We Got Whomped On
by Chemmy on Mar 30, 2009 1:30 PM EDT
in Negative Nancy Notebook
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Wait, who's relieving who?
11 points out of eighth with six games to go, the Leafs aren't eliminated from the playoffs yet, weirdly enough. If Montreal, Buffalo and Florida lose out the season, and Ottawa loses a couple games (while beating Montreal in regulation in their head to head) Toronto only needs to go 6-0-0 against... Philly (2x), New Jersey, Buffalo, Montreal and Ottawa. Crud.
Toronto's attempt to play President's Trophy spoilers fell flat on its face Saturday night when Toronto blew multiple leads to the Bruins. At one point in the game it was 4-3 Leafs and I went into the kitchen to grab a beer and check on the oven. I came back out and it was 6-4 Boston. Great.
To observe Earth Hour, the Maple Leafs turned off their goaltending last night. - The Star
Well, that's fair I suppose. I wouldn't hang it all on Pogge though.
It was an embarrassing night for the Leafs, who played very loosely in their own end, and for rookie goaltender Justin Pogge, who was picked apart for six goals before getting the hook for Curtis Joseph less than 33 minutes in.
The Leafs defense seems to think that Justin Pogge is actually the best goaltender in the league and that when he plays they don't need to. Pogge's looked rough around the edges but he's a young kid - that's expected.
Some reporters are now calling Ponikarovsky "Mr. Saturday Night." His three-point effort came after two consecutive four-point Saturdays as he seems to have blossomed offensively since his friend Nik Antropov was dealt to the Rangers at the trade deadline. The 23 goals for Ponikarovsky is also a career high.
"Saturday nights are always exciting," he said. "Points are points but you just want to win the game."
Is anyone else imagining Ponikarovsky singing "Saturday Night's All Right For Fighting?" Sat-toooor-day, Sat-toor-daaay... Nevermind.
''We want both of our goalies to be in a position of strength,'' explained coach Claude Julien, noting that he'd like to use Fernandez again over the club's final eight regular-season games. ''That will allow Manny to find his game, and it will allow Timmy [Thomas] to get his rest.'' - Boston.com
Toronto would be in decent shape if over the course of the season either of its goalies were doing fairly average. Sigh.
IN the midst of a Steve Montador-Luke Schenn fight in the third period, TV cameras caught Leafs GM Brian Burke with a pair of binoculars trained on the combatants. The ex-Ducks GM appeared to have a slight smile on his face as he lowered the glasses.
Who wasn't smiling after that fight? Besides Steve Montador I mean. As pointed out by one of our commenters (too lazy to look you up, yell at me in the comments), the Leafs are the only team to hang five goals on the Bruins twice this year, and one of three clubs to hang five on the Bruins at all. Still think we need Tavares over more depth on the blue line and in net?
The Leafs' defensive end struggles are why the Bruins absolutely pounded them again, and at this point we have a chicken or the egg question: does our goaltending suck because of our defense, or does our defense look bad because of our goaltending? With some goal scorers rising through the ranks of the organization (Tlusty, Stefanovich, Stalberg, DiDomenico) I'm crossing my fingers for some stud d-men and a goaltending prospect in this draft and the next one.
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does our goaltending suck because of our defense, or does our defense look bad because of our goaltending?
Yes to both.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
That’s my guess too. Our defense is horrid, and here’s our top six:
Kaberle
Kubina
Finger
Van Ryn
Schenn
Frogren
I’ll assume we want to keep Schenn, and Finger’s on an unmovable contract. Is Frogren single handedly tanking the defense? Somebody’s gotta go, your thoughts please PPPers.
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I’d love to know how many games featurd both Van Ryn and Kaberle. I’d like to think that when both those guys are in the top 6, the Leafs have a much better record…
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It’s an interesting exercise but who do we have to sacrifice a calf to in order to keep Van Ryn healthy?
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Trade ’em all and let Burke sort ’em out.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Except Schenn obviously.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Schenn obviously is the keeper, once he develops his offensive game he’ll be an All-Star, I still think Kaberle is the best overall defenseman but he’ll be traded next year if the team is out of contention, Kubina frigs up defensively a lot but it’s balanced his cannon of a slap shot, Finger is solid defensively and a big hitter but still overpaid, I’ve liked what I’ve seen from Van Ryn when healthy but he’s apparently the bastard child of Samuel L. Jackson’s character in ‘Unbreakable’, White has shown flashes of being great but is fairly inconsistent defensively (anyone else think he looked really good playing the wing early in the season?), and Frogren is the new Aki Berg, useless offensively and looks like a goat on skates out there…who’s the next best prospect at D if we can’t grab Hedman?
We WILL see a parade down Yonge Street one day soon...and I WILL be very drunk.
interesting
for the most part I agree with you. I’m not sure that Kaberle’s going anywhere, ever. Nice tag on Van Ryn. White has done something that makes Wilson believe he’s a top 4, if not a top 2, defenseman, and has improved greatly, but I’m still scared of his physical limitations. I think the experiment of him with Oreskovic was interesting, but he and Kubina I like together, if Kubina plays as physically as he can. Kaberle-Van Ryn is my ideal top pairing.
