.

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:04 PM EST up reply actions  

funny thing about that

Jason Smith was a #2 defenseman in Edmonton for a looooooooong time. He was also Captain.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions  

indeed, the Leafs could do much worse than to have a prime Jason Smith on their back end

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Am not saying Schenn will be massive bust.

Am saying Schenn will not be OLAS.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:22 PM EST up reply actions  

I just don't see Schenn as an All-Star caliber player.

Again, it’s just my opinion.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:11 PM EST up reply actions  

defensive defensmen are rarely ever considered all stars

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:11 PM EST up reply actions  

defensive defensmen to make the All-Star game since 2003:

Komisarek
Robidas
Jovanovski
Norstrom
Boynton
Brewer

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:20 PM EST up reply actions  

uhm

Jovo is not a defensive defenseman.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 12:23 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m curious.

How many of them were under-23 when they made the All-Star game?

"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into Iraq"
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by article1 on Nov 24, 2009 12:25 PM EST up reply actions  

what does it matter?

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:34 PM EST up reply actions  

that 20 years old might be a little to early to make any decisions about lukes ceiling

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:36 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Bingo.

Gold star for you.

"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into Iraq"
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by article1 on Nov 24, 2009 12:37 PM EST up reply actions  

last time I checked, just about all of the talk on this website was speculative anyways.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:39 PM EST up reply actions  

of course it is, and we are just attempting to back up our view on the topic, thus is the basis of debate.

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:40 PM EST up reply actions  

well, I disagree. I think Luke has shown enough to make me think he won’t be a stud defensman.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions  

this season? or did you see it last season too?

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:58 PM EST up reply actions  

last season too. He’s definitely playing worse this year, but I’ll admit I had some major questions about his game last year too.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 1:01 PM EST up reply actions  

see, from a mental mistake and maturity stand point I get where you are coming from. But he has all the skill and tools to be a cornerstone defensive player for the leafs

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:11 PM EST up reply actions  

here’s the problem with that argument.

almost all the guys at this level have talent. John Mitchell is a good example of a guy with all of the tools. But he can’t put it all together. The mental side of the game is just as important as the physical. I’m not sure if Schenn has the hockey IQ to be a cornerstone defenseman.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions  

i am, he showed the IQ last year, and has at times shown it this year. He is just over thinking everything, he is making the right moves, just 2 seconds too late

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:25 PM EST up reply actions  

wow

birky you should be a GM or scout with such conviction that you can tell that a 20yr old 2nd year defenseman is not going to be a stud defenseman. I wonder if you know that it wont be another 5-7 years at least BEFORE this KID will reach his peak. Defense is one of the hardest positions to play and the fact that he is playing it at this young age speaks volumes. He may not develop as quickly as you may wish but to me as long as he keeps developing and be a solid defenseman on the back end there really isn’t much more I would want from him. Everyone has a role and I think the role he will play will be a key one, when this team becomes a contender.

"There's been four different Cup winners the last four years, and I got one of them (Anaheim) and it was a fighting team. We're playing it that way regardless." - B. Burke, Toronto Maple Leafs GM

by BlueBuds on Nov 24, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions  

It's been always stated

that we should be patient with our prospects. We should take that approach with Mr. Schenn.

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions  

I think you’re wrong.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Fair Enough

We’ll know in 10 years.

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by PPP on Nov 24, 2009 1:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Honestly

if Luke hadn’t had his little sophomore slump, would we even be doubting the Leafs drafting Schenn?

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Nope

But maybe the slump is his new ceiling? It’s early.

Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.

by PPP on Nov 24, 2009 1:25 PM EST up reply actions  

i agree with patience. the process of turning the leafs around is going to take a long time, and guys like schenn will be a part of it in a big way if they do this properly and not freak out and start getting rid of all our young players

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

It's sad

that some Leaf fans can’t practice what they preach (patience with Schenn and other young prospects).

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Patience is everything

How else do the Devils and Red Wings do it with late 1sts and random 6th or 7th rounders?

