Question of the Day: What should the Leafs do with their goaltenders?
by PPP on Apr 9, 2009 4:00 PM EDT
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PrintIt'll come as no surprise to anyone that has perused the Maple Leafs' statistics this year that they are in dire need of NHL-quality goaltending. That fact has been true for every summer since the lockout. The team's hands were tied that first year because of JFJ's brilliant decision to extend Crazy Eddie's contract before the lockout. Then, rather than sign Raycroft to an offer sheet, he traded Tuukka Rask to the Bruins for former Calder Trophy winner Andrew Raycroft who will soon be a former NHLer. Despite tying a club record for wins (vomit) Raycroft was a disaster which prompted JFJ to once again trade draft picks for Toskala in the hopes of challenging both to be better. Luckily for him, the Sharks chose the Leafs' 2007 13th overall pick rather than their 7th overall pick from 2008 or they could have been the proud new owners of Our Luke and Saviour. Unluckily for his chances of being a GM anywhere else Toskala struggled without competition and he was overworked.
All of this wheeling and dealing has been compounded by Default Goalie of the Future Justin Pogge's early struggles at the NHL level. Toskala showed some flashes of brilliance before getting shut down for the year, the GRBRZRKR has been (frustratingly?) good for the most part since he was acquired, Pogge still seems raw, and Burke is on the prowl for solutions as goaltending represents the greatest obstacle to his desire to compete for the playoffs next season.
Here are the goalie's stats for this year:
Should he sign Gerber to platoon with Toskala while giving Pogge more time on the farm?
Should he bring in the top goaltending prospect outside of the NHL system in Jonas Gustavsson?
Should he give the backup spot to Pogge full-time?
Should he go into the morass of offer sheets and trade?
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Do everything!!!
Well no, but try to sign Gustavsson, that’s the smartest thing. If that doesn’t work out, I can’t see him signing Harding to an offer sheet, but make some sort of offer for Harding (they need offense, the Leafs were the 4th highest scoring team in the league this year, they should be able to figure out something). If that fails, sign Gerber to platoon with Toskala.
But in any scenerio, keep Pogge in the minors.
by Karina on Apr 9, 2009 4:03 PM EDT reply actions
But in any scenerio, keep Pogge in the minors.
I was wrong. You actually can be reasonable even if its for a split second.
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
don't worry
I’ve stepped out of the realms of reasonable in my reply to Chemmy below.
by Karina on Apr 9, 2009 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions
RFA Signings
The thing we all need to remember when we mention the option of signing an RFA, is that a team needs to have it’s own draft picks to give up as compensation if the incumbent team decides to not match the offer their player received.
That is, if the compensation defined by the CBA for the signing of an RFA is specified to be their 1st and 2nd round picks, the signing team must still have their 1st and 2nd round picks to make the offer. If those picks were traded in separate deals , the offer sheet cannot be made (even if the team acquired a 1st or 2nd rounder from other teams in previous transactions to replace their original picks).
Bah
Good point. The Leafs do not have their 2009 2nd rounder for Harding. Dammit.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
It's the 2010 pick they'd need
Do they still have that one?
I voted for signing Harding, but I spaced out on the draft pick compensation requirement. I said before I’d be happy with Gerber and Toskala, although I guess if the Swedish guy is something-for-nothing (a direction Burke is heavily pursuing, to his credit) then why not?
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Apr 10, 2009 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Ah
Gotcha. Then yes, they still have the 2010 2nd rounder.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Sign Gustavsson, sign Gerber, let Toskala, Gerber and Gustavsson work it out with their on ice performance.
Huss! Huss!
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
ooooh
and put all 3 of them in the net at the same time!!!!!!!!
by Karina on Apr 9, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Huss! Huss!
Sign ’em all and let Schenn sort ’em out.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Apr 9, 2009 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Are you suggesting
We field Gerber, Gustavsson, CuJo, Toskalol and Pogge and have Schenn play in the net?
Start 5 goalies as the skaters…
Could work…
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
I have a great idea...
Let’s get a good one. One who can stop the mother-pucking puck.
Thanks.
A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
Yes
Let’s sign Sundin to be our goalie next season so he can be live closer to you when you two get married hahahaahahahaha
:P
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
I’m moving to Vancouver. And then Sweden. i didn’t tell you?
A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
No
I would pity you
But I don’t
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
You love me deep down.
A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
My heart
was broken by Sundin, I don’t think I could put it on the line again, even for you
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
i thought Eyebleaf and Tomas Kaberle
I mean, there is this picture:
Making stuff up since real Leafs news is far too depressing
by loser domi on Apr 9, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
my terrible, terrible photoshopping skills…
A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
look how happy Tomas is with you! did you two have a falling out?
