Toronto Maple Leafs Trade Pavel Kubina, Tim Stapleton to Atlanta Thrashers for Garnet Exelby, Colin Stuart
Yesterday the Toronto Maple Leafs traded defenceman Pavel Kubina and minor leaguer Tim Stapleton to the Atlanta Thrashers for defenceman Garnet Exelby and forward Colin Stuart. The Leafs do free up some cap space this season as all of the contracts save for Stapleton's expire at the end of the year. With this move, the Leafs cleared up about $3.124M in cap space according to NHL Numbers which they then promptly turned around and used to sign Mike Komisarek. However, the biggest consideration is probably a desire to have Kubina's minutes go to defenders that will form the future of the Toronto Maple Leafs rather than a player at the end of his contract. Steve thinks that the overloaded blueline means that the Leafs might still be looking to make more trades.
To tell you the truth, this deal doesn't pass muster in terms of what we previously expected from a Kubina trade. Part of that is likely that we saw Glen Sather dump salary and receive the Habs' top prospect. Now, obviously not everyone can be a terrible GM (Habs still suck no matter what you say) but Burke was trading with Don Waddell. DON WADDELL! He gave away Braydon Coburn for a shot at getting swept out of the playoffs. Adam Gretz points out just how rare it is to see Waddell come out on top:
As for the Kubina-to-Atlanta aspect: It's not everyday that we get to say this, but it's a hell of a trade by Don Waddell and the Atlanta Thrashers. To land a legitimate, proven top-four NHL defenseman, while only giving up, essentially, a couple of spare parts/fourth-liners is nothing short of a steal.
Not to mention that the Leafs didn't really need to give away salary. They had tonnes of cap space but what they did not have in spades was roster spots. This trade opens up a spot on the Marlies top two lines. We'll see what the Leafs do with the extra cap space since Burke said that he would be spending to the cap AND make the playoffs.
Looking around the league there are a number of teams that are close to going over the cap while still needing a number of signings. There are still three months until training camps open which means that Burke has a lot of time to look for trading partners that need to do some cap manoeuvring. The Leafs are still very well positioned to act as a salary dump for a team looking to free up some space in order to improve their team. The question is which teams are running out of cap space and still have roster spots to fill? Here's a list based on numbers courtesy of NHL's Cap:
|
Team |
Cap Space |
Players Needed |
| Philadelphia |
$1.83M |
3 |
|
Calgary |
$2.06M |
4 |
|
Boston |
$2.27M |
4 |
|
Pittsburgh |
$4.76M |
4 |
|
San Jose |
$4.85M |
7 |
|
Edmonton |
$6.64M |
4 |
Let's take a look at the individual pieces of the trade after the jump. Share your thoughts in the comments.
Pavel Kubina leaves the teams three years after being one of John Ferguson Jr.'s marquee free agent signings. Though Pavel had a no trade clause there was a window open where it was voided because of the Leafs' failure to make the playoffs. As he makes his way to Atlanta he will likely think back to the vetored/rumoured trade to San Jose that never happened. Then again, maybe he'll like his reunion with the Southeast Division. Over the past season Kubina faced the 4th toughest competition at even strength and still managed to finish -15. Maybe we were just overrating him a tad? Not knowing the market for a defender making $5M a year perhaps a salary dump was the best deal that Burke thought that he could make.
Stapleton is 5'8" and used to run the Finnish SM-liiga for Jokerit Basically, for him to play for Brian Burke he had to fulfill one of the top six forward spots with the Leafs or the Marlies. He was never going to do it for the Leafs so why bother having him clog things up with the Marlies?
To get to know the players coming from the Atlanta Thrashers I asked The Falconer of Birdwatchers Anonymous to provide us with some insight on the newest Maple Leafs:
Colin Stuart: Brother of Mark Stuart and Brad Stuart. Father works at Mayo Clinic and will be a doctor for Team USA at Olympics in 2010.
Stuart has ++ speed and +size. Not much in the way of hands so he's a checker. He scored a couple of shorthanded goals but don't be fooled, he basically just threw the puck at the goalie's feet and each SH goal allowed was an ugly goal.
Already 27 he's as good as he's ever going to be right now but he should make the Leafs roster out of camp as a checker. He could be a serviceable PK guy for the next 5 years.
So he sounds like a player that could replace Jamal Mayers at the end of the year.
Garnet Exelby: I'm not a fan at all. Even at his peak he tended to get out of position going for the bit tattoo hit and created a lot of 2-on-1s for the opposition in the process. You're not going to intimidate many teams if they're celebrating a goal after you ran over their teammate along the boards.
He's toned down the hitting lately and reduce the odd man rushes against but lacks NHL passing skills. If he has the puck in the neutral zone he will just dump into the offensive corner. If he has the puck in the defensive zone he usually just chips it out allowing the opposition to re-group in netural and attack again. Did I mention that he's a poor penalty killer.
I can't tell you how happy I am to see him depart. My wife was laughing at how insanely pleased I am tonight. Sorry, to be the bearer of bad news.
