Being Brian Burke - The 2009-10 Maple Leafs
Editor's Note: Any stroll through the fanpost section of this site will reveal a number of quality posts from 1967ers' look at collecting hockey cards to 1967ers' examination of Toronto's pre-NHL hockey history all the way to 1967ers' Leaf of the Day series. Just kidding, take a gander around the SBN megaverse and I think it's safe to say that our little group has the best fanposts out of the bunch. We're putting together some stories that will help you make the best out of all of the tools to share your opinion that SBN's platform provides you with but for now here is a great example of using a fanpost to express your thoughts about the Leafs.
A slow morning at work has provided me with the opportunity to post my response to the brilliant challenge by plan the parade one more time. So here's my humble attempt. Kudos to the men who have to do this for a living; it was certainly a bit more difficult than I would have expected. (All figures are cap numbers, courtesy of nhlscap.com, nhlnumberscom, and my own imagination.)
Goaltenders
Vesa Toskala, 4.0M, expires 2010: This might well be Vesa's last chance to prove he's a starting goaltender in the NHL. Hopefully the fact that it's a contract year will bring it out of him.
Jonas Gustavsson, 2.975M, expires 2012: I firmly believe Burke will land the Monster. However, after the Frogren fiasco, I have no idea how his contract is supposed to be handled. To be safe, we'll give him a 3-year contract at the rookie max.
Defence
Tomas Kaberle, 4.25M, expires 2011
Luke Schenn, 2.975M, expires 2011
One thing I really noticed this playoffs is you need an elite puck-moving defenceman to make a serious run. Once Francois Beauchemin signs a new deal somewhere, we'll have the most economical option in Tomas Kaberle. I've paired him with Luke Schenn on the first unit for two reasons. The first is that this will give Kabby a lot more freedom to attack offensively, with a solid defence-first guy like Schenn backing him up...The second is so that we keep putting Luke Schenn in situations where he will grow as a player. Making him a top 2 defenceman means that he'll play in several situations next year, and will play around 24 minutes a night. I think we'll see a big jump in development from OLAS, after an offseason of NHL conditioning.
Mike Van Ryn, 2.9M, expires 2010
Jared Cowen, 2.975M, expires 2012
Please stay healthy, Mike. You're a reasonable option for our No. 3 defenceman, and I'd love to see the Damien Cox article mentioning your strong play, to see whether he refers to his past article where he applauded the deal or the one where he panned it.Speaking of Damien, you're damn right I'm putting Cowan on the roster. Try as he might, I think Burke will realize that Tavares isn't worth everything resembling a NHL prospect we have, and will stay put at No. 7, drafting this kid. I fully expect him to make the team out of camp a la Schenn, and I support any roster move with the potential to make the Omen's head explode.
Jeff Finger, 3.5M, expires 2012
Ian White, 0.85M, expires 2010
Ridiculous contract aside, Jeff was one of those guys you never really noticed last season. And when you're a defensive defenceman playing on a team that gave up the most goals in the league, that's a good thing. As for White, long live the moustache.
Jonas Frogren, 1.065M, expires 2010: I'm sure Jonas will get plenty of playing time this season, but for now he's my number 7 d-man.
Forwards
Niklas Hagman, 3.0M, expires 2012
Mikhail Grabovski, 2.667M, expires 2012
Nikolai Kulemin, 1.488M, expires 2010
My first line by default, I'm looking forward to another year of Man Grabs Lemon. I think with a year of NHL experience under their belts, Grabbo and Kulemin will be a little more consistent, and keeping them with their main linemate last year will probably help that along. Grabovski has been re-signed for 3 years at $8 million, paying 2.5M the next two years and $3M in 2011-2012.
Victor Stahlberg, 0.875M, expires 2012
Jiri Tlusty, 0.855M, expires 2010
Jason Blake, 4.0M, expires 2012
Stahlberg could easily be substituted for Stefanovich, or Dale Mitchell, or one of the other young kids we have. But the point is that I expect one of these kids to make the team out of camp. Fitting with Burke's top six/bottom six mentality, Stahlberg and NSFW need to get opportunities to play top-six minutes, or else they should be in the AHL getting that experience. I'm betting on them finding chemsitry with Blake as a line that uses its speed to create matchup problems.
Jamal Mayers, 1.333M, expires 2010
Matt Stajan, 1.75M, expires 2010
Mike Grier, 2.0M, expires 2012
Say hello to the Leafs shut-down line. Three veteran forwards with defensive smarts who will play most nights against the other teams' top guns. I thought when Stajan was used in this role last season, he performed admirably. Putting him in a role where he's responsible for shadowing the other teams top centre, killing penalties, playing a leadership role, and contributing 40-50 points a year is a realistic goal for him; a poor man's Jordan Staal. Giving Mayers a role more directed than "go out and hit somebody" will see his talents better utilized. And this is Mike Grier's bread and butter, so we'll bring in an old Wilson mainstay for 3 years, $6 million.