Space Weed Says Telling it like it is without a care about the mainstream's feelings
"DO NOT get stuck behind Kyle Wellwood in the buffet line. This isn't really etiquette, but it will prevent you from starving to death"- Down Goes Brown on Etiquette for Jason Spezza's wedding

by Kevin Sellathamby on Nov 24, 2009 1:36 PM EST up reply actions  

also Komi doesnt count because of the vote-o-matic Habs fans

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Things wrong with that list

1)Komisarek was voted in by ass clowns Habs Fans

2) Boyton is an offensive defenseman. He’s plain bad, which explains why he has such low point totals

3) Robidas is an offensive defenseman

4) Like Karina said, Jovo’s an offensive player

5) Norstrom had a decent offensive year, a career best, and So did Brewer

Space Weed Says Telling it like it is without a care about the mainstream's feelings
"DO NOT get stuck behind Kyle Wellwood in the buffet line. This isn't really etiquette, but it will prevent you from starving to death"- Down Goes Brown on Etiquette for Jason Spezza's wedding

by Kevin Sellathamby on Nov 24, 2009 1:08 PM EST up reply actions  

DUN DUN DUUUUUUN

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 10:56 AM EST reply actions  

@DHSpeedwagon: I wonder what changes the Leafs won’t make but will talk about making tommorow.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 10:56 AM EST up reply actions  

I don’t hold not making changes against Burke, it’s hard to make meaningful transactions in the cap era. I just wish he’d shut the fuck up about it.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

DANAAAAAAAAAAAA

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

lol

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Burke says in the article that he doesn’t pay attention to what is said in the media at all, that he is too concerned with running the team to listen to what the media is saying. I found that a little hard to swallow. Surely he keeps track of some of what the media is saying about the Leafs! Then a bit further down he talks about reading stories about he should be firing Ron Wilson by now. Ahhhhh there we go. He does read what the media has to say about the Leafs!

-Graham-

by CanadianMaple09 on Nov 24, 2009 11:00 AM EST reply actions  

sure he reads it, but it doesnt influence his decision on anything

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:03 AM EST up reply actions  

The interesting thing is the way the Islanders have rebuilt. They’ve iced terrible squads, kept their first rounders, signed “project” UFAs to short deals WITHOUT NMC/NTCs and traded those UFAs at the deadline for picks.

That has to be the only option available to us at this point.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:04 AM EST reply actions  

so, we need to acquire doug weight and bill guerin?

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:05 AM EST up reply actions  

A. They’re better than any of our players.

B. Yes.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:05 AM EST up reply actions  

hmmm…. so, do we need to sign some vets that are currently UFA or make a trade for a couple?

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions  

No trades. Are you paying attention?

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions  

yes, so where do we get these vets that other teams will trade for

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:08 AM EST up reply actions  

UFAs

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:08 AM EST up reply actions  

UFAs.

Olli Jokinen is my current bet. Sign him to a two year deal cheap with no NMC/NTC. Give him power play time with Kessel and huge minutes to inflate his numbers and move him as soon as possible for anything.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:09 AM EST up reply actions  

oh, you mean next year. sorry, i thought you were saying try that this year.

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:11 AM EST up reply actions  

No. Giving up assets to get those players is stupid.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:12 AM EST up reply actions  

right, which is exactly what we want other teams to do for us when we sign them

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions  

You’ve got it. Welcome aboard.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions  

i see. well, that would be pretty sweet

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:14 AM EST up reply actions  

Jokinen is the antithesis of everything you’re trying to accomplish with this plan.

He won’t sign a 2 year deal.
He has played 6 playoff games in his career, and largely sucked in them.
He won’t be in a hurry to sign for a team that isn’t a contender.
He isn’t nearly the class of veteran leader Guerin or Weight are.

Resident Capologist

by clrkaitken on Nov 24, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions  

and his options will be pretty limited next season me thinks

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:15 AM EST up reply actions  

plus, burke is pretty convincing when it comes to UFAs. not many people thought Komi and Beauchemin would come here either

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions  

MARLEAU!

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions  

Marleau would be sweet

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:17 AM EST up reply actions  

How much would you pay for him though?

by JP Nikota on Nov 24, 2009 11:17 AM EST up reply actions  

6 mill for 5 years

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:17 AM EST up reply actions  

he will probably get 6-6.5

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:17 AM EST up reply actions  

Marleau + Wilson = Fail

Coming from a guy who spent years at the Shark Tank and who heard the same word of mouth.

by smashmouthhockey on Nov 24, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions  

marleau has been quoted as saying there is no issue and he would play for wilson again

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:24 AM EST up reply actions  

Marleau would be here long after Wilson is gone, i would be very surprised if WIlson lasts out next season

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:25 AM EST up reply actions  

barring a miraculous turnaround

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Wilson will not take this team to the promised land

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:27 AM EST up reply actions  

yea i agree… who the f can…

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:27 AM EST up reply actions  

Ron Wilson has a talented roster to work with.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:27 AM EST up reply actions  

you kidding right?