I have fondness for Frogren, but I don’t think he’ll stick around after this season.
There’s Cowen, who is recovering from a broken leg, and then a russian who I’m quite unfamiliar with, both ranked pretty high for defensemen.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
White should be a forward. His size is a huge liability in front of the net and in the corners. He plays big but unfortunately he isn’t.
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Actually White would be superior as a forward. A solid two way third liner who one can see being a 15 goal guy with a decent 2nd line pp role at best and a little penalty killing. And it would be better for him to utilize that play big mentality by throwing checks in the corner, forechecking, rather than get pummelled in them and being unable to seperate a man from the front of the net
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by blindfolded tank driver on Mar 30, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
not a clue
it’s the team approach. They’re mentally not playing the game. Finger and Schenn both need to learn to CLEAR THE CREASE – god, it was like Recchi had time to set up camp and build a fire last game.
Kubina’s not playing as well as he was at the beginning of the season.
Did you forget White?!?
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 1:45 PM EDT reply actions
Maybe White’s above Frogren in the depth chart now, I dunno. Throw him and Stralman in since Kaberle and Van Ryn can’t stay healthy.
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maybe
White’s playing the most minutes on the blue line quite consistently. He’s pretty high in the depth chart, I’d say.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Pogge sucks. It would be one thing if the kid made a save once and a while, but still lost in the end, but he can’t stop anything. unless of course, he has no pressure. Wouldn’t want him to feel a need to perform, during a game that matters…
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 1:49 PM EDT reply actions
Would we be grousing as much if he had let in 2 or 3 goals instead of 6? Take out the defencemen’s errors and he played a hell of a game :)
Word around town is that deflections are very hard to stop.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
you're so right!
we should just have the d block ALL the shots. That way precious pogge can still be awesome…
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Unfortunately, Pogge’s never been awesome but when the defencemen twice stand beside Mark Recchi and watch him deflect a shot a foot from Pogge when he was squared up and ready to stop the initial shot you tend to understand.
Or when White/Grabovski turn a harmless backhand into a top-shelt snipe. Ask Don Cherry about that one ;)
White and Schenn screwed the pooch on those two deflected goals in the same way that Finger screwed up when he let the pass on the 2-on-1 get to the open man.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
ok
so EVERY game Pogge’s lost, be it NHL or AHL, has been a direct result of the D?
Last game was a laugher, and I don’t expect him to win them all, but I’d like him to look good while losing. His job is to stop the puck. He didn’t. But that’s OK, because it’s someone else’s fault. If the D did X, Y and Z, then Pogge would look awesome.
A good goalie compensates for the D’s mistakes. Pogge does not.
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
No
I said that in the last game 3 goals came on deflections on shots that Pogge had completely covered. I noticed that you don’t mention Friday night when Pogge DID look great. Coincidentally, no one on his team watched an ancient player deflect two past him nor did they do the job themselves.
Are you honestley refusing to admit that deflected shots are tough to stop moreso when the player is left unfettered in front of the net? What would you have Pogge do? Go out past the forward and stand by the hashmarks?
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
tough to stop, yes...
impossible for Pogge, also a yes.
no, stop honing in one game, take a look at his “body of work” as a whole, and tell me, in all honesty, that he’s that good.
he needs work, and lots of it, before he should ever get back in the NHL. Right now, he sucks.
As far as Friday night goes, no I didn’t mention it, because he came in on clean up, and as I’ve already stated, if he can’t handle the nerves surrounding starting a game,and he only looks good with no pressure, then he’s useless. unless, you somehow think it’s a good idea to have a goalie that can only play good when the game’s out of hand…
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions
he needs work, and lots of it, before he should ever get back in the NHL.
And that’s all we’ve been saying. He gets enough crap for the stuff he does wrong that we don’t need to pile on the mistakes of his teammates.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
and he’d probably be settling in back in the AHL if it wasnt for the GERBERSERKER suspension.
which is interesting to see who plays (or backs up) the last game of the suspension with Cujo
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
maybe
we should send Pogge to the Ed Belfour School of How To Treat Forwards In Your Crease.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I’d rather send him to the Ron Hextall school of lumberjacking
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m somewhere in the middle on Pogge. Obviously when you play for a team that is this godawful defensively right now, you’re stats are going to look absolutely abhorrent, as Pogge’s most certainly do. I would love to see him play in a game where the Leafs weren’t playing 2 or 3 rookies on the blue line. That said, he has done nothing (other than a pretty good debut against a pretty bad Atlanta team) to show me that he’s a franchise goalie. Belfour and CuJo used to steal games regularly in their prime, Toskala stole several last year, hell even Raycroft stole a few in his time, but Pogge has not come close to stealing a game in his limited appearances. Bottom line: It’s still too early to tell.
We WILL see a parade down Yonge Street one day soon...and I WILL be very drunk.