Christian Hanson, 0.875M, expires 2010
John Mitchell, 0.488M, expires 2010
Lee Stempniak, 2.5M, expires 2010
Now this is what an energy line should look like. All three of these guys are young, hungry, a bit of offensive upside, and eager to prove themselves. Stempniak was quietly (very quietly) among the Leafs leaders in hits last year, and Hanson and Mitchell should do well in a role like this. I think these guys would be difference-makers in a few games this year, when they completely change the tempo of the game by creating havoc in the opposition end and potting a goal. it also doesn't hurt that all three are in a contract year, and will be looking for every opportunity they can to prove they belong in this teams' future.
Tyler Bozak, 4.0M, expires 2011
I'm not entirely sure where to fit him in yet, or whether he'll need to start in the AHL while rehabbing from his knee injury. For now, he's our 13th forward. He could easily slot in on the 2nd line and bump NSFW to the wing if Stahlberg doesn't make it out of camp.
So that's my roster, coming in at a cap number of $51.32M. Adding the buyouts for Tucker & Raycroft, that takes our cap number to $53.05M. This puts us up near the cap, especially if it drops a little, and has a bit of cushion for any bonuses for Stahlberg or if the Monster's contract is bigger.
The team is built for speed, and we've added a little bit of truculence (love that word) to the third and fourth lines, while also giving them a greater purpose. The defence is full of sandpaper, and I expect it to be extremely physical and not fun to play against. With competent goaltending, and a number of free agents that could be moved during the season, I believe this team will challenge for the playoffs this season. We also don't have a single contract that goes beyond 2012, so we have incredible cap flexibility and plenty of room to re-sign our young core players, and possibly to bring in a key free agent or 2 in 2010, to start turning us back into a bona-fide contender in 2010-2011. We'll also have begun to develop a proper prospect pipeline to keep the good times rolling.
So who did we say goodbye to?
Martin Gerber, Olaf Kolzig, Boyd Devereaux, Brad May and the other fringe pros who are UFAs, have been released.
Pogge will be qualified and will be with the Marlies. Stralman is also with the Marlies.
Pavel Kubina has been traded. Looking around, the most attractive place for him was Washington, where they need to add a guy who can be a No. 2 or 3 D for them, but won't put them in cap hell. Kubina fit the bill perfectly in my eyes (I may do an extended analysis of this in another fanpost), so we'll send him to Washington for a 2010 1st round pick.
Alexei Ponikarovsky has also been traded. I really wanted to find a spot for him, and he could easily take Stahlberg's spot on the second line. But at this point we know what we're getting from Poni, and while his contract is extremely reasonable, at this point we need to decide what his future with this club is. My conclusion was that we're better off developing our young talent on the second line, so I've found him a home in Anaheim where he can provide scoring support for the core of young talent they have. Coming back is a 2010 3rd round pick.
PensionPlanPuppets.com is a fan community that allows members to post their own thoughts and opinions on the Toronto Maple Leafs and hockey in general. These views and thoughts may not be shared by the editor of PensionPlanPuppets.com.
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Great Work
This is a hell of a post.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
very nice,
Wrap may punch out your blood for spelling Cowen wrong tho
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jun 15, 2009 11:48 AM EDT reply actions
Very nicely done. I don’t like Stempniak and Hanson on the fourth line, but can’t say where they’d go instead, unless you swap your wingers on the third and fourth lines.
What did we get for trading Pony? :)
Leaf, the universe and everything.
I’ve found him a home in Anaheim where he can provide scoring support for the core of young talent they have. Coming back is a 2010 3rd round pick.
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
Great job
but I don’t think Burke signed Bozak to a potential $4M deal just so he could play in the AHL.
Guaranteed he starts as a top 6 forward.
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 1:08 PM EDT reply actions
I dont even know what type of player he is, so id be hard pressed to place him on a line, really, past the “higky coveted college player” handle I know next to nothing about him.
How does he roll? Finesse? power forward? sniper?
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jun 15, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions
finesse
playmaker with wheels is the general consensus, but ya, very limited information on him.
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Here’s a bit from hockeyanalysis.com just after he signed with the Leafs.
Wings fan by birth. Leafs fan by empathetic association.
line i want to see sometime next season based off of that limited info
Stralberg- Bozak – Kulemin
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jun 15, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Awesome Post - Great Job!
