Will Grabovski Re-sign?
by Chemmy on May 7, 2009 3:38 PM EDT
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PrintAt his news conference, Burke also made a cryptic reference to Grabovski, one of the few Leafs who plays bigger than his physical stature. Burke has had discussions with Grabovski's agent, Gary Greenstin, and the talks have "not been successful." - The Globe and Mail
Grabovski is a 25 year old RFA this season, and apparently negotiations didn't go well earlier this season. I think there's still a chance for Burke to get a decent deal hammered out, but if not there's a few roads to head down.
First, Toronto could go to arbitration with Grabovski and hope to get him signed to a fair deal, but as Tom Benjamin pointed out nearly two years ago, arbitration can swing wildly in either party's favor. e.g. the Cammalleri arbitration hearing:
Dean Lombardi doesn’t sound like a completely happy man despite winning the arbitration hearing with Mike Cammalleri. (Link found via Mirtle.) The problem, of course, is that Cammallari is not going to like his paycheque over the next two years and Mike will resent Lombardi for it. A fair deal would have been better for the Kings and I’d guess that Dean would have preferred - and expected - an award that split the difference. I bet the actual award was lower than the King’s final offer.
That doesn't help anyone really.
Second, Toronto could hope someone signs Grabovski to an offer sheet. Compenstation for losing an RFA to an offer sheet is based upon the amount of money the player is offered. For 2008-2009, based on the salary cap, here's the award structure:
| Amount | Compensation Due |
| $863,156 or less | Nothing |
| $863,156 - $1,307,812 | 3rd |
| $1,307,812 - $2,615,625 | 2nd |
| $2,615,625 - $3,923,437 |
1st, 3rd |
| $3,923,437 - $5,231,249 |
1st, 2nd, 3rd |
| $5,231,249 - $6,539,062 |
2 x 1st, 2nd, 3rd |
| $6,539,062 or more (lol) |
4 x 1st |
Compensation for losing an RFA to an offer sheet gives Burke some leverage here. It's likely that Grabovski will be in the range of a $2-$2.5M player, which to this writer seems like a reasonable number, but if that deal can't get done all Burke needs to do is tender a $2,615,625 offer and hope some other team wants to give us a first rounder for a player we couldn't sign.
Finally Toronto could just straight up trade Grabovski, with the "1st round" $2.6M clause having a large effect. If a team only offers up a 2nd round pick, Burke would obviously do better to keep the young Belarussian and hope for either an offer sheet or a cheap deal.
In the end this might be the most important storyline for the Leafs this summer aside from our new first rounder (will we love him as much as Schenn?) and Burke attempting to ink Gustavsson. Have at it PPPers, what do you think happens with Grabbo?
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I think Grabbo will sign. Burke knows what he has with him, and Grabbo knows he can be a big part of this team moving forward. I dont know how much money Grabbo wants (I assume around 3 mill) or the term, but Burkes main issue seems to be that Grabbo never earned the shot that saw him preform at the level he did. Grabbo then went on to play absolute ridiculous minutes in the worlds with next to no help. I think that alone may be enough to sway Burke that Grabbo is in fact worth it.
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Good to see we’re all optimists.
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if we weren’t, we’d’ve walked out on this team long ago
by Karina on May 7, 2009 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, comes with the territory.
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by blindfolded tank driver on May 7, 2009 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions
To be honest, I’d absolutely loooooooove to get a 1st and a 3rd for Grabby. My fear is that his play last season is his peak, that he will forever be a talented, inconsistent player with some good offensive knack, and a big heart, but ultimately a little on the small side and a bit of a defensive liability. I do not see 30 goals in his future, nor 70 points, but think he’s about a 20-25 goal scorer, 60 point player at best. Which is all good, but I’d happily trade one of those for a 1st and 3rd. On a cup winning team Grabby just isn’t good enough as a 2nd line centre in my opinion.
of course, there is a limit to my love, if the option was 3 mill a pop for 4 years of Grabbo or a 1st and third id rather take the picks, but if its a second, id rather keep grabbo
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I assure you if teams want to pay Grabbo $3m Burke will let him walk and take the picks.