Pogge is not now, nor will he probably EVER be a franchise goalie.
He will be a good goalie in the NHL when he gets his kinks worked out. But he will never be a Roberto Luongo or Martin Brodeur
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions
And you know this how?
He’s still a kid. Why don’t we let him play more than a handful of games at this level before we toss him on the trash heap?
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I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
I am fully on the suport Pogge train, and the goalies I mentioned above (well Luongo) entered the NHL and lite shit up.
Pogge might turn into to be awesome and the best thing since sliced bread, but his glove hand may be the thing that determins how good he can get. It is his second major weakness right now after his shattered mind
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions
why
do every single one of our goalies have a weak glove hand?
Does this not speak to their coaching rather than individual weaknesses?
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions
With Raycroft, it just seemed to be pure inability, Toskala timing, Pogge keeps his too low and doesnt have the speed to get it up in time on NHL (or even AHL) shots.
coaching on positioning could help a lot. But other than Toskala, I dont think any of em will ever have a Classic eddie glove or a felix the cat snag
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions
exactly
except that…in the early going, he’s not looked good.
Again, i’m not expecting him to win every game. Quite frankly I could care less if he lost every game by 6 goals. It’s his save percentage that scares me. Good goalies have an excellent save percentage. the GAA is meaningless to me. I’d just like to see our goalie stop 9.1+ of every ten shots he faces.
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions
but then, one out of every 9 shots he faces seems to be a tip in or terrible odd man rush (based soley off memory)
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
ya, poor Pogge, he’s the only goalie to have to face fluky shots and tip ins…
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, i mean, Cujo, and Toskala are doing SO much better having to deal with the same things
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
So are....
(insert the 60+ NHL goalies in the league here)
What we do know about Toskala is he played with a bad hip and groin all season. Let’s see how he fares next season, considering he looked pretty good his first year here.
Cujo is old. End of story…
I expected Pogge to get better as the season wore on, he has not. All I ever hear is that it’s the teams fault for pulling him up/sending him down. It’s the D’s fault for not blocking one more shot/covering one more man or it’s the universe’s fault for aligning the planets in such a way on Pogge’s game nights that the gravitational pull on his glove hand is too great for him to be effective.
The one constant is Pogge.
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
What we do know about Toskala is he played with a bad hip and groin all season.
I think it’s safe to say that we have no idea what happened to Toskala. He went from “I’m fine man” to “the MRI showed nothing” to “His injuries are in his head” to “We have to operate immediately”.
I’m skeptical about that timeline.
Also, no one is saying that Pogge’s amazing if not for those dastardly teammates. What we are doing is being a bit more realistic about his performance on shots that can and should be stopped as opposed to shots that his team either puts in the net or makes it ridiculously easy for the opponent to tap in.
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yes...
the operate immediately was sketchy. i think it was more a case of Wilson not having the faith in his other options, and Toskala being able to play through the pain that drew everything out as long as it did. I hope at least….
as far as pogge goes, i have to disagree. My point is that ONCE a game (that he starts, and has some pressure on him to perform,) I’d like to see him answer that bell, and pull out an amazing stop or two. He had it in him in Atlanta, and since then he’s gotten worse. His AHL stats have been pretty brutal since that call up, with some games below 0.800 in the save percentage. that’s not what I want to see. regression is not the plan…
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions
maybe the call ups have really eaten into his confidence and he’s on the road to becoming Carey Price?
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions
at least Price had one good (regular) season in him
My hopes are more MAF in nature, thrown to the wolves, decimated but then clawing his way back up
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
but
MAF was all about his reflexes, and those reflexes never left him.
Pogge’s more of a positional goalie, without that, he just sucks.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions
well yeah, i just ment in career path
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah
I get that… I just would say: not so likely.
Pogge talk makes me depressed. I think that next year, we leave him in the minors no matter what, let him work through his issues there, he needs more time and all these call-ups are accomplishing is his ruination. If he has a good year, give him another try. In the meantime, Gerber-Toskala platoon is fine with me.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions
we should give that other AHL dude (his name escapes me) a shot ahead of Pogge next time, hopefully it will light a fire under pogges ass
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Adam Munro or Jason Reimer? Although I think Reimer is the ECHL guy who comes up for Pogge when he goes up to the Leafs.
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by blindfolded tank driver on Mar 30, 2009 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Munro
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
sure, I like the sounds of that. And maybe Munro is actually better than Pogge, and we’re all just too tied to Pogge’s gold medal than any realistic expectations based upon his play.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions
either way, we have very little to lose
well, except, you know…hockey games
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions
the gold medal is the problem. we gave up rask, because pogge was a gold medalist.
Running over terribleness in search for something positive about the Leafs. Anything? Anyone?!
by blindfolded tank driver on Mar 30, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions
and yet
in that same tournament, Rask was the best goalie…..
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Jimmy Waite was the best goalie at that tournament too.
The list of winner’s is a Who’s That? of NHL goalies.