I like how you balance the offense and defense by making your top forward lines all about speed and transition play while backing then up with good, hard shut down defense. And then swap that with your shut down forward line, and your quick puck moving defense.
Also I think you’re right on about having Bozak and a potential Cowen in the starting lineup come fall.
Wings fan by birth. Leafs fan by empathetic association.
Bozak
He’ll most likely start in the AHL but that leaves the Leafs with a few options for moving guys up and down between the NHL and the AHL and Bozak’ll be one of those guys.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Thanks For All the Kind Words...
And I’m flattered that you guys put this right on the front page.
Re: Bozak. I had the same problem as Jared… I have no idea what this kid plays like, so it was difficult to project him into the line-up. i did believe that given the contract he was signed to, he’ll get chances, but then there was the question of his knee. So, I stuck him on the roster as the 13th forward at least to start.
I really don’t look at Hanson & Stempniak as the fourth-line wingers, because quite frankly I don’t think we have a fourth line. We have two forward lines whose responsibility is to score, and we have two third lines who serve different purposes. One consideration is that this team only has 5 forwards who have 5 years of NHL experience or more. (Hagman, Blake, Mayers, Stajan, Grier). To ask Hanson and Stempniak to play a defensive role against the elite talent of the NHL so young in their careers is too much to ask. Plus, Grier and Stajan are simply better suited to that role.
I think much like last year, this would be an exciting team to watch. I think once again we’d be among the youngest teams in the league, and we’ll skate some other teams into the ground, and win a number of games that way. But the talent level is slightly elevated such that if a superior team did decide to show up, we wouldn’t be as badly outclassed as we sometimes were last season. This team’s success will largely hinge on goaltending. If it’s bad, we’re looking at a repeat of last year. If Toskala improves and/or the Monster is for real, I really think the playoffs would be a possibility.
quite frankly I don’t think we have a fourth line.
It could be the first time in a while that the Leafs aren’t shielding an entire line from the opposition.
One consideration is that this team only has 5 forwards who have 5 years of NHL experience or more.
GROWING PAINS. This season is going to hurt unless our goaltenders provide championship … above average …. at least average goaltending.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
It’ll hurt all the way to a lottery pick god willing. Time to move out Kaberle and Kubina and get things rolling.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
RID US OF PONIKAROVSKY?
Am I seriously reading this stuff right?
We keep Stajan, but trade the Poni? Poni’s freaking ill. What does he have to do to be appreciated around here?
And if the Leafs draft Cowen, why is he penciled into the NHL lineup? What happened to some good old minor league tutelage? Considering Cowen is coming off a devastating knee injury, I can’t fathom very many circumstances that finds him in the NHL on opening night.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
agreed
I’d keep Poni over Stajan every day of the week.
$2M per for a proven 15-20 goals a year. Not going to get much better than that…
Me thinks I’m gonna have to whip out the GM hat and see what I can muster up for this here “exercise”
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Poni is defensively responsible, and, with inflated ice time on the Leafs, has provided good 2nd line scoring numbers. But he’s not overly quick, doesn’t use his size very often, he’s not known as a leader in the dressing room (on a team of youngsters, this says a lot), and has very little in the way of finesse around the net. Normally, he’s a 35 – 40 point man (about 20 goals) who has reached his peak, and should be traded before his value slips. Also, he’s been known to wear McCabe-sized goat horns – like that time against Carolina when he didn’t shoot for the open net, got his pocket picked for a fantastic giveaway, and then we lost the game in overtime. Blurr, you may be right about keeping Poni over Stajan, but you know, now that I think about it, Stajan is a centre, and Poni a winger, which means that it’s not an either/or situation. I shouldn’t have said “and/or” in the first place.
One mistake
does not make the guy McCabe-esque. Give me a few others and I’ll agree with you.
Also, in reference to his speed, perhaps you weren’t watching after Antro got moved and Poni was on a line with Blake and Grabovski? The guy can skate. I remember seeing them this year in LA and remarking to my brother how much faster Poni was than I realized. Plus, he’s a beast along the boards and damn near impossible to move when he parks in front of the net. He does all the little things well, hence his ability to play both PK and PP units. Add on to that his durability and I’m having a real hard time finding a downside.
Still, when it comes to numbers, 20 goals for $2M is a bargain. And being only 28 or 29 means we’ve got a few years left of that kind of performance. I don’t disagree with trading high, but just think that Poni gets a lot of undue hate heaped on him. He’ll never score 30. It’s not that common a feat to be honest, and those that do, make more than $2M. Not sure what more people want from the guy…
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I love the guy but I can see the logic behind trading him when his value is highest and getting cheaper assets that can contribute when the team is back in contention.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
cheaper...?
than $2M?