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yah, if someone else offeres that, go for the picks Burkie
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions
And pertaining to this, I wonder if this would be the ultimate result Burke is wishing for. Ignoring for a moment how Burke mentioned he wants to make the playoffs next year, there are a fair amount of young bodies to be fit into the roster next year (potentially anyway). Tlusty, Bozak, Hanson, and maybe whoever we draft will all be looking for a regular roster spot, and for this to occur, we obviously need to free up some space. Grabby to me is one player Burke may be adding on as part of a bigger deal (if not also Tlusty) especially if Burke deems their value to never be higher.
This also leads me to believe Stajan will be dumped no matter what.
yeah, I also think Burke did it to send a message to the team that they are not guarenteed a roster spot, play hard for the leafs or play for the marlies
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Adding to my previous point, I wonder how active Burke will be in the FA market. This offseason is very important to us, and can define which direction the franchise goes (quick and easy? long term development?). I personally hope for no major FA signings (or at least no major overpayments, and that goes hand in hand with the signings) and a continued commitment to building up some of our youngsters. Open the vaults in summer 2010 when we know more about the cap and we lose a lot of contracts.
I think Burke has a plan for the free agent market that is totally dependant on how dratt day goes and he will fill slots as he needs them
that is to say the leafs currently have a boat load of cap space, and unless a contract like Malone or Lecavalier is taken on draft day, i would not be surprised to see Burkie throw money at J-bo, Camallari or the Sedins
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Well ask yourself if this:
Who do you keep… Stajan or Grabbo?
Neither fit BUrkes bottom 6 mold. If I had to choose…. Grabbo
Disappointed since 1984
Agreed
but there’s option C: neither. And I have a feeling that is Burke’s route, especially if he plans on signing either Cammy and/or Sedins.
I’d be pretty happy with neither Cammalleri or the Sedins. The cupboard isn’t stocked, don’t get your hopes up for a big UFA or the playoffs.
Next year with Hanson, Stalberg, Bozak, DiDomenico (sigh), and our new 1st rounder getting big minutes could see the Leafs in a legitimate lottery spot as young guys develop and learn. That’s a lot better than locking up the Sedins.
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We still don’t know if that 1st rounder will be a forward or not. I have a feeling it will be, but you nevr know.
Also I would DEFINITELY take Cammy over the Sedins.
Disappointed since 1984
We need defense not offense.
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sedin twins are still playing in the playoffs Cammi disappeared down the stretch and in the first round.Leafs would be foolish to sign him,especially for the 5 million he will ask for.
by wayne scarlett on May 8, 2009 12:58 AM EDT up reply actions
very true, the only UFA I wouldnt mind getting is J-Bo, and that is only if Kabby or Kubby go the way of draft picks
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions
save the offense hunt for next year coughricknashcough
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Jared
Seriously, enough with the Nash stuff. My hopes are rising. I don’t wanna them to be crushed again.
Disappointed since 1984
i will never let that die, ever
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Next year with Hanson, Stalberg, Bozak,DiDomenico(sigh), and our new 1st rounder getting big minutes could see the Leafs in a legitimate lottery spot as young guys develop and learn.
I hope every single development minute spent on each and every Leaf prospect is at the AHL level and a team of reclamation projects and replacement value players put the Leafs right into lottery contention.
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this is where Burkes goal to make the playoffs worries me a bit, i am hoping he just means that the team will play as hard as a playoff contender
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t mind that either.
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Lets say he signs one of the 2 (lets be honest the Sedins count as one) and he drops them both, you still don’t have a second line center
Disappointed since 1984
what positions to stralberg and Bozak play’?
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions
hopefully he can step into the roll, but im not going to bank on it
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly. So if both Stajan and Grabbo are gone… we gonna throw Bozak right into a top 6 role?
Disappointed since 1984
well say both of them are gone, we have blake, stempniak, Poni, Kulemin, Hagman, Tlusty, Hanson, stralberg Bozak, Stapleton, Mitchell and Williams that all may or may not be ready for top 6 time
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions
he didnt look out of place when he was up
but man, he makes Blake look like a big dude
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
note, looking like you belong on a team that is terribly lacking in talent not an accurate assessment of ones skills
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions
hence Hamilton
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by blindfolded tank driver on May 7, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
dominic moore anyone?
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
He’s 5’9", 27 years old, and has 1 point in 4 career NHL games.
He’s a placeholder, not a part of the future.