“Ron Wilson has a talented roster to work with.” I guess you’re right. It does take a special talent to shoot 61 shots (out shooting the opposition 3-1) and still lose the game. Talent!

"There's been four different Cup winners the last four years, and I got one of them (Anaheim) and it was a fighting team. We're playing it that way regardless." - B. Burke, Toronto Maple Leafs GM

by BlueBuds on Nov 24, 2009 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

No I’m serious. This is all Ron Wilson’s fault. The players around him are amazing and that we can’t win with them suggests that this is the coach’s fault.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions  

ok

good I thought you were serious. :)

"There's been four different Cup winners the last four years, and I got one of them (Anaheim) and it was a fighting team. We're playing it that way regardless." - B. Burke, Toronto Maple Leafs GM

by BlueBuds on Nov 24, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions  

The only miracles we’ll see will be more absurd goals that lose us games.

We’ve already had a puck go straight up and off a player’s head, we’re probably due for “puck bounces off netting and hits back of goalie” soon.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:27 AM EST up reply actions  

ah yes, the woznewski

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by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:29 AM EST up reply actions  

sigh alright, so what do we think is going to happen this week….?

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:29 AM EST up reply actions  

True, but if we can sign him short and run a pump and dump for a 2nd round pick or a 1st if he’s great who cares if he’s not a leader?

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:24 AM EST up reply actions  

If you don’t trade, you can’t fuck it up.

See Eff Up Exhibit A: Mike Milbury

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by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Nov 24, 2009 3:02 PM EST up reply actions  

On top of getting draft picks for free essentially the Islanders also got to have Weight and Guerin mentor their young guys like Bailey, Okposo, Tambellini, etc.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions  

They also got the providence bruins’ coach, and the pBruins are (I believe) not doing as well without him and the Islanders are winning a lot more.

Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)

by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Nov 24, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions  

first of all, have the Islanders “rebuilt”? We’re 1/4 of the way through the season following a draft where they selected 1st overall.

Second, I think building through the draft is still risky. The Islanders have had 9 top ten picks in the last 13 drafts. And they’re still rebuilding.

There are plenty of ways to build a winning hockey team. Not sure if I’d follow the Islanders blueprint in that department.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 11:18 AM EST up reply actions  

pretty much everything the islanders have done outside of Chemmys idea of signing UFAs and using them for deadline picks has been terrible, I dont think anyone is suggesting we do anything but that

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by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:20 AM EST up reply actions  

yea, i hear that

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:21 AM EST up reply actions  

Robert lang would have been perfect for that this year….

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:21 AM EST up reply actions  

They’re better than we are.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:30 AM EST up reply actions  

You know its sad but Truuueee!

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:30 AM EST up reply actions  

but saying they’re rebuilt is jumping the gun

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 11:31 AM EST up reply actions  

They’ve got a ton of young talent.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:31 AM EST up reply actions  

Yea, Okposo, Bailey, tavares, bergeheim are really good players

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:32 AM EST up reply actions  

I think the Isles are closing to competing than the Leafs are. They also have more prospects in the system.

Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...

by mf37 on Nov 24, 2009 11:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Yup.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:33 AM EST up reply actions  

wayyyyyy closer now. it seems like all the tank teams are rising to the top and a whole new batch of tank teams are going to start forming a line at the bottom

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:34 AM EST up reply actions  

That’s why the Leafs wilderness years under JFJ were such a waste. This team could have loaded up on picks and prospects, instead it was one step forwards, two steps back.

Post-lockout, I don’t think teams can try to rebuild and compete. It’s too big of a challenge to hold on to core talent if money is tied up in buyouts or bad UFA deals.

Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...

by mf37 on Nov 24, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions  

wait a sec

didn’t Burke take the job only once he was assured he had complete autonomy from MLSE? He didn’t have to go to them for approval for these things?

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 11:20 AM EST reply actions  

anything money related HAS to have approval, pretty much, they wont turn down anything he proposes

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:20 AM EST up reply actions  

seriously, that’s not the understanding I had, I thought he didn’t have to go to them. If he wants to make a trade, let’s say, and take on salary, he should be able to decide that moment whether or not to do it. Going to the board slows down the process and makes it likelier that someone else does that deal.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 11:22 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm pretty sure

he informs the board before hand during negotiations and the board will probably come back and give him an acceptable range for him to work with in terms of how much salary he can take/dump etc.

by PLAYOFFS!!!1 on Nov 24, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions  

Brian can do whatever he wants, but if he is going to take on money he still needs to get the paperwork signed.

the board just wont turn down anything hockey related that he does, but you still have to go through the right channels

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 11:24 AM EST up reply actions  

yea

finance related I am sure he still has to go through the board to some extent… i’m sure other GMs has to talk with the owner first about spending to a certain degree as well

by PLAYOFFS!!!1 on Nov 24, 2009 11:22 AM EST up reply actions  

And I really mean it when I say I don’t want to hear any more “we outplayed them and lost that’s a moral victory” bullshit. We’re not unlucky.