The guy is a freaking bargain. It’s like Honest Ed negotiated that contract…
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions
He’s at $2M this season but he’s also a UFA this summer when he will be asking for a well deserved raise. $4M is probably the starting point for a guy that most of us have noted is doing a hell of a job at his current price tag. Now, if he’s replaced by a combination of someone on an entry-level deal and someone else stepping up then that frees up about $3M. That’s some decent change to fill other gaps in the team.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Did I just read that right?
Inflated ice time on the Leafs??? Are you freaking kidding me? Do you have any idea how much ice time the guy gets?
Seriously… This was a guy that out scored Ovechkin down the stretch. What is wrong with people? I’ve heard of rose coloured glasses, but this is kind of like crap brown coloured glasses.
“Ponikarovsky has all the physical tools to be a 70+ point player in the NHL. He doesn’t take enough shots, and he isn’t physical enough. Just by way of comparison to other NHL players… he now has more points than Nikolai Zherdev, Nik Antropov, Brian Gionta, Jason Pominville, Alex Frolov, Milan Hejduk, Kristian Huselius, Jiri Hudler, Scott Gomez, Phil Kessel, Joe Pavelski, Milan Michalek, Dustin Brown, Ryan Clowe, Alex Kovalev, Chris Drury, Tuomo Ruutu, Bryan Little, Chris Kunitz, Bobby Ryan, Shawn Horcoff, Michael Ryder, Pierre-Marc Bouchard, Daymond Langkow, Rob Brind’amour, David Backes, David Perron, Martin Erat…”
That’s a quote from my own posting at the end of March on Poni.
That was when he was playing with two ROOKIE LINEMATES. He also had very limited PP time… which people seem to imagine him failing on somehow. He doesn’t fail at the PP, because he doesn’t get a hell of a lot of time on the PP.
The idea that he’s some unskilled clod that can’t produce is horribly exaggerated by the Toronto Press.
As for his peak? how does one explain his highest ever production in the final month of last season when he finally saw 1st line player minutes on one of the worst teams in the NHL playing with two rookies? His production has increased almost every season he’s played in the NHL. I think the peak assumption is a bit absurd.
Anecdotal evidence (the Carolina collapse) is the refuge of the ignorant. Bryan McCabe sucked defensively and couldn’t position himself to save his life. Ponikarovsky is one of the most defensively responsible forwards in the NHL, and he occasionally makes mistakes. Ponikarovsky makes the right play 99% of the time, but 99% of Leafs fans don’t see those plays because they aren’t aware of them. It really ticks me off that people think he’s a spare part we should deal away for a 3rd round pick.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
by Steve Burtch on Jun 15, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions
hooray for facts!
well put.
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions
So angry
Facts = good
Rage = not so good
this is kind of like crap brown coloured glasses.
Alright guys, let’s give Berger back his glasses!
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Also
- has provided good 2nd line scoring numbers. – Check.
- he’s not overly quick – Has shown the ability to be quicker when he needs it.
- doesn’t use his size very often – I think that comes from his lack of big hits. He is like Antro in that he uses his body effectively.
- he’s not known as a leader in the dressing room – With the Russian speakers he has been great so I’d argue this point
- has very little in the way of finesse around the net – he can have stonehands. Not ‘Stempniak Stonehands’ but rough ones nonetheless
- has reached his peak and should be traded before his value slips – And that’s why I think most people are open to trading him. He’ll be in line for a hell of a raise if he plays another good season but he’ll also be heading towards 30 years of age and the cap could be going down. Depending on how some of the kids pan out he could be replaced next summer.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Ok...
These are points I would concede aside from the Speed issue…
but if we hold on to him he’ll have more value right before the deadline, so I don’t see him going anywhere before the start of the season. If he has another big year, he’ll be worth more on the market in a deal like the one Anaheim made to get Whitney in exchange for Kunitz this season… if he doesn’t have a big year, we can keep him for less dough.
Either way, I don’t think there’s any hope in hell he isn’t on the roster to start the season.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
by Steve Burtch on Jun 15, 2009 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I am not saying that he doesn’t have wheels just that he doesn’t showcase it as often as most would like. He’s got pretty good wheels.
Either way, I don’t think there’s any hope in hell he isn’t on the roster to start the season.
Pretty much.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
How the hell is he "normally" a 35-40 point man?