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huh, i always thought he was younger.
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions
He played a few years in Finland, and led the league in points I believe.
He has some offensive tools, but he is lazy in his own zone
Disappointed since 1984
he absolutely ran shit in the AHL for a while too
got my hopes up
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Well David Ling worked out great.
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welll
imagine if Tlusty’s dad came over earlier.
that record would be all his.
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions
His best year in the Finnish league saw him get 62 points in 55 games as a 26 year old.
He’s small and not particularly good.
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shush, I love him after his OT heroics at the one and only Marlies game I’ve ever attended….
by Karina on May 7, 2009 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions
How many are centers that could fill that role though? Mitchell perhaps. Burke sees Bozak as a top six player, who I hope pans out.
I just think that Grabbo might be the better option
Disappointed since 1984
i think we’re all going to be pleasantly surprised by Bozak and Stalberg next year.
In fact, I think those two are going to make life very uncomfortable for guys like Grabbo who may see their minutes (and hence, point totals) decrease as Wilson opts to play guys who are a little more diverse.
I know HF doesn’t have Bozak ranked very high (6 out of 10, potential 3rd liner,) but I think that’s more a reaction to his knee injury. Seems to me everything you read on the kid makes him out to be something special.
here’s a prospect report I found:
Tyler Bozak (UFA), C, Denver Pioneers
Intelligent multi-dimensional center that was named to the WCHA All-Rookie Team and was chosen All-WCHA Third Team .. skates well with the puck and utilizes his long strides to accelerate to his adequate top gear fluidly .. handles the puck well in traffic areas and can distribute passes in tight deftly from both sides of his stick .. scoring 18 goals this year, Bozak incisively finds the quiet areas around the net and can finish with his fast release .. displaying exceptional puck smarts, Bozak always makes the correct play with the puck, whether it is attacking with the puck or being patient and waiting for the play to develop .. disguises his intentions before nearly every pass he makes .. a complete player, Bozak is a savvy defender that has effectively checked some of the WCHA’s top centers and possesses the ability to transition his stellar defensive work into offensive opportunities heading the other way .. competitive and sturdy in scrums .. detailed player that is strong on draws .. Bozak emerged as Denver’s most promising prospect this year as a freshman and his services will likely create a bidding war amongst NHL teams once he decides to go pro.
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Bozak looks good. Stalberg looks good. I’m withholding judgement until I see them play.
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stralberg is a winger likely
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by blindfolded tank driver on May 7, 2009 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
the kid is big, saw him warming up with the marlies, and he was a bigger than I expected…had a nice shot, but it was warmup
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by blindfolded tank driver on May 7, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, thats what hockey futures has him as
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions
there is also stephanovich and Tlusty who are centermen, who knows where they will be next year,
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Tlusty plays left wing.
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hockey futures lied to me
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
http://www.torontomarlies.com/team/index.asp
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damn fact checking, you got me again
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
i believe he plays wing for the Marlies and Leafs because of the depth we’ve had at center.
i was always under the impression he was a natural center.
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Stalberg plays left wing.
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=97849
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Stajan is alright for third or fourth line centre.He does decent in the faceoff circle,but if Burke can sign Paulsson,there will be a deal that involves Stajan.Far too many of the Leaf forwards are playing above their actual ability.Meaning that we need REAL first and second line players,instead of a roster full of third liners.
by wayne scarlett on May 8, 2009 12:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Good points from both sides
I would LOVE to see Grabbo back with this team. He was one of the few bright spots on the team this year.
Disappointed since 1984
what is the risk of the KHL grabbing him? That could throw a wrinkle into this
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by blindfolded tank driver on May 7, 2009 4:02 PM EDT reply actions
as an RFA i think there would be many an issue, as a UFA there isnt shit we could do
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
No transfer agreement. See Radulov.
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but they have never had to deal with Burke before, he’ll melt em with his laser eyes or something
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Our options right now, who will be on the roster?
G: Toskala (1)
D: Schenn, Van Ryn, Finger, Stralman, Frogren, White, Oreskovic, Kubina, Kaberle, Harrison (10)
F: Blake, Stempniak, Hagman, Kulemin, Poni, Tlusty, Bozak, Hanson, Mitchell, Mayers, Stralberg, Grabby, Stajan (13)
Am I missing anyone? We obviously need a backup (Gustavsson please please please) and some more bodies up front – an enforcer probably. I really think one or both of Kubina and Kaberle are gone.