There’s that saying “The only thing all of your failures have in common is you”. This is like that. If it’s luck or bad bounces why do they always go against us? They go against us because our marginal players make stupid decisions constantly.

There are no moral victories.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:35 AM EST reply actions  

I am also sick of hearing

“We just ran into a hot goalie tonight”

Because that’s only been the case for one maybe two of the games

by PLAYOFFS!!!1 on Nov 24, 2009 11:36 AM EST up reply actions  

The Leafs are unlucky.

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PLAYOFFS!!!!1

by eyebleaf on Nov 24, 2009 11:43 AM EST up reply actions  

no, their fans are unlucky

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:44 AM EST up reply actions  

Unlucky that the MLSE board didn’t let JFJ rebuild.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:44 AM EST up reply actions  

If after the first season post-lockout JFJ had said “We don’t have the tools to compete in this NHL we need to make moves” and then immediately moved Sundin, Kaberle, McCabe, Tucker, kept our firsts for Raycroft and Toskala, held on to both Pogge and Rask jesus christ.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:45 AM EST up reply actions  

haha

scary thing is, he’s shown to have quite the eye for drafting, we could have been stocked full…

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 11:45 AM EST up reply actions  

I mean I enjoy making fun of JFJ but I think his biggest failing is that he didn’t have the guts or possibly the standing to say “We need to rebuild. Period.” and instead got railroaded by Peddie into competing.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 11:46 AM EST up reply actions  

also the invention (or the allowance of the invention) of the NTC

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:47 AM EST up reply actions  

competing, using the term loosely. But yeah, JFJ had no backbone.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 11:50 AM EST up reply actions  

Rank JFJ’s failings:

1. No guts/spine re. MLSE Board
2. Bad pro scouting: two 1st, 2nd, 4th for Toskala and Raycroft; thinking Mark Bell could play in the NHL; almost every UFA he signed was out of the NHL within 2 years
3. Bad contracts (Belfour, Tucker, McCabe, NTCs and NMCs)
4. Mis-read the UFA market thinking that stars would become UFAs, they didn’t
5. Thinks Gordon Gecko’s hair-style is fashionable
6. Hired Paul Maurice
7. Says he stands by his record (barely .500, one post-season appearance)
8. Missed trading too many players at their peak
9. Went in too many directions at once – wasn’t a buyer, wasn’t a seller (wasn’t much of a GM)
10. Didn’t surround himself with savvy hockey men.

Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...

by mf37 on Nov 24, 2009 11:53 AM EST up reply actions  

6, 9, 10, 2, 6 again, 4, 1, 7, 3, 8, 9 again, 10 again, 2 again, 6 a third time, 5

Resident Capologist

by clrkaitken on Nov 24, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions  

and yet here we are

pondering why in hell Burke hasn’t dealt Kaberle yet

by Peter de Chatham on Nov 24, 2009 1:33 PM EST up reply actions  

NTC

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions  

why?

This is yet another shot season. Lets do things right for once and make small changes here and there, no big sweeping moves. The future core of this team, ie the team that will be a competing team were it ought to be at this stage, in the AHL gaining experience. Burke last year at the trade deadline stated that there are 4 stages, crawling, walking, running and sprinting. What stage do you really think we are at?

"There's been four different Cup winners the last four years, and I got one of them (Anaheim) and it was a fighting team. We're playing it that way regardless." - B. Burke, Toronto Maple Leafs GM

by BlueBuds on Nov 24, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions  

When it was suggested that Jason Blake doesn’t exactly pay his own way with his meagre goal-scoring numbers and that he would be a candidate to be sent packing, Burke said: “Does anyone on this team work harder than Jason Blake? There has to be an element of fairness in this.”

My reaction to this quote is sort of like this dialogue from National Lampoon’s Christmas Vacation when Clark is trying to get the christmas lights to work to show his family.

- But he worked really hard, Grandpa.
- So do washing machines!

leaf fan stuck in ottawa, a localized black hole that will suck everything in that area to oblivion.

by stucky on Nov 24, 2009 11:48 AM EST reply actions  

showing effort in failure is admirable, to a degree, because it is still failure

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:50 AM EST up reply actions  

if you send someone who’s hardworking down while you have passengers, what does that say to the team?