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and to be honest, what I’ve seen of Raask in the NHL doesnt exactly have me perking my ears up either
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions
List of Canadian WJC goalies
Not too many with staying power on that list…
1995 – Dan Cloutier | Jamie Storr
1996 – Marc Denis | Jose Theodore
1997 – Marc Denis | Martin Biron
1998 – Roberto Luongo | Mathieu Garon
1999 – Roberto Luongo | Brian Finley
2000 – Maxim Oullet | Brian Finely
2001 – Maxim Oullet | Alex Auld
2002 – Pascal LeClaire | Olivier Michaud
2003 – Marc Andre Fleury | David Le Neveu
2004 – Marc Andre Fleury | Josh Harding
2005 – Jeff Glass | Rejean Beauchemin
2006 – Justin Pogge | Devan Dubnyk
2007 – Carey Price | Leland Irving
2008 – Steve Mason | Jonathon Bernier
2009 – Dustin Tokarski | Chet Pickard
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
7/14 of those starters are Price, Mason, Luongo, Leclaire, and Fleury. They may not all be allstars but that’s not a terrible bet.
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Agreed, but I’m also surprised that 25% didn’t pan out at all: Oullet, Finley, Michaud, Le Neveu, Harding, Beachemin, Glass…
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
also, Both, Price and Leclair may still yet turn out to be one season wonders, for different reasons
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Glass
I thought he was still in the Senator’s system? What happened?
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
he got passed by elliot and even sens fans stopped talking about him
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions
He’s still in their system, platooning in Binghamton. From what I’ve read, he’s not that highly regarded anymore…
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I’m jumping this down to the bottom so we have some more room.
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isn’t harding the backup in minnesota?
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by blindfolded tank driver on Mar 30, 2009 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions
no, we gave up Raask because JFJ is a moron and really wanted Raycroft.
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
who
won the Calder one year, he must be great!
Apparently he played well against the Canucks the other night. I’m still in shock.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions
even a broken clock is right twice a day
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions
oh, that’s why he traded a goalie, was for raycroft, but he kept pogge instead of rask, who was the superior goalie in the tournament but played on weaker side
Running over terribleness in search for something positive about the Leafs. Anything? Anyone?!
by blindfolded tank driver on Mar 30, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions
but who is to say that the Bruins would have traded if it was Pogge? Maybe they said we want Raask and JFJ thought it was a good deal. Hell, JFJ might have even offered them Pogge instead, but they turned it down.
Still he is a dumbass for the move
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions
oh, I am not disagreeing there. He is a moron. The fact he traded either was foolhearty, especially for at the time was supposed to be a good eye for young talent. He bricked it, we pay for it and will for a while longer. At least until Burke sorts out Pogge’s issues or finds a better long term option
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by blindfolded tank driver on Mar 30, 2009 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
The worst part of that trade, which MF37 has highlighted a few times, was that Raycroft was an RFA. The Leafs could have just offered an offer sheet if they were interested and paid the compensation which would have been a lot less than a first rounder.
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that fail was full stop fail.
Running over terribleness in search for something positive about the Leafs. Anything? Anyone?!
by blindfolded tank driver on Mar 30, 2009 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
and the first fail means trade, but really it was fail too, because that fail was so fail.
/sigh
Running over terribleness in search for something positive about the Leafs. Anything? Anyone?!
by blindfolded tank driver on Mar 30, 2009 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions
at least he got us dominic moore……
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, but Cujo and Toskala both have one thing to fall back on that Pogge does not, experience, the mechanics of both of their games are pretty much ingrained into them.
The thing is, all of them are brutal right now. Pogge should not be playing in the NHL, he shouldnt have even gotten more than 3 games. unfortunatly injuries, suspensions and Cujos 90 year old tendons have left us without an option some nights.
and you cannot argue that the leafs have been absolutly Islanders like brutal every game that Pogge has played with the exception of the Thrashers tilt
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
To observe Earth Hour, the Maple Leafs turned off their goaltending last night.
I think I’d heard this one before.
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by Down Goes Brown on Mar 30, 2009 1:57 PM EDT reply actions
Brian Burke is a funny man. Though it’s unbelievable that he through members of the team under the bus like that on a public website.
Please stop causing problems.
Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.
by Down Goes Brown on Mar 30, 2009 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s different because the Star didn’t make fun of the Bruins, too.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Mar 30, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Right on time: http://techdirt.com/articles/20090329/2229284297.shtml
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Mar 30, 2009 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
plz.
Ain't nothing but puck drops and poke checks, babydoll.
Now Princess Game Thread.
by Wrap Around Curl on Mar 30, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
In case it hasn’t been said already, does that pic look like cujo going:
Down low.. TOO SLOW!
?
Gerber power!!!1
hahaha
Yeah, it does look that way.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
A subtle rebuke of his glove hand, perhaps?
Pogge = Not particularly effective in a rebuilding effort.
