Let's Talk About Pogge

Here are all four games Justin Pogge has played in the NHL:
That's an ugly stat line, but let's dig a little deeper. In his one win, Pogge ditched his shutout bid when he let in a Colby Armstrong wrister from the circle that he should have had, but was solid otherwise. In the 6-1 Minnesota Massacre, Pogge was very solid but got absolutely no help from his defensemen. That and the 5-0 Buffalo thumping Pogge played in were the two worst defensive games I've seen the Leafs play this season. The Leafs are also averaging just 0.66 goals per game in Pogge's three losses.
In last night's game the first goal was scored stick side on Pogge who was hugging his stick side post. It was a brutal giveaway by the Leafs from behind their net which doesn't excuse the fact that it's a save Pogge has to make.
Buffalo then scored on a nice cross crease passing play which should have been defended by Kubina, before Matt Ellis took a shot from the goal line ten feet out to Pogge's left which seemed to catch Pogge's pad and go in the net. Flukey goal but Pogge has to have that. It should also be noted the Frogren had a terrible turnover to give Ellis the biscuit. Shortly thereafter, it appeared Buffalo had scored again, but the goal was waived off as the referees decreed that the Sabres' player had directed it in intentionally with his elbow.
Down 3-0 after the first, Pogge was very solid in the second. He made two good pokechecks to takeaway scoring chances, stopped 13 shots and helped the Leafs kill off two penalties in the frame. Pogge then came out for the third where he made eight saves, allowing only a power play goal.
Aside from the first period of last night's game, I think Pogge has looked good behind the Leafs' terrible defense. Both of his soft goals last night came directly after the Leafs D coughed up the puck in embarassing fashion in the first period. Could it be a case of nerves? Did Pogge have a hard time getting settled for his first regular season home game at the ACC?
To be honest, I think the jury's still out on Pogge, but that's ok; he's a young kid. He still makes rookie mistakes like being too far back in the crease and letting in some dumb goals but he rebounded nicely last night in the last two periods. He also made a number of saves in the Buffalo and Minnesota blowouts that no goalie has any business making.
Let's give Pogge some time, if he settles down out there he could still be a real gem, current performance not withstanding.
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I needed to read this. I missed the second last night, so I woke up pretty down on Pogge. Hope is not dead!
by Godd Till on Feb 18, 2009 1:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Pogge has the skill set. He just needs to work out some bad habits and get on that glove hand, wear a 5lbs weight on that wrist or whatever. Every goalie lets in at least one goal every game and a half to two games, So I’m not worried bout em. Especially by a rookie with less than 10 NHL games under his belt
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by JaredFromLondon on Feb 18, 2009 1:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Interesting he's gtting the next start too
I wonder if they will make him the de facto starter before year’s end.
by Godd Till on Feb 18, 2009 1:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
And speaking of goaltending
WCH is just straight up making crap up about the Leafs being in the hunt for Backstrom at the deadline. Cause teams in a playoff chase always deal their MVP.
It did get my hopes up though, although the Leafs should just probably never trade for a goalie again.