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Dont suck like Jason Blake

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 11:52 AM EST up reply actions  

But that’s the thing – who would constitute a passenger?

This team works its ass off. It’s just not talented enough. It’s that simple.

Resident Capologist

by clrkaitken on Nov 24, 2009 11:52 AM EST up reply actions  

it's true

gah, I’m glad I am not a GM

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 11:53 AM EST up reply actions  

For me, at some point hard work is not enough. You hear coaches say it all the time… we have to not only work hard, but work smart. I’m not convinced Blake works hard consistently, but one thing I KNOW for sure is that he almost never works smart.

And really, I can’t think of a single forward I’d like to be rid of ahead of Blake. Others like Stajan, Mitchell, Wallin and so on are clearly flawed and not playing well overall, but they do have some value and do some things reasonably well. I can’t think of a single reason why it’s worth having Blake on this team… especially for a $4M freaking cap hit, holy crap on a cracker!

leaf fan stuck in ottawa, a localized black hole that will suck everything in that area to oblivion.

by stucky on Nov 24, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions  

Blake will never stop until that wraparound of his goes in

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 12:02 PM EST up reply actions  

think we can get WAC to change her name to wraparound Blake?

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:03 PM EST up reply actions  

What did WAC ever do to you?

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by clrkaitken on Nov 24, 2009 12:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Think he was trying to make a joke

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by Kevin Sellathamby on Nov 24, 2009 1:13 PM EST up reply actions  

So was I

Resident Capologist

by clrkaitken on Nov 24, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Start with Blake. I’m tired of watching him be terrible all the time. Presumably his backpack contains a limitless supply of suckitude.

He can bunk with Toskala while he’s there.

If we get lucky, someone will – literally – throw them under the bus before they get on it.

"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into Iraq"
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by article1 on Nov 24, 2009 12:10 PM EST reply actions  

from Jonas640
Vesa Toskala and John Mitchell placed on injured reserve.

I guess Vesa’s worse than we thought.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 12:29 PM EST reply actions  

hmmm
Joey Mac attack!

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Thank Christ

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

There’s only one possible course of treatment.

AMPUTATION!!!1

"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into Iraq"
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by article1 on Nov 24, 2009 12:32 PM EST up reply actions  

That means both are out a minimum of 7 days.

Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...

by mf37 on Nov 24, 2009 12:34 PM EST up reply actions  

and any call-ups will have to go back down once they come off of IR, like Joey Mac

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 12:35 PM EST up reply actions  

Not if they cut Vesa’s head off.

"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into Iraq"
- Major Mike Shearer

by article1 on Nov 24, 2009 12:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Leafs finally make big move

Jay Rosehill on waivers.

Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...

by mf37 on Nov 24, 2009 12:35 PM EST reply actions  

MY WORLD IS ROCKED

also why/? he wasnt exempt?

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:37 PM EST up reply actions  

He’s already playing for the Marlies. What is going on? He played for the Marlies on 11/22.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 12:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh, his 14 day conditioning stint ended. Who cares.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions  

I presume it’s re-entry waivers.

Although I would think he’s waiver exempt. He’s 24 years old, looks to have signed his pro contract in 2005-06 and has only played in 6 NHL games.

That said, the waiver rules in the CBA couldn’t be muddier.

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by mf37 on Nov 24, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Nope. His two week conditioning stint is up.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 12:43 PM EST up reply actions  

HUGE MOVE!

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 12:44 PM EST up reply actions  

@DHSpeedwagon: I wonder what changes the Leafs won’t make but will talk about making tommorow.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 12:48 PM EST up reply actions  

WOOHOOOOOO
DarrenDreger Christian Hanson expected to be called up by Leafs.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 1:03 PM EST reply actions  

He can’t play tomorrow if he gets called up now unless the paperwork was already filed.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:06 PM EST up reply actions  

meh

although I’m a bit scared, we all saw him play in t he NHL last year, do we really think he’ll make much of a difference?

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 1:07 PM EST up reply actions  

either way, its SOMETHING

ye of little faith

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:07 PM EST up reply actions  

STUFF IS KINDA HAPPENING!

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:08 PM EST up reply actions  

according to dummy nuts on HC it was Kessels fault for the OT goal last night.

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:07 PM EST reply actions  

Trade Updates Via ESPN

—-Hockey Leaks tweets that the Leafs will send Jiri Tlusty to Chicago for Sopel and a second-round pick — Chicago’s contributions to the deal were seconded by a report on Hockey Night in America (via the Daily Herald).