Gerber power!!!1
by LeafFanInVan on Mar 30, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions
since he seems to be fully comited to the tank maybe he is teh PERFECT goalie for the rebuild
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by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Pre-build!
It’s like getting a discount at home depot because you’re telling them the lumber is going to build a school for kids who don’t read too good.
Gerber power!!!1
by LeafFanInVan on Mar 30, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s fascinating that common wisdom on this site holds that many heralded goalies are a product of the system they play in (Backstrom, Mason, LeClaire, Clemmensen in NJ) whereas in Toronto our goalies just stink. Yet, every goalie that’s played for the Leafs post-lockout has seen their sv % bounce by at least 10 to 15 percentage points when the go to a new team:
Tellqvist .895 | .908
Clemmensen .839 | .918
Belfour .892 | .902
Raycroft (!) .876 | .889
Aubin .876 | .886
The fact that the Leafs haven’t had a goalie hit a sv% of .900 since the lockout suggests to me that this might not be exclusively a goalie issue.
Is it the D? The shots against are way down, but that tells us volume, not the quality of shots against.
Is it the goalie coach? I’d love to know what their peers and former goalies think of McKichan and Hirsch as goalie coaches. With 30+ full time media covering the team, you’d think someone might seek out an interview.
Perhaps it’s a combination of goalies, coaching, situational D and poor special teams play…
As for Pogge, I have no idea if he’s the next Peter Sidorkiewicz or the next Jim Craig, but until the Leafs address the external issues surrounding their goaltenders, I don’t think it matters who’s in net.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
by mf37 on Mar 30, 2009 2:38 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
especially things related to numbers
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
That's a very rational way to look at it, mf37
You have much to teach us, despite clearly not being a member of the mainstream media.
Newly appointed Awesome/Gin Division Head
I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
I am going to go ahead and claim that as a point for my side.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Hey, this is my side! I was here first!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think so
because I endorsed it, and I’m still mad at you for your insane Daniel Craig ban.
Newly appointed Awesome/Gin Division Head
I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
It wasn’t a Daniel Craig ban it was a ban on super sexy Daniel Craig pictures in the game threads. It bogs them down if you ladies are one-upping each other and then the guys want their pictures and god knows what those degenerates will put up ;) plus, there’s Chatty Cathy that suits all of your Daniel Craig desires. Well, the 2D ones.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Hmpf
I suppose that’s not so bad. As long as I can still get my 2D Daniel Craig desires somewhere, I can deal. But I still think you need to make this up to me, as my feelings were hurt.
Newly appointed Awesome/Gin Division Head
I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
Daniel Craig is critical when the Leafs are sucking like a Dyson.
Ain't nothing but puck drops and poke checks, babydoll.
Now Princess Game Thread.
by Wrap Around Curl on Mar 30, 2009 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
puppies can only do so much
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
puppies can only do so much
Hear that PPP? Jared wants sexy Daniel Craig pics too!
Newly appointed Awesome/Gin Division Head
I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
He can want them all that he wants.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
But I want them too…. Don’t you want me happy?
Newly appointed Awesome/Gin Division Head
I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
I already gave you a way to be happy.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
You did?
How’s that? Did I miss it?
Would you be a sweetheart and remind me again? Please?
Newly appointed Awesome/Gin Division Head
I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
Oh. I was hoping for something a little more… um, nevermind.
Newly appointed Awesome/Gin Division Head
I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
Well
You want something a little more Tlusty? Is that it?
I can’t give you that over the interwebs…
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
isnt something via the interwebs the very essence of Tlusty?
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe I do
Would that be so wrong? And why can’t you give that to me over the interwebs?
Newly appointed Awesome/Gin Division Head
I will try to use this power only for good, but I make no promises.
Nothing wrong with that.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
thats why I have my own private collection
wait….. what?
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
You guys need to do more point-counterpoint stuff.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
PPP always picks the side I want and then makes me go devil’s advocate.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
That’s a blatant lie. You’re mad because it’s 2-0 for me.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
On a positive note...
even though this is Negative Nancy. Poni being separated from Antropov (at least, in a scoring line capacity) has been awesome. I was always struck by how fast Poni appeared when he wasn’t skating with Antro. Now that he’s on a line with two very fast skaters, he still can keep up, and he’s getting more chances at putting the puck in the net.
It’s been said before, but that line looks great. Quite possibly even 1st line material on another team….
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 2:59 PM EDT reply actions
It will only get better as Kulemin and Grabbo get older and more experianced
Poni always struck me as playing “down” to his line mates, or settling into a role (block the net, stand in the slot with Sundin). Now he is the elder line made and probably the best shooter and is filling that role
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
definitely.
He played third wheel to antro and sundin, and he did most of the board work.
on the third line, he played defensively responsible checker.
now, on our best line, without antro or sundin to do the scoring, he’s put in the position of speedy sniper. and he’s playing it well
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions
he still has hands of stone 90% of the time, though
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions
see my
Fanshot!