by Godd Till on Feb 18, 2009 1:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I say for now, either focus on developing Pogge or sign a free agent goalie
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by JaredFromLondon on Feb 18, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Here are the UFA Goalie options for 2009-2010
Goalie Age Team Salary (not cap hit)
Krahn, Brent 27 DAL 0.5
Ersberg, Erik 27 LAK 0.7
Munroe, Scott 27 PHI 0.475
Sabourin, Dany 28 EDM 0.525
Anderson, Craig 28 FLA 0.575
Danis, Yann 28 NYI 0.55
Raycroft, Andrew 29 COL 0.8
Schaefer, Nolan 29 MIN 0.6
MacDonald, Joey 29 NYI 0.5
Niittymaki, Antero 29 PHI 1.375
Tellqvist, Mikael 29 PHX 0.8
Labarbera, Jason 29 VAN 0.85
Sanford, Curtis 29 VAN 0.65
Dubielewicz, Wade 30 CLB 0.5
Backstrom, Niklas 31 MIN 3.1
Denis, Marc 31 MTL 0.6
Clemmensen, Scott 31 NJD 0.5
Valiquette, Stephen 31 NYR 0.725
Biron, Martin 31 PHI 3.5
Garon, Mathieu 31 PIT 1
Boucher, Brian 32 SJS 0.65
Johnson, Brent 32 WAS 0.825
Conklin, Ty 33 DET 0.75
Fernandez, Manny 34 BOS 4.75
Weekes, Kevin 34 NJD 0.7
Gerber, Martin 34 OTT 3.7
Thomas, Tim 35 BOS 1.1
Norrena, Fredrik 35 CLB 0.9
Khabibulin, Nikolai 36 CHI 6.75
Legace, Manny 36 STL 2.5
Roloson, Dwayne 39 EDM 3
Kolzig, Olaf 39 TBL 1.5
Joseph, Curtis 42 TOR 0.7
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
by mf37 on Feb 18, 2009 1:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and who says we need one next year?
If Pogge /toskala suck it up, we have another top draft. Next year will be much of the same as this year
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by JaredFromLondon on Feb 18, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Raycroft, anyone?
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by eyebleaf on Feb 18, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
dont make me hurt you
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by JaredFromLondon on Feb 18, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
TOKARSKI
how many times must i say it?
Bitches on my stick but my name ain’t Harry Potter.
by tugboats and arson on Feb 18, 2009 3:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
wrap?
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by eyebleaf on Feb 18, 2009 4:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
we advocate him often. i don’t think either of us are very fond of him in the dolts’ jersey.
Bitches on my stick but my name ain’t Harry Potter.
by tugboats and arson on Feb 18, 2009 4:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As ridiculous as Tampa’s ownership is right now, I’m not sure they’re going to give Toka up cheaply. With the concussion concerns that Mike Smith is suffering from and the litany of goalie tryouts they’ve had this season, I think it’s a pipe dream to get Toka at a bargain.
I’m not sure what I’ll do (nothing good) if the Leafs decided to give up another high draft pick for yet another goalie with little to no credentials as a number one. Surely, this cannot happen again. Right?
Sorry ladies, don’t kill me!
Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell
by bkblades on Feb 18, 2009 4:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
why'd you have to bring up a high draft pick?
i never thought it through, i’ve just wanted to save him from the tampa system.
there’s a possibility that if we traded for him, he could play with the marlies… especially if there’s a toskala-whoever/pogge tandem next year, but that’s assuming we can’t trade toskalol.
i have no logic and make no sense.
Bitches on my stick but my name ain’t Harry Potter.
by tugboats and arson on Feb 18, 2009 4:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No Tokarski
I understand the love affair but the league is moving away from diminuitive goaltenders for a reason.
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by PPP on Feb 18, 2009 4:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Considering that Toskala has virtually negligent trade value right now, I’m on board with a Toskala-Pogge goalie by committee next season, if it doesn’t happen now.
Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell
by bkblades on Feb 18, 2009 5:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
pogge's height
doesn’t stop pucks all the time.
toka’s likeness to a spastic squirrel can, most of the time. goaltending is too damn psychological.
Bitches on my stick but my name ain’t Harry Potter.
by tugboats and arson on Feb 18, 2009 5:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It’s not like we’re going to be winning the cup this year anyway – let’s try to develop Pogge as best as we can – especially since Joseph will likely retire after this year, which means that there is a limited period of time in which he can teach Pogge – may as well use it.
by Blue and White Expat on Feb 18, 2009 1:29 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Underwhelming...
Pogge looked bloody awful on three of the four goals last night. He was too deep in his net on the first one, and the third one was a complete joke, which essentially ended the game. His rebound control on the fourth goal was Raycroftian.
Very disappointing.
He really does not look ready. Trial by fire, I guess.
Man. We suck.