—-Also, the Hawks are talking to the Toronto Maple Leafs deal about dealing Brent Sopel, but the Leafs appear to be strong-arming the Hawks into giving up a higher draft pick than they want. So before a Barker deal [to the Sens] is struck, the Hawks might want to see how much they have to give up to dump Sopel.

—-The Leafs lost a first and second round pick in 2010 and a first rounder in 2011 when they traded for Phil Kessel, and since the Leafs can take on salary, they may be looking to trade take on big contracts to stockpile some draft picks, the Toronto Star writes.

So why does Burke want draft picks so badly? Well, if the Maple Leafs want to sign, say, Bobby Ryan to an offer sheet, they must have a first- and third-round pick to give away. So getting draft picks might be part of a bigger ploy to steal some restricted free agents from cash-strapped teams in the offseason.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 1:11 PM EST reply actions  

-Tlusty for Sopel and a second is a shit deal for the leafs,
the leafs need THEIR OWN picks to get RFAs

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:13 PM EST up reply actions  

the article linked to in this fan shot says the Chicago talks have died.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Nov 24, 2009 1:13 PM EST up reply actions  

I’ll kill myself if we ship TLUSTY for a second round pick and bad salary.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:15 PM EST up reply actions  

THIS

Yesterday is dead, but not my memory.

by daoust on Nov 24, 2009 1:20 PM EST up reply actions  

That might be enough for me to legitimately give up hockey.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed, the only way I would be happy with this deal is if Chicago’s first was coming our way.

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions  

Even then Chicago’s first is going to be #25. We could probably wrangle up a high second more easily than giving up Tlusty and taking Sopel.

If that’s Chicago’s offer talks probably ended when Burke hung up the phone and didn’t waste any more time.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

What if the deal was something similar to Sopel + Beach + a pick for Tlusty + something?

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Completely different

And never going to happen. Beach has 19 goals in 21 games or something ridiculous like that.

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by PPP on Nov 24, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

It could happen depending on what the extra something was we were giving up. Tlusty is still considered a possible top 6 guy and Beach supposedly has “attitude problems”.

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions  

so does Kessel

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions  

You win this round Jared.

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions  

yeah, beach isnt coming back for anything but a Kaberle Campbell swap

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions  

OK let me change it a little then.

Sopel + Beach + 1st for Kaberle + Tlusty

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Did Tlusty not pan out or something?

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Didn’t you see Birky’s argument re: Schenn?

A prospect has till the age of 20 to prove they belong in the NHl.

Resident Capologist

by clrkaitken on Nov 24, 2009 1:29 PM EST up reply actions  

you know, if you read my argument, I never said he wasn’t an NHL caliber player. All I said was people should taper their expectations for his career.

by birky on Nov 24, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions  

considering teams were willing to give up top 5 picks in the draft last year for schenn proves that the entire NHL feels schenn will be a stud

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:33 PM EST up reply actions  

I feel like repating myself...

but honestly, had Schenn not had his sophomore slump and was as consistent as he was last season, would we even be mulling over the fact that Luke wasn’t worth it?

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions  

You always feel like repeating yourself.

I agreed with what you said about Schenn the last 157,894 times you said it.

leaf fan stuck in ottawa, a localized black hole that will suck everything in that area to oblivion.

by stucky on Nov 24, 2009 1:37 PM EST up reply actions  

true

and consider that Tlusty has yet to play a full season in the NHL

by Peter de Chatham on Nov 24, 2009 1:39 PM EST up reply actions  

One time Tlusty scored a goal using only his ass. Think about how dangerous of a player he must be if he scores without using his stick, seeing the puck or knowing what’s going on.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions  

not just any goal, his FIRST nhl goal

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

he had 2 that game, against pitt

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:42 PM EST up reply actions  

And after that he scored on a lightning shot on a partial breakaway because he felt scoring using only his ass was too embarassing for the goalie.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh

how about that time Tlusty scored on a penalty shot by fanning on said shot? That was crazy.

by Marc Pilgrim on Nov 24, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

curiously

that’s not what I remember Tlusty the most for…

by Peter de Chatham on Nov 24, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m surprised things like that don’t happen more. Kid’s from eastern europe, 19 and in a new city where he doesn’t know anyone.

He makes close to a million dollars a year.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:44 PM EST up reply actions  

yeah..

Anyway, my point about Tlusty is that he’s suffered all that embarassment so he’d probably put up with anything from the boo birds at the ACC. Just kidding, sort of.