:P
He talks about now being in a leadership role, and really enjoying it. I think part of his burst is confidence. Rather than being the kid on a line of 2 much higher draft picks, he’s the veteran on a line with rookies who look to him for advice/experience.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions
and delicious cheese bourgers
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I'll wait for the 2011 debut of
Positive Penny then….
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
2011?
If we’re lucky :(
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
2011-2012
PLAYOFFS!!!!!!!!1
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Positive Penny then….
Pension Plan Pollyannas?
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
Playoffs!!!!!1!!!1
could be as soon as next year. Think if Toskala wins 10 extra games(a likelihood if he is healthy, even with is slow starts). That would put the Leafs at 95 to 99 points. Plenty of points to make 6th or 7th place. And with Gerber to back him up(yes, the best option as of 20 seconds ago), they should be able to combine for 40+ wins. Have hope little Leafers
Tanking by accident?
Definitely
Two real goaltenders would have made a massive difference this year.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Small Problem...
Here are the numbers MF37 tossed in the ring earlier.
Tellqvist .895 | .908
Clemmensen .839 | .918
Belfour .892 | .902
Raycroft (!) .876 | .889
Aubin .876 | .886
Slight problem with those stats. Tellqvist went from the Leafs to the Coyotes and his numbers actually got worse within the same season. His SV% dropped from .895 in his 1 game with the Leafs to .885 in the 30 games he played with Phoenix that same season. He ended up with a .885 save percentage in his first year in Phoenix… that’s actually a percentage point drop, not an increase.
It could be argued that 2007-08 Phoenix had superior D to the Leafs of 2005-06. Jovanovski, Morris, Ballard, Michalek, Yandle, and Boynton is probably a superior top 6 defensively to the Leafs McCabe, Kaberle, Klee, Khavanov, Berg, Colaiacovo and/or White.
As for Clemmensen, obviously New Jersey has a superior system to Toronto all around… to me that isn’t really a fair indication of the goaltender.
Belfour – same thing as Clemmensen. Florida play a much more defensively oriented game than the Leafs have in recent years. Also, you could again compare the list of above leafs to Bouwmeester, Van Ryn, Allen, Salei, Kwiatowski, and Montador. The top 4 are better defensively than the Leafs top 4. Honestly though a .902 save percentage for Belfour isn’t really that great a number.
Raycroft – His numbers were frankly abnormally atrocious last season. His numbers with Colorado this year are actually still worse than they were 2 years ago for the Leafs. I don’t honestly think he’s seeing a bump because he’s in a better situation. He’s just got more confidence and a longer leash with the Avs.
Aubin – while I admit his save % went up from .876 to .886 when he went from Toronto to LA… in the year immediately prior when he closed out the year with the Leafs he had a .924 SV%, so how does that correlate to a huge improvement just by switching teams?
Here are their CAREER save percentages with the Leafs and their save percentages with the teams immediately PRIOR to and FOLLOWING their play with Toronto.
Tellqvist – no prior NHL experience – Leafs (.891) – Phoenix (.897). Wow… a 0.6% improvement… that’s 6 more goals on every thousand shots!
Clemmensen – New Jersey (.894) – Leafs (.839) IN 3 GAMES – New Jersey (.917). I have a hard time not believing it has something to do with the Devils system.
Belfour – Dallas (.910) – Leafs (.912) – Florida (.902). I guess the Leafs might not have had the worst D and goaltending coaching? Or else Eddie just flies himself straight – makes more sense to me.
Raycroft – Boston (.908) – Leafs (.890) – Colorado (.889). Considering Raycroft’s last year in Boston saw his SV% dip to .879, does that mean the Leafs get credit for bumping him up to .890? I doubt it.
Aubin – Pittsburgh (.901) – Leafs (.899) – LA Kings (.886). I’d say he was in slow decline if you look over his whole career.
Ok, so are the Leafs particularly atrocious defensively or do they have bad coaching? I don’t really see much to indicate it over the long haul. This season is perhaps the first year where I’d question the coaching side of things… Corey Hirsch has no real prior experience as a goalie coach. He was a scout for the Canadian National Junior program prior to this. He’s not really getting great results, but then Joseph and Kolzig were supposed to be helping, and I Don’t think they’re having much luck either.
I’m guessing the Leafs problems are a mixture of everything, but I don’t think the team D is particularly atrocious this year. Pogge has played badly for both the Leafs AND the Marlies overall this season, and I don’t think it’s an exaggeration to say he’s taken a huge step backwards.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Ok, so are the Leafs particularly atrocious defensively or do they have bad coaching? I don’t really see much to indicate it over the long haul. This season is perhaps the first year where I’d question the coaching side of things… Corey Hirsch has no real prior experience as a goalie coach. He was a scout for the Canadian National Junior program prior to this. He’s not really getting great results, but then Joseph and Kolzig were supposed to be helping, and I Don’t think they’re having much luck either.
Considering the Leafs have had all around terrible goaltending since Belfours back went, there is a good reason to believe that the system and coaching are at least partially at fault. There have been some terrible goaltenders (see Raycroft: Andrew) and Cujo and Kolzig helping doesn’t mean a lot if they can’t teach it, and they may not have the educational chops to translate their former skill to the younger tenders.