Oh brother. I wish there was a video that could make me feel better about this trade...oh, here's one:
Obviously no one is going to be encouraged by seeing this trade. We all had hoped that Kubina would bring back a decent return and two players that could fill out the team's fourth forward line and the third pairing for the next few years isn't as bad of a return as draft picks that might turn into nothing. Then again, at least they'd have a chance to be something better. In the end, Kubina was taking up far too much ice-time that could have been better used for developing other players.
371 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
If you look at this as Kubina for Exelby/Stuart, it’s pretty disappointing.
But if you look at it as Kubina for Komisarek, with some bit parts thrown in, it’s hard not to get excited. Komi is better, cheaper, and isn’t a UFA at the end of the year.
If you assume Burke couldn’t sign Komi without dumping Kubina, then I take it as a win for both teams.
Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.
by Down Goes Brown on Jul 2, 2009 10:07 AM EDT reply actions
I was just about to post the same thing but was in a trance watching that video of him laying people out left right and centre. This guy will be a fine 5-6 Dman. Paired with the Viking it could be hilarious fun.
by The Meatriarchy on Jul 2, 2009 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t understand when Komisarek got better than Kubina.
Can you explain that to me? Seriously, I don’t see it. Komisarek can eat up minutes, like Kubina, and he can hit and block shots, like Kubina, and he can fight, like Kubina. He can’t score like Kubina, and He played in only 66 games last season.
So far, the only thing Komisrek has over Kubina is a half mil in savings and 4 years younger. What ar eyou guys seeing that makes him the better option? Please, someone make me feel better about this.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions
All I can say is wait for his first 20 games in his first season here, blurr. I’m being my useful hopeful self and want to see if he returns to something like near his best form. I have a feeling we’re all underestimating just how fucked up the Habs dressing room was from December on.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
I just don’t see this guy as truculent. Every game we played against the Habs, this was the guy who went after the kids for fights and turtled in the corner if anyone north of 200 lbs glanced his way.
He’s big, he’s dirty, and he’s not that tough. What’s his upside over Kubina?
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions
oops
i’m talking Komisarek now
too many freaking d men.
nevermind what i just said.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
So was I, blurr. I just think that maybe, maybe his better hockey self will rise to the surface here. He has skills, I’m just convinced he wanted out of that hell-hole. Why else sign for less?
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
i need coffee...
:)
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Kubina COULD hit and COULD fight, but rarely did either. Given how big and strong he is, he plays an astonishingly soft game. Yes, he’ll come to his teammates aid and throw the occasional hit, but he’s got zero mean streak, and what the Leafs needed to do first and foremost, since actually becoming a good hockey team is out of reach for now, is get much much meaner.
by Pal Hal Pall on Jul 2, 2009 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Komisarek is mean
like Avery is a Lady Byng finalist.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions
Yea Kubby never really throw his weight around, he’s got the size but rarely used it, kinda like Sundin
But yea I wouldn’t call Komi mean either but it’ll be interesting to see if Wilson can wipe him into shape
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
We don't call him Komi. That was his Montreal name.
Please refer to him as ’Rek from hereon.
Thank you
Resident Capologist
I'll call
whoever I want whatever I want!
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
agreed
i’ll be calling him ragdoll mc poopypants
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
or maybe
“joe”
that’s a little easier to type.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
We have to get some Polish in there somewhere- reputedly he’s fluent.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
Joeski?
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh Brother
In the first gmae against the Habs we better constantly be reminding him not to pass to the guys in red, while and blue.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
hahahahahaha
ha!
that offensive sterotypical joke just made my day. :)
seriously can’t stop loling…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
The best part is that it has a spelling mistake. It’s for effect.
And if you’re actually offended then know that Chemmy is part Polish and gives me permission to mock his homeland’s screen-door submarine.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Polish jokes are like Canadian jokes.
Stereotypical, but so true…
no offense taken here.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
dont forget the wood stove made out of oak
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Can’t pass the puck from the penalty box
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
I will call him Mc’Weg as in the bastard love child of McCabe and Holweg
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
all of their weaknesses none of their strengths!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
I’ll be referring to him as Der Kommissar, which means you’ll be seeing that a lot.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
oh-ah-oh!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Pretty much agree with this except for “astonishingly soft”. Kubina was rugged and could play a physical game, but was rarely the antagonizer. He wasn’t mean and nasty, just rugged and durable.
by general borschevsky on Jul 2, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
For starters
He appears to have an actual defensive game.
I’ll take a career +13 over a career -102 pretty much any day of the week.
Unable to actually speak French since 1980.
by Pamplemousse on Jul 2, 2009 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions
i love how +/- is a useless stat until it helps an argument…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions
I’ve never said it was a useless stat, mostly because I don’t believe that. But thanks for assuming.
While there are many, many other ways to break down a player performance, some more valuable then +/-, I still think it’s a decent yard-stick to measure a players performance, and especially a defencemen’s performance.
Unable to actually speak French since 1980.
by Pamplemousse on Jul 2, 2009 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions
sorry, that really shouldn’t have been directed at you, more of an overall thought…my apologies.