He had 45 points in 71 games 3 years ago, 35 points in 66 games 2 years ago, and 61 points in 82 games last season. That means he AVERAGES 0.64 points per game over the past three seasons. Over an 82 game schedule that’s 52 points… and that’s assuming he drops again after he produced at a .74 ppg pace for all of last year over 82 games. I really don’t get this NON-logic we’re using here folks.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
He’s been injured a fair bit, and the point-per-game figure doesn’t account for that. He could be more productive if it weren’t for injuries, yes. But hey, he’s been injured. We’ll see how he fares next year.
The injury two years ago was a freak one in practice. The 82 games from last season I think are a good indicator of his durability.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Yeah but two of the three from last season came in practice. They are all hockey injuries. There’s nothing there that really screams fragile or injury-prone to me. In any given season a guy’ll pick up one or two or none of those.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Stajan has one good year...
and suddenly he’s the defensive forward of the future? Next we’ll be suggesting he’s the next Captain of the Leafs. Oh wait… we already did that didn’t “we” (Damien?).
Stajan averages 0.53 points per game over the past three seasons, and ALL of his production was tied to playing with the Leafs top 2 veteran forwards… after a year when he produced NOTHING with two other veteran forwards (Blake and Tucker)… oh and his D evaporated playing with those last two…
But yeah… he’s really “good” defensively. Why should we hold on to him again?
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Yeah, get rid of Stajan ASAP. I agree.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Oh wait... I remember...
Because we traded away our best defensive forward to get Lee Stempniak… and had to throw in our best future top 4 D prospect in the process.
How senile is Cliff Fletcher again?
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Not the best trade ever but understandable.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Thank god we're bringing him back to bounce ideas off of.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Ok I've been drinking... (a little)
It’s the last day of school and I don’t have to teach urchins anymore… sorry.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
well by anymore...
I actually mean 2 weeks until summer school starts… but
same difference.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
by Steve Burtch on Jun 15, 2009 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Owner
Does that make you one of the owners? A puppet-master, if you will?
by Leaf in Habland on Jun 19, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Here's more facts courtesy BehindTheNet.ca
Quality of Teammates:
Stajan: + 0.11
Ponikarovsky: -0.01
BehindTheNet Rating:
Stajan: 0.48
Ponikarovsky: 1.05
Hagman: 0.09
Corsi Rating:
Ponikarovsky: 10.0
Stajan: 1.5
Grabovski: 4.0
Blake: 7.8
Ponikarovsky had the best Corsi rating of any player on the Leafs last year. He had the 51st best Corsi Rating amongst NHL forwards that played in at least 60 games last year.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Great Site
Poni’s definitely a better player and in the end that might be why it makes more sense to trade him (dependent on team performance and contract discussions).
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
I hope you are wrong
If this is the way the Leafs are looking at the start of next season then I will consider this a wasted offseason. While I commend the time and effort you put in to making the numbers work, I really do not consider the potential roster you listed as a step in the right direction. This seems like typical MLSE indifference towards a mediocre roster. And frankly, I expect much more from Burke. Who wrote this article? Peddie?
Welcome
Thanks for joining!
While Peddie most likely does read the site I doubt he’s advanced to the point where he can figure out how to write posts.
The toughest part of these kids of exercises is figuring out what market exists for trades and what Burke’s mindset will be.
At the very least I’d rather Grier’s spot is taken by a kid but it’s good to see Kubina out. Whether he can (or wants to) move Kaberle is a tough one to consider but it opens up the chance to get another kid in on D.
But this still represents 3 new kids on the forward lines with a couple of forward contracts ending after this year. I don’t know that a massive overhaul is possible in one Burkian summer.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Now, now, none of here are Brian Burke’s – at least, I’m not – but there’s no need to call anyone Richard Peddie. We’re all just throwing in our two cents.
that was a but harsh.
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
Personally i think clrkaitken is actually quite close.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jun 15, 2009 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Appreciate the constructive criticism, but let’s be real here.
The Leafs aren’t going to go from suck to amazing in one off-season. There’s still a lot of deadwood that needed to be cleared, and while it’s nice to think that Burke could magically create a Cup contender in one offseason, this is also real life.
The Leafs team listed above has 5 rookies on it (Gustavsson, Cowen, Stahlberg, Hanson and Bozak) as well as 5 second-year pros (Schenn, Frogren, Grabovski, Kulemin, and Mitchell). Every Leaf fan says they want their team to be younger; this team has that in spades.
Also, keep in mind that the spirit behind this contest was to predict the roster for Opening Night. Nowhere in here did I state this would be the roster for the whole season. Notice all the contracts that expire in 2010? Mayers, Toskala and Stajan could all easily find themselves shipped out during the season, making room for more new blood.