I really think one or both of Kubina and Kaberle are gone.
Here’s hoping for a first for each of them, and someone to sign Grabovski to an offer sheet to give Toronto 4 first rounders in 2010.
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How about another 2009 first? Are there any decent goalie prospects worth taking in the latter half of the first round (if we got a pick there?)
I don’t think I’d waste a first on a goalie. Toronto should be spending a fourth or something every single year on a goalie in the hopes something works out.
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goaltending depth is never moot. You never know when you’ll be glad you had Hiller in your back pocket…
by Karina on May 7, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
my faith in Pogge is not broken!
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Mine either, but Pogge, Gustavsson and some other hot goaltender are a lot better than only having one of them.
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of this I agree, the more goalies, and competition for spots, the better
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
James Reimer should be in the picture too..
by wayne scarlett on May 8, 2009 12:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Agreed
I just meant in terms of trying to secure a top goaltending prospect with a 1st rounder, when we already know goaltending prospects are such a crapshoot.
Besides, like Jared mentioned, Pogge will be just fine.
Pogge is gonna tear shit up
in the ECHL.
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions
……thus building his confidence, leading to him being successful in the AHL and then finally having a long, productive NHL career. Right? Right?
ZING!
When I think of goalies in the ECHL I get reminded of Dan Blackburn playing for my hometown victoria salmon kings. What a shame his career was so short, stupid injuries!
Gerber power!!!1
dear god…. i need a towel
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know that Oreskovich is gonna be up with the big club, given as you pointed out we’ve got 9 other d men.
unless Harrison was a one year deal
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
He is one player who was on the Marlies playoff team I want on the team next year.
Big, strong stay at home D-Man. Really tried to improve this year. WANTS to be a Leaf.
Disappointed since 1984
he plays mean too, which the Leafs REALLY need
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions
GAH!
I knew I forgot another description.
When I went to Marlies game, if anyone even LOOKED at Pogge, he was there.
Disappointed since 1984
one of the many reasons i want to draft Cowen, you dont fuck with his goalie
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I love the idea of drafting Cowan….except for the major injury to his knee.No word yet if he has fully recovered.
Brayden Schenn is my pick.The Leafs need guys that can actually win a faceoff,one of many talents Luke’s brother brings to the table.
by wayne scarlett on May 8, 2009 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions
i don’t recall being blown away by his play when he was called up, but as you said , he’s stay at home. not noticing him is kind of a good thing in that regard.
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Oreskovic was fine. Needs more time to develop, he’s only 20.
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he’s already huge and strong, but his skating could improve.
would not hurt him at all to see another year with the Marlies.
"Ninety percent of the game is half mental."
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Correct. He’s young and has the tools, he needs time to learn how to use them.
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Yeah I can’t subtract. He was born 1/26/87 which would make him 22.
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still the kid was always a project based on his skating. let the kid develop with the marlies, he’ll be one of those mature guys that emerge
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by blindfolded tank driver on May 7, 2009 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions
players i think are on their way out, Stempniak, Tlusty, Kabby/Kubby, Straleman
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Tlusty Stempniak and Stralman are going nowhere.
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i think they’ll be packaged off for Burke moving up
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
except stemps, i smell buyout
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions
No, remember all the talk about accountability? What’s accountability if not a guy who gets demoted to the AHL and really works hard on his game to light it up?
Tlusty turned 21 three weeks ago.
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66 points in 66 games.
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Right. Tlusty didn’t score in the NHL, he got demoted and didn’t complain. He knew he needed to find his game and he absolutely did. Now he needs to do that again in the NHL.
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Tlusty playing in the NHL was one of the dumbest decisions JFJ made.
Rather than invest in properly developing him in the AHL, the Leafs had Tlusty on the ice about 8 minutes a night and also managed to burn a year of his contract.
What a waste.
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never said I wanted him gone, I can just see him being a valuble peice of the getting a top 5 pick pusj
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m really not liking the idea of trading up in the draft too much. The cost could really set us back, and being top 7 is a good place to be in this draft. I’d rather horde picks than trade valuable pieces to move up.
i also agree with this direction, but i have no clue what burke will do
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Stempniak – no value
Stralman – no value
Tlusty – young hot prospect, accountable
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No value right now, I should add. I think Stempniak and Stralman could be valuable pieces later.