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by eyebleaf on Feb 18, 2009 1:33 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I’ll say it again: the sample size here is way too small.
Pogge may turn out to be a complete bust, but there’s no harm in giving him the majority of the starts down the stretch to see what he’s capable of. Best case scenario, he makes the adjustment to the NHL game; worst case scenario, he loses every start and the Leafs chase that magically top draft pick.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
by mf37 on Feb 18, 2009 1:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I want to see him up for a 3- 4 game stretch to see if there is an improvement or a drop or just a bunch of random all over the place performances, it will tell us a lot about where he is and where he may be headed
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by JaredFromLondon on Feb 18, 2009 1:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Career
Stats-wise, Pogge has been consistent with the exception of that one year where his numbers improved significantly (also I believe its the year he made the WJHC team)… otherwise he generally hovers around the 90% save average and 2.2 to 2.5 GAA line
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by Winkle on Feb 18, 2009 1:43 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
The Magic Word
in that post is “rebound”. There were some nasty ones last night. And it’s funny what is said about the Leafs poor defensive play(which is true), but it’s never mentioned that they cleared out some junk in the slot that had Sabres looking at an empty net. I’m a cup half empty guy.
Tanking by accident?
by Haeyena on Feb 18, 2009 2:26 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I think what I was getting at there
is I think that it about evens out in the end. The scary thing about Pogge’s stats is that he is playing behind of the same crappy defense as TaskaLoL and Tosk’s numbers are better(Iknow, not over the same amount of time).
Tanking by accident?
by Haeyena on Feb 18, 2009 2:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
yeah, but as stated, those losses to minni and the sabers (the 5-0) were quite possibly the worst defensive efforts i can remember from the Leafs, so they kinda tilt
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by JaredFromLondon on Feb 18, 2009 2:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I dunno
Rebound control seems to me precisely the type of thing developing goalies learn. If he had bad positioning (although he over commits a bit – again, a youthful thing) or shitty reflexes, or Raycroft’s glove, I’d be a lot more concerned.
by Godd Till on Feb 18, 2009 3:20 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I say
Burke should make his big UFA splash grabbing Backstrom and signing him to a 5 year deal.
There. Done. Fantastic goaltender. We move on.
I think you need to draft and develop your team for the most part, but goaltending is the only aspect of your team that you can make great with one signing.
by The Muppet on Feb 18, 2009 3:29 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
look at how many goalies out of Minny have had great stats. Roloson, Fernandez, Backstrom, even Harding. Roloson did well at first in Edmonton, but that was when they had a fairly strong team. Fernandez does well in Boston, with a great defensive team in front of them. Do you think Backstrom will really do well at all in Toronto with the weak defensive team we have right now?
by Karina on Feb 18, 2009 3:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Mirtle has had a couple of good pieces of goalies that have flourished in Minny and then, if not stumbled, failed to reach those same heights at their next stop.
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by PPP on Feb 18, 2009 3:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Furthermore, Backstrom is going to command a huge salary after his performance this season. I rather the Leafs go for Harding than Backstrom to be honest. But Minnesota might be already going that route anyway.
Jason Labarbera or Erik Ersberg are good stopgap options as well, especially ones that can rotate with Toskie. I’m still convinced the Leafs are better off with alternating starts with Toskala next season and play as a tandem a la his days at San Jose.
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by bkblades on Feb 18, 2009 4:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeersbeeeeeeeeeerg
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by JaredFromLondon on Feb 18, 2009 4:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I like
the option of Ersberg as well… with Quick and Bernier, I see no place for him in LA next year.
by Karina on Feb 18, 2009 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i just like saying his name like that, its fun
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by JaredFromLondon on Feb 18, 2009 7:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes yes yes yes YES
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by Chemmy on Feb 18, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Under $5.5 a season pull the trigger.
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by Chemmy on Feb 18, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting that in all this debate, nobody mentions Jimmy Howard as a comparator.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
by mf37 on Feb 20, 2009 3:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

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