Look, we’ve given Schenn two full seasons to play with solid minutes and he plays like crap. Why not try giving Tlusty 2nd line minutes. Or maybe moving him to centre and do the playmaker thing for Kessel?

by Peter de Chatham on Nov 24, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions  

Schenn’s played 92 NHL games.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:53 PM EST up reply actions  

sorry

this season seems to be dragging on for some reason in my mind

by Peter de Chatham on Nov 24, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions  

but anyway, can Tlusty be tried out as a setup man for Kessel?

by Peter de Chatham on Nov 24, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Tlusty is more of a sniper than a play maker
If they are going to bring up a playmaker for him they would probably try Bozak or even Hamilton

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:59 PM EST up reply actions  

put hanson in front of the net with grabo and blake, keep kessel stajan and poni together

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 2:01 PM EST up reply actions  

in his article Steve from hockeyanalysis classifies him as a playmaker

I don’t think Bozak is ready for a callup

by Peter de Chatham on Nov 24, 2009 2:02 PM EST up reply actions  

in NHL 10 he is a sniper :p

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 2:03 PM EST up reply actions  

hehe

Actually, that’s my favourite of Steve’s articles this year. He’s right, the Leafs need a balanced line, and Kessel badly needs a good setup man.

I’m no hockey expert by any means, but Tlusty’s stats from last year are 25 goals, 41 assists.

by Peter de Chatham on Nov 24, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions  

im just going by what ive seen from him

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 2:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Who knows. That’s the gamble.

I like Tlusty, but at this point in time him and Stefanovich would be the two prospects I would be most willing to give up. Stefanovich I assume probably doesn’t have too much value at the moment.

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Neat let’s give up a young cheap prospect like Stefanovich while he has no value. Having him play in the QMJHL is killing us.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions  

he should be with the Marlies, but he decided not to give a fuck when he was there

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions  

I wasn’t a fan of Stefanovich in the pre season. Just gonna come out and say it.

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:32 PM EST up reply actions  

doesnt mean he wont evolve into an NHL player

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:32 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree he could, but that’s sort of the point isn’t it? Is it worth trading a prospect that could pan out in a few years into a good player for a prospect who already is a pretty good player but might not have the same ceiling as your prospect?

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions  

what makes you think anyone else even wants stefanovich? the guy is an overager in the Q

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions  

Stefanovich I assume probably doesn’t have too much value at the moment.

From my post earlier.

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Which is why we drafted him in the FIFTH ROUND despite him being ranked as a first rounder before his draft.

His issues aren’t a lack of talent.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:33 PM EST up reply actions  

yup, I am unsure he will ever put it all together though

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions  

FIFTH ROUND.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions  

oh I am not saying he was a waste of a pick or anything, but I don’t think I can be faulted for wanting him to use his fucking god given talent

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:36 PM EST up reply actions  

That’s what I was trying to get at, I fully understand that Stefanovich has all the talent to be a big player in the NHL, but the question is will he become that player?

It’s risk vs. reward and if I could get a guy like Beach or a rough equivalent of him from somewhere else for him, I would probably do it.

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Sure

But you won’t. So let him play his overager in the Q, he gets another camp next year, he finds motivation in the AHL, maybe a year or two, and then he makes the Leafs.

Or he doesn’t. But at this point his value’s nil.

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by PPP on Nov 24, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions  

I completely agree with this statement. My point was just that if we could use him to get something good why not?

by Huey2k2 on Nov 24, 2009 1:39 PM EST up reply actions  

if someone will take him in a deal that makes the leafs better in place of Tlusty or who ever, he is probably gone

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions  

thank god chemmy is here to straighten everyone out, common sense is getting lost amongst the panic

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:32 PM EST up reply actions  

still giving up too much for the leafs, a salary dump, a prospect a VERY high first for Kabby and Tlusty? no thanks

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:29 PM EST up reply actions  

I’d want a higher first and a better prospect than Beach for Kaberle alone. Not going to swap Tlusty for a 2nd round pick.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions  

mmmhmmm

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions  

yea seriously, how the fuck would that solve any problem? Tlusty is one of the few players we have that are worth keeping around, fuck sopels contract and the 55th pick.

chicago better give us a good prospect, a 2nd and sopel for one of our guys on an expiring contract

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Tlusty is being sheltered from all this shit in the AHL. He’ll come up when this season is long over and his play makes it an absolute no brainer.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions  

yeah, if the leafs were playing half decent, he probably would have gotten more than a 2 game look

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions  

DING DING DING

And that, in a nutshell, is why the veterans aren’t all getting dumped today for the kids.