And don’t dare compare me to Richard Peddie. I never figured out how that whole ventriloquism thing worked.
by clrkaitken on Jun 15, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I think your roster is pretty realistic. It’s a roster I’d hope for. I’m worried they’ll be some Swedish twins in the real roster.
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
Actually, my original draft had the Sedins & Poni as the top line. Had worked out a sweet front-loaded deal for the twins that kept their cap hit at $5M each per year. Then I realized there was no way I could fit Bozak’s cap number on, resign Grabovski, or do much of anything else.
Trying to do this highlights how hard it is to work around the cap although I hope Burke continues to show a willingness to bury guys in the minors.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
We should be thrilled at adding the 14th and 15th scorers in the league last year…
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
and
on a line with Poni? Suddenly 30 goals seems too low…
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Also, keep in mind that the spirit behind this contest was to predict the roster for Opening Night.
It’ll definitely be fluid and the change will be incremental. Mayers and Toskala at least are almost certainly done after this year at the latest and who knows what trades will be made.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Look at last year’s game 1 roster and game 82 roster.
This is for opening night only.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jun 15, 2009 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Definitely
We could re-do this in October to figure out what it’ll look like in April.
by David Danforth on Jun 15, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions
That was a bit harsh I'm sorry
I should have taken this into account, if Peddie was making the decisions we’d be bringing back Jeff O’Neill, maybe bring in some Cheli, probably Claude Lemieux. But just to explain my criticism, I don’t really have any huge issue with the roster listed above. I just expect that the Leafs will make a bit more of a splash in the free agent market. But I’m perfectly fine with a tankshow roster next year if it does result in us having a pile of first and second rounders in ‘10. But I am definately hoping that they can lure J-Bo to Leafland. Cammallari not so much he won’t be worth the cost. As for the Sedins or Gabby, do it up!
There we go.
All hugged out.
Lemieux’s not washed up though. He helped the Sha…ok, that was a bad example.
I think Burke wants to make a splash. Whether he can is another question.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
that is the ONLY question
and quite frankly I think we’re all too afraid to answer it.
In other words, no sense working ourselves up into a frothy lather over it. The guys that are available are good, but in the end, will be overpaid no matter what. I think Burke, despite all his bluster to the contrary realizes the playoffs are still a longshot and it makes no sense in damaging the teams major asset (cap space) for another shot at 9th place.
Just my 2¢
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions
I think that if a team like this makes the playoffs or comes up short, he’s fine with it. It will let him know the team is a bit further ahead than he might have thought, and he can make a splash in 2010, when the free agent crop is a little more plentiful. Makes no sense to tie someone up to a huge deal this year, then find out that the kids can’t hack it. If we’ve got a kid in our system that can grow into the role we’re bringing a free agent to do in a few years, then let’s save the money for where we really need it.
i'd hate to draw the comparison
but there are a lot of similarities with this team and the Habs a few years back.
Burke is bringing all the kids in at once. Gainey did that when he had the Kostitsyns, Higgins, Plekanec, Komisarek and a few others all start to take on major roles with the team a couple seasons back.
That’s not to say we’ll be where the Habs are now, but I think you can see that Burke wants to “change the guard” and to do that, he’s got to start from scratch. I think the quiet on the media front is possibly Burke keeping his players off the radar for their own protection, and to keep the locker room as void of egos as he possibly can.
All in all, great things to do, good steps toward the future…
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t think Burke is stupid enough to have almost every key player’s contract come up in the same season. So he’s got that going for him.
No but he’ll have lots of the useless contracts come up at once like he did in Anaheim.
by David Danforth on Jun 15, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions
The Ducks are pretty primed this summer. They have most of their key players under contract and lots of cap space.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Jay Bouwmeester is going to command stupid free agency money. While not every move Cliff made last year was a great one, the one thing I loved that he did was he made sure whomever took over for him would be entering a situation where within a few years, they would have significant cap flexibility to remake this team the way they wanted. I’ve tried to keep that going, and so nobody has a contract that last longer than 3 years from now.
Like I said, I tried to get the Sedins. But I couldn’t get the cap to work. Maybe Burke will figure out something I didn’t, but if you’re going to get those guys in, you’ve gotta make room elsewhere. He likely can’t move Blake’s contract or Stempniak’s (Yet), Bozak’s contract is what it is, and I decided I wanted Kaberle on the backline.
There’s no chance Gaborik ends up in Toronto. He’s fleeing the scene from a situation where he was expected to play in a rigid, defense-first system. I can’t see him being in a hurry to come here, where Wilson has been holding everyone accountable for their play no matter what their contract, and where he is trying to preach defence first.