Pogge has taken a huge step back to say the least. What the kid needs is some consistancy and room to play and grow. He needs to be told next year that no matter what he is with the Marlies, no call ups, no chances to showcase, nothing, just go out there and get it done or its addios NHL gig. If he can fight through that, he will be a good little goaltender
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions
completely agree. I don’t think his ceiling is as high as we might’ve though originally, but he could be solid. No Luongo or Brodeur, but it’s not as if you have to have a goalie like them to win the cup. A Chris Mason type goalie, I could be happy with.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
The numbers I put up are for the goalie’s final year with the Leafs and the following season with their new team.
Tellqvist put up a .908 in his first full season in Phoenix; .907 this year in Phoenix and .905 to date in Buffalo.
Clemmensen’s bounce is entirely the NJD system.
Belfour may have posted a .912 sv% during his career with the Leafs, but in his final season with the Buds his sv% dropped from a pre-lockout .918 to .892. That’s pretty atrocious, yet the following year in Florida he rebounded to .902.
Raycroft is a write-off.
Aubin’s sample size is way too small (three games in Toronto; five in LA) but just like all the other goalies his sv% gets a nice bounce when he’s behind new D.
Cujo went from a .893 in PHX, to .906 in CGY (nine games) to a lowly .863 in Toronto.
I don’t think these numbers are goalie driven, I think it’s a combination of goalie coaches, team D, and the PK that are pushing the numbers in the wrong direction.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
I blame society
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I think bringing in Joseph for “veteran experience” was a bit of a wash anyway, he’s a calm influence in the dressing room but he doesn’t actually play the soundest of games, and he rarely actually has anything to say other than “yeah I’ve gotta be better, wasn’t my night”. Knowing the kind of game Joseph plays in net, it was hard to imagine before he got here what he could actually teach anybody, and he’s not the most articulate guy.
Our goaltending has been bad, but both Maurice and Wilson were supposed to be able to help coach our guys into better defensive shape and it hasn’t happened. I don’t think the forwards in our system are good enough consistently on defense, but rather than single anybody out I’ll just say that the team as a whole just doesn’t have a whole lot of defensive awareness. Count the amount of times the pressure is on in a game and a player rushes the puck the long way around the boards, only to see it held in. Count the times that our guys knock the puck free from an attacker with no support to move the puck away. Schenn excels at those little plays, and that’s why he’s our best dman.
Agreed, but I’m also surprised that 25% didn’t pan out at all: Oullet, Finley, Michaud, Le Neveu, Harding, Beachemin, Glass… – MF37
Harding is behind Backstrom in Minnesota and is probably deserving of a #1 spot somewhere in the NHL. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him get moved because of Backstrom’s contract extension.
06-07 7GP 361Mins 1.16GAA .960SV%
07-08 29GP 1571Mins 2.90GAA .908SV%
08-09 18GP 810Mins 2.15GAA .932SV%
Those are pretty solid numbers. Combined over those three seasons (weighted average based on minutes played) he’s put up a 2.44GAA and a .921SV%.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Harding
should be a Leaf. Forget about Gerber. Give Harding a chance to steal the starters job from Toskala.
Worst case scenario, we’ve got another young cheap goalie who needs lots of work.
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
As much fun as the nickname GERBERZERKER! is, I really want nothing to do with him
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Harding
thing is, as much as I want him, I’d rather have Gerber for nothing than Harding for more than he’s worth. I’m afraid of giving anything up at this point, when we barely know what we have.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions
according to NHLnumbers, he’s an RFA end of this season.
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Burke’s not going to use an offer sheet on an RFA.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
well
we do have 2 second rounders… how much can we offer and only give up a 2nd?
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Burke’s not going to use an offer sheet on an RFA.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
no, but I seem to recall us having good luck with trades involving the Wild’s GM….
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Mar 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Riseborough is terrible.
Please don’t steal the last remaining parts of the Wild worth anything.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure!
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Mar 31, 2009 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions
no more Gerber, I am already sick of Sens fans and their going on about him
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions
really?
He’s won me over since donning the blue & white. What do they go on about??? He sucked for them, plays well for us – maybe it’s because he regretted signing with them once he looked past the money and realized who he had to play for?
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions
i dunno, they just like mentioning that he played for them, and that reminds me that he did
I want an untainted goalie
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions
No, see you can point to him doing well and say “yeah we got him from your team for nothing AND you bitches are paying half his salary”
And smile.
Gerber power!!!1
by LeafFanInVan on Mar 30, 2009 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree, I ain’t go no problem with Gerber. I like that he got fired up and pissed off because of a questionable call. He’ll play his guts out and can hopefully push Toskala and/or be good trade bait if he performs strongly. It isn’t like he’s going to be commanding a huge salary bump in the next while anyway.