Making stuff up since real Leafs news is far too depressing
No. It’s an open relationship. He knows how I feel about Mats.
A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
I’m going to ask Chemmy if he can sweeten up that photoshop picture…it needs to be used more.
A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
It’s perfect the way it is. That’s the funny photoshop picture ever.
by general borschevsky on Apr 9, 2009 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Where's the
“Dallas Stars sign Gustavsson and then trade Marty Turco to Toronto for Nik Hagman and Tomas Kaberle” option?
Defending Big D: A Dallas Stars blog on SBN: easy to use, free to join.
If that happens you’re a dead man.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
I'm creating Jonas Gustavsson on NHL 09 right now...
and initiating the trade.
Defending Big D: A Dallas Stars blog on SBN: easy to use, free to join.
by Brandon Worley on Apr 9, 2009 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
You keep
smoking whatever it is you’re smoking!
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
Why? I think that's a great deal.
Defending Big D: A Dallas Stars blog on SBN: easy to use, free to join.
by Brandon Worley on Apr 9, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
If the Leafs are serious, Gustavsson will sign with them.
I’d really be interesting to hear what the Stars’ folks are telling him about his chances at become the No. 1 guy in Dallas next season.
Defending Big D: A Dallas Stars blog on SBN: easy to use, free to join.
I’m thinking they might be telling him that he gets a yea backing up Turco and then can take over. It sounds like a good deal but he could become the starter in TO right away.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Apr 9, 2009 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep.
Backup Turco, start 20-25 games and then take over for good next season.
Defending Big D: A Dallas Stars blog on SBN: easy to use, free to join.
by Brandon Worley on Apr 9, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I took Gustavsson and Pogge-
And here’s why- Pogge has to be placed in a situation where we can find out once and for all if he’s going to have what it takes to be seriously considered for a future spot as our goaltender. I’m convinced he’s playing from his mind (technically) instead of from his instincts (see Felix the Cat). I think he might, I repeat, might, have what it takes, but we have to find out for sure.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
That’s a good argument.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Apr 9, 2009 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions
i have no idea
trying to figure out goaltending has got to be the hardest part of putting together a successful team. i’m convinced there’s witchcraft and/or voodoo involved.
we did pretty well the FA route – Cujo and then Eddie
The trade route? Not so hot – Ray-motherfucking-croft and ToskaLOL.
The draft route? We won’t know for a while. Pogge isn’t anything to get crazy excited about, and Rask is in the minors.
I prefer the free agency route.
A Toronto sports blog, where we unequivocally and unapologetically support the home team...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
i agree. i actually looked at this a couple of weeks ago, there are only 11 or 12 teams whose starting goalie was someone they drafted. trading and free agency definitely seems to be the safer route, or at least the more predictable one. (although that doesn’t really fly when you think about raycrap, toskala, fernandez, huet, etc.)
i think the real problem is there are 30 teams but only 15 really solid goalies.
And furthermore, if you know your team can survive with a good to great goalie, I think more teams are going to follow the Detroit model of spending more money on defence and two-way forwards than locking up a goalie that likely isn’t much better than 75% of the league. The only teams that won’t follow this plan will be the few ones with elite goalies. By my count, there aren’t any “elite” goalies outside of aging Brodeur, Luongo, and Lunqvist. Maybe Nabokov and Kipper, but they’ve both regressed a bit this season compared to past years.
Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell
Mason?
sure he’s a rookie, but he looks like he could get to that elite category…
by Karina on Apr 9, 2009 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
So...
Sacrifice a chicken to Jobu?
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Apr 9, 2009 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I wish our goalies had the option of transforming and merging into one giant goalie.
Kicksaveutron.
Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell
by bkblades on Apr 9, 2009 5:07 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
As long as it says "HUSS!!! HUSS!!"
All day long, I’m totally up for that.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
Do I need to say it? Because you know I will….
Get Tokarski out of Tampa Bay.
Ain't nothing but puck drops and poke checks, babydoll.
Now Princess Game Thread.
by Wrap Around Curl on Apr 9, 2009 5:54 PM EDT reply actions
Have my posting on Gustavsson up and running
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
LHA post links..............
About 50% of them seem to hit a dead wall- why is that? Frustrating, as it’s INFO I WANT TO GET TO. :)
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
Hmm that's strange...