PPP, I picked Grier for two reasons. One, I wanted a defensive forward who could be the mainstay on a checking-type line, someone who we could have complete confidence sending out against the other teams’ top line. grier’s done that his whole career, including in San Jose when Wilson was his coach. I liked that familiarity. And two, with such a young team, I wanted another veteran in the locker room to provide some professionalism and leadership, like what Brad May brought last year. Especially if you consider that Mayers and Stajan could likely be gone by March.
Some of These Comments The Last Hour Or So...
I feel like I’ve been defending my master’s thesis or something.
Master's Thesis?
No way. This is much more interesting!
by David Danforth on Jun 15, 2009 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I was wondering where Mike Grier came from – I hadn’t considered him when I did my original thinking on my own lineup, but I DO like the idea the more I think about it – he’d be a good pickup for Burke. You’re right about J-Bo commanding a LOT of money as a UFA, but next year, so will Kabby. The fact is that we can, realistically, pay one or the other, and I decided I’d rather have J-Bo than Kabby – doubly so given that Kabby re-signs the year the cap likely goes down, and will be due for a sizable raise.
I also think that, if Blake performs reasonably well, he’ll be out the door at the trade deadline this year. Stempniak will not make it past this year and could, again, given a decent year, be dangled as deadline bait.
by Blue and White Expat on Jun 15, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Gaborik
I don’t think that Burke wants him considering his injury history but Wilson’s teams in San Jose did feature a Rocket Richard winner in Cheechoo and an Art Ross winner in Joe Thornton so he doesn’t completely stifle offensive talents.
by David Danforth on Jun 15, 2009 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions
“Jonas Gustavsson, 2.975M, expires 2012: I firmly believe Burke will land the Monster. However, after the Frogren fiasco, I have no idea how his contract is supposed to be handled. To be safe, we’ll give him a 3-year contract at the rookie max.”
According to Gustavsson’s agent the contract can only be one year at the rookie max because of his age.
www.mma-elite.com
That’s interesting. What does that mean for his UFA/RFA status?
by David Danforth on Jun 15, 2009 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I like the thought of Grier coming to the Leafs. He would provide invaluable mentorship to some of the younger, grittier players and Stajan. That said, I have a feeling he will get overpaid by a cup contender because of the skillset he brings to a playoff team. If Philly can get their cap situation sorted out I could see him landing there. But lets all hope the Leafs can reel him in at a reasonable price since he has quite a few good years left in the league.
I'm going to do my own posting that answers the thread on here...
I just planned on doing it on my own site.
But yeah, there’s enough money to bring in the Sedins if you deal Kaberle and Kubina, and don’t bother to resign Grabovski.
So looking at cap hits, here’s where I’m going to end up:
Sedins (combined $11.5 million)
Hagman ($3 million)
Ponikarovsky ($2.105 million)
Tlusty ($0.855 million)
Kulemin ($1.4875 million)
Mitchell ($0.4875 million)
Stajan ($1.75 million)
Stempniak ($2.5 million)
Blake ($4 million)
Bozak ($4 million with bonuses)
Either Stålberg or Hanson ($0.875 million)
That’s your forward corps for $32.56 million. The D:
Finger ($3.5 million)
Schenn ($2.975 million)
Van Ryn ($2.9 million)
White ($0.85 million)
Stralman ($0.731667 million)
Frogren ($1.065 million)
That’s only $12.02 million on D.
Goalies:
Toskala ($4 million)
Gustavsson ($2.975 million)
That’s $6.975 million
Buyouts: ($1.733 million)
Total it up? That’s $53.288 million, so we’re still $3 million under the cap, and I buried Mayers in the AHL. I don’t honestly think Stempniak should stick with the team long term, and we’ll see if they sign a player like Grier or Laperriere. I would be in favour of it, and dropping Stempniak and Stajan. We need more GRINDERS and less half assed checking forwards who can produce 30 points.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
I guess you’re assuming that whomever the Leafs pick in the first round won’t make it to the opening day roster, yes?
Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell
short of Tavares or Hedman I dont see any of the current draft crop being able to step directly into the NHL
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jun 15, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, Paarjavi has one year left on his contract so he’ll be back in Sweden, Cowen has to rehab his knee, and Brandon has the Memorial Cup so he’ll probably stay home.
Looks like no matter who is drafted there won’t be another first rounder making his debut in October.
by David Danforth on Jun 15, 2009 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I like that
but I guess the question for me is, where is the ceiling on Kulemin?