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I agree with Stemps and Tlusty. You don’t think there is a value for a 21 year old defenceman like Stralman?
I would rather see him on the Leafs of course
Disappointed since 1984
Not right now. Stralman needs time to develop.
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he’d have value to a team like Tampa
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions
not first round pick value.
not even second…
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by blurr1974 on May 7, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
no of course not, but as has been discussed almost ad nausium, say Burkie goes balls to the wall for that second over all pick, Stralemans value comes into play.
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree completely. However say if both Kubna and Kaberle go. He could definitely be the go to PP guy with Van Ryn.
Disappointed since 1984
haha, Van Ryn playing, good one!
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions
as am i, and i love how he plays when he isnt doped up on pain killers
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Van Ryn is this team’s JD Drew
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Don’t watch enough baseball to get that reference. I know who JD Drew is. Good power, signed a big deal.
Disappointed since 1984
Sick player, always hurt.
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errr “sick” as in “awesome”
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TUBULAR!
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by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Van Ryn just needs to miss the three games in montreal,to stay healthy.Twice he played there this season…twice cheapsot from behind takes him out.
by wayne scarlett on May 8, 2009 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions
I’d hold onto Stemp in hopes of building up his value again. Last year easily could have been an anomaly. Tlusty, well, hard to say. On the one hand I’d love to have a homegrown scorer, on the other, has his value peaked? Hard to say.
Both Kabs and Kubs I’d deal happily, but Stralman I’d hold onto methinks.
I’m pretty sure what we saw last year is what we’re going to get from Stemp. But if you take a good long look at his stats, you see that he just might fit the bill of a Burke “bottom 6” player.
He’s got the ability to score, he’s not afraid to go into high traffic areas, he throws his body around (170 hits!), he’s a strong skater, and he’s average defensively.
He fits the profile of a third-line winger for Burke. I wouldn’t expect him to go anywhere.
I think he could develop more offensive consistency this year. Last year was a feeling out process for many. Some turned out positive (White, Blake, Stajan to a degree), others did not (Steen), but Stemp had the added weight of a midseason trade going against him. I wouldn’t be surprised if he has a real good year this year (it’s a contract year too).
That being said, if he doesn’t improve, there’s no way he can be a bottom 6 player at his salary (and yes I realize his cap hit is better than his salary). If he is to resign, he’ll either have to really bounce back this year, or take a huge paycut just to play in the bottom 6, and I can’t see him doing that. He’s still pretty youngish, he’d no doubt go somewhere else looking for more quality icetime.
I agree with that assessment. He could, if he keeps his salary demands within range, fill in that Burke-defined role perfectly with the ability to possible step up if there are injuries.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on May 7, 2009 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I respectfully disagree.Stepniak did not bring his family with him after the trade.He said it weared on him.We can only hope that he has a huge year,even if it means he is gone next July.But the Leafs cannot afford a $3.5 million third line player.He had better come to camp ready to fight for a second line spot or he could be a Marlie for his last year in Toronto.
by wayne scarlett on May 8, 2009 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions
If romors turn into fact the enforcer will be Colton Orr…..and Paulsson will be the third line centre.
Both Pavel and Tomas being traded would not make sense unless Burke has a deal in place to bring in a stud defenceman or draft one,like Cowan…if his knee has fully healed.
by wayne scarlett on May 8, 2009 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Me neither.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on May 7, 2009 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Poll
I didn’t vote in the pool as the fourth, and correct option, of: “Plays in Europe for piles of money (and all the pineapples he could ever dream of)” wasn’t listed.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
I dont see Grabbo as too much of a paper chaser, sure he probably wants comparable money that comparable players are getting (fair is fair after all) but he seems to really enjoy Toronto and playing for the Leafs
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on May 7, 2009 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions
but you also think MSLE would allow another NHL team within their broadcasting region…
by Karina on May 7, 2009 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions
If Grabbo doesn’t come back,what are the havenots going to do? They won’t have anyone to be pissed off at,every time they play the Buds.
by wayne scarlett on May 8, 2009 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions
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