Gerber power!!!1
by LeafFanInVan on Mar 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Toskala and Gerber both made names for themselves playing as platoon goalies.
Pension Plan Puppets*
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exactly. Neither is a legit #1, which is A-OK with me, they can play platoon and give us better goaltending last year than we got this year. Hopefully with a full year of Wilson under their belts, the boys’ll have better team defense, and with growth from our rookies, and maybe some new blood, I have hope!
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions
my hope is named Rick Nash.
even after he got owned my TJ Oshie
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd argue
That the season where Tellqvist played 1 game for the Leafs and 30 for the Coyotes was his first “full season” with Phoenix, and he put up a .885 in that one. Maybe that off season of coaching with the Phoenix D gurus made a difference, but I think it’s a bit of a stretch.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Good point, I forgot he languished with the Leafs for part of that season. Still, it’s amazing to me that each one of these goalies put up better numbers with their new clubs than they did with Toronto and, conversely, all incoming goalies have had their numbers drop since playing for the Leafs.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
Bottom Line
for me is that the goalie is on the ice, not the goalie coach. The goalie chooses the angles that he faces the shots and how deep he plays in the net. Any dumbass (like me) can say challenge the shooter and don’t go down early.
Tanking by accident?
Coaching is enormous. For a lot of young players you’re talking about guys who have been the most talented player on the ice in every situation they’ve ever been in and have dominated at every level. Now they’re coming up to the NHL and getting shelled by people who are just as talented, if not more talented, than they are and they have pro experience playing at a higher level.
I can’t imagine what that would be like.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
The thing that bugs me here is that there’s been very little examination of the Leafs’ approach to goaltending and it’s clearly been the teams big weakness. Whether goalie coaches are shrinks, gurus or geniuses, it would be phenomenal if someone in the MSM could maybe take a break from discussing Ovechkin’s goal celebration, Wilson’s sarcasm and the sheep-like fans to place a few calls to Mssrs. Hirch, McKichan and some of the goalies and executives that have worked with them. Maybe even offer to keep sources anonymous to get an honest quote or two.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
wasn't
Toskala’s coach in San Jose someone quite renound?
Also, who was it that reinvented Osgoode’s game for him at the beginning of last season, and why can’t they work their magic this year?
Goaltender is probably the position with the most mystique, and I’d like to see the same things as you, MF. Or at least a few interviews from anyone in the league about goaltending and the effect coaching can have.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Yup, Toskala’s coach was pretty famous for goalie development, Warren Strelow, worked with Toskala, Nabokov, Kiprusoff, and Brodeur. He died on my birthday two years ago.
we just need
to bring that guy back to life….
by Karina on Mar 31, 2009 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Obviously Fletcher doesn’t think much of McKichan since one of his first moves was to shitcan him. I am guessing that hearing that Ferguson got Raycroft because of a super strong recommendation from McKichan didn’t help.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
this
I agree. It’s not just goaltending – the ability to successfully develop prospects, not necesserily drafting, is the difference between a failing team and a cup contender. I want to be able to develop every pick to the most of their potential, and seeing this trend in goaltending, it doesn’t seem that we’re able to do that yet.
by Karina on Mar 30, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I always wonder how the best goalies would do as coaches. I know Fuhr was a coach for a bit, what did he say? “Cocaine’s a helluva drug!” ?
Gerber power!!!1
by LeafFanInVan on Mar 30, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Still is, in Phoenix, even.
Gerber power!!!1
by LeafFanInVan on Mar 30, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh and as for Belfour
He dropped off in his last year with Dallas before the Leafs brought him in too… and he sucked in San Jose before he went to Dallas and won a cup. So that might be his M.O. – not so much a matter of poor Leafs coaching.
Aubin – not really worth discussing
CuJo – is really freaking old.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
I wonder how the numbers stack up with UFA status as well. Contract years can certainly skew the numbers…
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
Suffice it to say
Goalies are freaking weird.
We just need to bring back Peter Ing and Allan Bester and everything will fix itself.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
bring back felix!
even if he is portly
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Mar 30, 2009 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I think the whole "best guy on the ice"
argument grows a little stale once they’ve gone through 3+ years of Junior of College hockey, a world juniors tournament and then a few years of the AHL.
They might have been the best when they were in Midget, but I doubt it lasts far beyond that unless they’re like Gretzky or Crosby.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
We need to teach you about threaded comments.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Oh I know about them...
but “systems” like that require too much extra effort and clicking on part.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
by Steve Burtch on Mar 30, 2009 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s all hot-keys. Z moves you to the next comment and R is reply. Two tabs gets you to ‘post’ and ‘enter’ gets it done. Then you don’t have to click on anything.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Johnny Bower
still looks pretty good
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
I have a hazy memory from the late 70s/ early 80s of a Leaf starter getting hurt, I think Vince Tremblay got the start and there were rumours of Bower having to suit up to sit on the bench. He didn’t, but then (as now) the media was all abuzz.
Does anyone else remember this?
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
I put the strange Johnny Bower story up in a fanshot.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
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