Do we keep sticking him in a 3rd or 4th line role like we did Tlusty, or would he be better served in the AHL for a few years getting top line minutes? Which means, on this line up, is Tlusty still on the third line, or is that the second? If that’s the second, then Bozak and Blake and their $8M cap hit shouldn’t be on the 4th. I think Blake proved last year he’s still got some game, and as I stated earlier, Bozak getting a rookie max contract gives us a fairly good indicator of how highly Burke thinks of him. if he’s not playing top 6 minutes, then this signing is atrocious.
If you don't like your job, you don't strike! You just go in every day, and do it really half assed. That's the American way. - Homer
The Left Coast Lock
by blurr1974 on Jun 15, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Bozak getting a rookie max contract gives us a fairly good indicator of how highly Burke thinks of him. if he’s not playing top 6 minutes, then this signing is atrocious.
It’s only atrocious if that’s all he ever plays. The kid still has to make the grade, prove he deserves those kinds of minutes, and recover from knee surgery. The term and dollar value could be looking toward the role he’ll be playing in years 2 and 3 as opposed to year 1 similar to the Finger contract.
by David Danforth on Jun 15, 2009 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I have Bozak
as third line centre for my pick. Not because I don’t think he has the skills to be a top six forward some day, but this isn’t College hockey. He will be playing against men, and playing a lot more games then the what, 50 odd you get in NCAA?
We’ll see how it goes.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jun 15, 2009 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Tough sledding
Moving Kaberle and Kubina seems like an easy move considering they each have one year left on their contracts but if you take Burke’s public statements at face value he doesn’t want to move Kaberle at least.
That’s still an interesting lineup and it leaves room for even more change next summer.
by David Danforth on Jun 15, 2009 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions
This comes back to...
my oft repeated refrain that the Leafs don’t have enough real 3rd or 4th liners, so much as a lot of average to bad 2nd liners.
Mitchell, Stajan, and Stempniak was my 4th line.
Blake, Bozak, and Hanson/Stålberg was my all US College 2nd/3rd line while the Tlusty, Ponikarovsky/Kulemin line was my all Euro 2nd/3rd line.
If you roll all 4 though the team skates the bejeezus out of their opponent and by the 3rd period they’re so tired you don’t need a 4th line because you’re popping by your opponent and scoring at will…
I would in my dreams like them to re-sign Grabovski and dump the Stempniak and Blake contracts… but that’s pie in the sky thinking. There’s a reason it won’t happen, and it has a lot more to do with Blake and Stempniak than it does Grabovski.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
I say again... as for Kulemin
I’d say his ceiling is 30-35 goals with another 25-30 assists. He has the speed and shot, just not the creativity to pick up over 60 points.
I actually think in 4 or 5 years he could be very similar to Hagman with a bit more of a scoring punch.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.
Kubina fit the bill perfectly in my eyes (I may do an extended analysis of this in another fanpost), so we’ll send him to Washington for a 2010 1st round pick.
That’s interesting because I had the same thought. The Capitals need a veteran defenceman that can actually play defence in their top four. It’s far too soft or crappy.
I'd like to see them select
MSP with the 7th pick and Taylor Dohrety later in the 1st round.
I figure Kaberle and Kubina together will fetch a 1st and 2nd rounder and a prospect or two. I’d also like to see the Leafs try to open the floodgates on some competition within the team.
Having 3 or 4 players fighting over the same spot in the lineup is conducive to a solid atmosphere within the organization. Not so much a what have you done for me lately atmosphere as a prove yourself before you’re given some sort of immunity. For younger players working to develop mental toughness I think it’s an excellent way to simulate pressure situations that they won’t experience otherwise.
As for the difficulty with trading Kaberle or Kubina, I do realize Burke wants to keep Kaberle, but I just think it’s the easiest way to free up cap space for free agents in a year or two. Kaberle might be the best bargain the Leafs have, but he’s also the most marketable for exactly that reason. He also doesn’t particularly do much for the Leafs defensively at this stage of the game, and his leadership leaves something to be desired.
Unless the Leafs can move one of Blake or Stempniak, I don’t see how holding on to either Kaberle or Kubina makes sense.
In response to the Kubina to the Caps idea – I don’t know that it makes much sense from a Salary Cap perspective.
The Washington Capitals have committed $44,605,963 in cap dollars at this point. If all they do is deal a 1st rounder for Kubina, then they’re sitting at $49,605,963 and they still have to sign 4 forwards and 2 more D. I just don’t see it happening. Plus it implies they’ll walk on all 4 of their RFA defensemen… unlikely unless we take a contract back in return.
"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
- Sir Winston Churchill
I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.

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