Is it the blog itself that’s blocked? Or the internal link to the posting on Modig? Or the YouTube link? I don’t have any of these issues from my computer so it’s hard for me to diagnose the issue…
I also don’t actually maintain the site… David Johnson does… so I’d have to take it up with him.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Steve-
It just jumps to the standard “address not found” Firefox page. Been happening for a while.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
It looks like it goes straight to Leafs.HockeyAnalysis.com instead of the actual post.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
There's one other possibility, though.
I was commenting on it at blurr’s place- I remember seeing a comment from Kolzig that his life-long dream was to play for the Leafs. IF he’s 100% by September I would love to see just what he’s still capable of even in the same set-up that Cujo had this year.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
Boston U is beating Stålberg and Vermont
1-0 after a first period goal by Wilson
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Oh and I posted about it...
Here again. Hope this one works?
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Strange...
Try just logging in directly to http://leafs.hockeyanalysis.com without clicking the linkage then
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Oh and it's 2-0 for BU now
That’s 2 goals featuring the efforts of Colin Wilson
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
And Vermont cut's the deficit
2-1 now.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Viktor's dad Eddie Stålberg is on the radio atm
Apparently the Swedes don’t know or understand how big the Frozen Four is? Now they do realize? He repeated that a few times…
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Tie game
PP goal to tie it up 2-2… Stålberg will probably get an assist to extend his point streak. He was stoned point blank, but the rebound was fed across the ice for the tying goal.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Complete Momentum Swing
Vermont takes the Lead 3-2. B.U. has called a time out.
Freshman goalie is a tad shaky at this point. 3rd goal was a weak wrister over the glove side by Josh Burrows. (Note to Brian Burke… don’t try to trade for Millan… we’ve got goalies with weak gloves already).
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Stålberg's point streak continues.
8 games, 10 points. This game sounds exciting.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Vermont Takes The Lead
With 10:20 to go in the 3rd period… 4-3 Catamounts… goal underwent review.
Stålberg on the doorstep of the crease with the screen.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
by Steve Burtch on Apr 9, 2009 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions
All Tied Up
4-4 again. Great Game. Too bad it’s not in TV in Canada and I’m apparently not able to watch the free internet feed on ESPN360.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
by Steve Burtch on Apr 9, 2009 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Colin Wilson
Scores the goal to make it 5-4
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
by Steve Burtch on Apr 9, 2009 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Game Over
Good showing by Vermont, but Colin Wilson and Chris Higgins were dominant. Good win for the Terriers… they should win the National Championship.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
by Steve Burtch on Apr 9, 2009 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Steve – FWIW the links work for me…must be something with on Kidkawartha’s end
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
To try and narrow it down, mf,
Are you on firefox?
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
strange...
I’m on firefox… no probs here.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
And I use
MS Explorer at work… it’s fine there too… TDSB’s server has no issues.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Just weird then.
Thinking if any of my limited number of firefox add-ons are the problem, or if it’s just my server here in Peterborough with Cogeco- they’re not exactly state-of-the-art IT wise up here.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
I used to live in Kingston
So I can relate to the Cogeco internet issues.
Can’t really figure out what the problem would be though.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
And it's only the leaf.hockey one that's the problem.
The main site is ok to jump directly to.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
very odd
doesn’t make much sense to me either.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Wait.
How the hell is Toskala 22-17?
I think your maths is faulty.
Please try this post again.
"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into Iraq"
- Major Mike Shearer
Hmmm
Something is wrong with that widget…
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Misleading "Ties"
The 22 wins includes however many games Toskala won in overtime or shoot-out, but the 17 losses doesn’t include the 11 times he lost in overtime or shoot-out.
by general borschevsky on Apr 9, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions
The thing about
Gerber and Toskala is they’re basically also-rans, both are in their 30s and have held tenure with NHL clubs but never has either actually cemented themselves into proper starting goaltender status. Signing Gerber and keeping both on a platoon with Toskala is basically the worst thing the Leafs could do besides throw Pogge in as he is now, we’d be keeping acceptable/mediocre goaltending without the potential for development or surprise.
Naming who actually goes in net now is a little premature, as a lot can happen in one off season (check out what happened to Edmonton’s goaltending between last year and this year). What would benefit the Leafs the most is going out and finding an unknown prospect like Gustavsson, or finding some youngish backups/AHL starters and seeing who is able to run with the minutes. Toskala is our de facto starter, but he doesn’t have a lock on the slot by any means.
I like Gerber, but the worst thing we could do is sign him. Gerber’s proven in past years that he’s not a good platoon goalie, and keeping him doesn’t leave us room to discover someone.
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