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by PPP on Nov 24, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t really want Hanson to come up. Bring up Hamilton or Foster or someone who doesn’t seem like a lock to make the team next year.

If Hamilton or Foster get eaten alive at the ACC and we throw them in the trash fine.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:36 PM EST up reply actions  

finally someone said it, throwing all the kids into this shitty mess wont do them any good down the road i dont think

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions  

“Leafs kid line of Bozak Hanson and Stalberg don’t score, Leafs lose. Kids probably overrated.”

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

that will be front page everyday

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

If we’re going to struggle, we’re going to struggle with kids in the lineup.

Burke.

by general borschevsky on Nov 24, 2009 1:50 PM EST up reply actions  

there are two types of struggling,
the kind you have when you have a twisted ankle and are forcing yourself up stairs
and the kind that is a fish in the bottom of your boat struggling to swim through the air

i think he was talking about the first one

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:53 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

rec’d

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Teams need to have their own picks as compensation to tender an RFA offer sheet. Burke will have to re-acquire any picks he’s traded away before they can go after Ryan.

Hawks need salary that’s expiring to make tag-up room. I don’t know that Tlusty’s RFA status counts and a $900K cap hit isn’t going to be enough for CHI.

Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...

by mf37 on Nov 24, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions  

Also we’d trade what we consider an “A” prospect for bad salary and a 2nd that’ll be around pick #55. We couldn’t get a better second than Chicago’s for Tlusty?

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Trading Tlusty to Carolina for their 3rd would net us almost the same return with no bad salary attached.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Also you need your own draft picks to offer sheet a player.

We’re not getting Bobby Ryan.

We’re not going to acquire firsts to get him because that doesn’t work.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions  

ESPN is embarrassing themselves.

Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.

by PPP on Nov 24, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah.

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by Chemmy on Nov 24, 2009 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Is ESPN really quoting Hockey Leaks? That’s fucking pathetic. I’ve heard that they are a couple of uni students talking absolute bullshit.

No fucking way Tlusty is going for a second AND bad salary.

Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.

by PPP on Nov 24, 2009 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

haha…poopy pants

Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That

by JaredFromLondon on Nov 24, 2009 1:16 PM EST reply actions  

an Idea that might work, but will probably fail

Assuming that Toskala can be placed on LTIR (even against his will), these might work

Look for Bad Contracts, and trade them for Picks. assuming the Leafs can dump about 3.6 mil, the Leafs could attempt to get Brian Rolston off the Devils. Sure, He’s not the same player he was when he was in minnesota, but i think the Leafs would be able to get the Devils 1st rounder (though maybe a late 20, but Burkie could trade up from there) if they send several rentals to the Devils. The Devils need to shed Salary, and Rolston’s their worst contract. The only problems with this are 1) Rolston has an NTC with the Devils, and will most likely exercise it and 2) Rolston’s cap hit is too much of a roadblock to work with ($5.062 mil/year with this year and 2 more)

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by Kevin Sellathamby on Nov 24, 2009 1:27 PM EST reply actions  

is space weed your name?

or what you are smoking.

I’m all for going off the board to get this shitshow righted. But on what planet does trading for a 37 year old who scored 15 goals last year and gets paid MORE THAN JASON BLAKE for two more years solve anything? I like the Nylander plan more than that one because at least he’s cheaper.

No offense.

Chemmy said it best. We need to turn free assets like short term UFAs into picks for the next 2 years. Sign a guy. Give him top-line PP time with Kessel. See if he can play out of his mind and pot 60 pts. Next (and this is the CRUCIAL part) DON’T sign him to a 5-year deal ourselves.

Bottom line is that we need to be acquiring players and assets that might help us be a winning team around the time we might theoretically be good. Say, 2011?

Rolston is not that. I haven’t seen many names in this thread who are.

As for trading Tlusty, if the Leafs best draft prospect of the last 3-4 years isn’t worth more than a 55th overall pick, they’re more fucked than i thought.

by pevans on Nov 24, 2009 2:59 PM EST up reply actions  

apologies

if that was overly harsh, but I get really tired of the “moral victories” talk and reading desperate proposals for change for the sake of change.

That’s JFJ-era thinking.

by pevans on Nov 24, 2009 3:08 PM EST reply actions  

something has to change, the team is dead last

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"

by Matt_Roberts on Nov 24, 2009 3:11 PM EST up reply actions  

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