Still, Rob Blake is a minus 18 over his career. Don’t know that i’d take Exelby or Komisarek over Rob Blake…
I’m not much a stats guy myself, so I’ll defer the science to guys like yourself, daoust etc. I just know what i feel and this doesn’t feel good to me.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Lucic must be laughing his ass off right now.He already has a deep hatred of the havenots and now an additional reason to enjoy playing against the Leafs
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Yup, right up until Colton Orr shows him what the meaing of pain is.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
here's hoping
but Orr is still smaller…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Lucic- 6’ 4", 220.
Orr- 6’ 3", 222.
From nhl.com
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
Orr also has experiance
but Looch has youth
how old is Orr?
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions
1982- 27 Jared- vs. 21 for Lucic. If all else fails, Exelby and Orr can tag-team him. :)
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
X to the B will be making sure Timmy T does go buck wild on Blake
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
word
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
It would be funny if Orr gave Lucic the business at a Bruin’s home game, though. I’d pay a dollar to see that.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
I’d pay more than a dollar…but I don’t see Orr winning that one.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure!
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Jul 2, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
In the spirit of gamesmanship, I’ll put up a dollar for that one, CH. Or the first round if we ever meet.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
Deal.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure!
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Jul 2, 2009 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
you better hope the genius Chiarreli figures out how to get some cap space freed up before Lucic becomes an RFA.
Someone’s gonna offer him big money if he’s left open…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
I do hope. I do.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure!
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Jul 2, 2009 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions
sorry
I read Lucic’s wikipedia page, says he’s 230…
who knows then?
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
I have a feeling all weights all post-playoffs right now- all that sweat therapy.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
scary thing is, at 21, Looch is still growing…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Schenn is 19 and still growing
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
he's got
3 inches and about 30 pounds of catching up to do.
different builds and styles, i’m not gonna compare the two. no need to and not really worried either.
I do really, really, really like the Orr signing if for no other reason than keeping Schenn from fighting the heavyweights. the occasional Tyler Kennedy beat down should be more his speed.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions
oh i know, they are very different players, i was just trying to give you something to be happy about
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
You know who kicked most heavyweight’s asses in his prime? 5’ 8" Tie Domi.
In a fight, I’ll take “Fucking Nuts” over “Big” 10 times out of 10
by Jacques Strap on Jul 2, 2009 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
me to
but Lucic is both…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
the only player who might challenge Looch on both Fronts is Cote.
i love that little psycopath
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
the cyclone was a favourite fight move of min
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Orr fought Thornton once…worked out pretty well for Thornton.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure!
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Jul 2, 2009 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Stupider penalties…..being a rag doll for Lucic…..dumb plays….I guess I should stop now before anyone thinks I dislike the signing
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
i am trying very hard to avoid discussing Hollweg 2.0
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
I am willing to wait and see what legit coaching will do for Exelby,who went through how many coaches in Peachtree City? I also do not believe that Burke will keep Mayers with the Leafs: playing out his contract with the Marlies sounds better.
I am waiting to see what they get for Kaberle,and to see whether they sign Beauchemin and Moen
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions
the addition of Orr makes Mayers an afterthought, he cant chip in offensivly and his spot on the roster would be better suited to one of the kids, the Marlies seem like a viable option if he doesnt get packaged to tampa with kabby for Vinny!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions
I now want to keep Kabby.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions
but we dont need him, this isnt a goal scoring competition after all
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
As Burke said, he has no problems stashing players on the Marlies.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
well…this is comforting….
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 10:07 AM EDT reply actions
Plenty
of players and summer left guys, just added some extra cap room for some more potential additions to our O-line, too soon to sound the warning bells just yet
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
I figured the return on Kubina would be low when the attempts to ship him and the 7th to move up failed. If those reports were wrong and Kubina and the 7th were not offered to Atlanta for their 4th I’d be more upset but for now
TRUCULENCE!
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
what was offered to Atlanta we will never know….but Kaberle and Tlusty and the 2011 1 st are what was alledgedly offered to LA for the 5th pick…..I say alledgedly because it seems Strachan and Garrioch have the same “sources”.They both said it…which means ?
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Who knows, btw, how many picks we have next year? That’s what’s been frustrating the last couple of days- as PPP says, NOONE wants to lose picks or trade them anymore.
We hired Burkie about 2-3 later than we should have.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
In daoust’s profile he’ll have a fanpost he wrote about the draft picks. I can’t find it right now but it’s there. I think we have almost all of them.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
It’s just that I heard we’ve already lost a couple, PPP. Can’t remember where. And what do you have to do to get those comments shaded at the top? Have pics of you and Chemmy um, getting friendly in Montreal? :)
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
If people rec your comment they get shaded.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
The Leafs have their own picks in every round for the 2010 draft,and if memory serves an additional 3rd rounder.(it’s only 9 am in Calgary and I’m only on my first cup of industrial strength coffee),and I think a 4th.
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
NEED MOAR PICKS!!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions
So, trade all ten for the #1?
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
The northstars tried to do that the year Lemieux was drafted…Didn’t work out for Lou Nanne and friends.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure!
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Jul 2, 2009 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
Didn’t work for the Av’a either.They had 5 firsts the year Lacavalier was drafted,and tried to trade with Tampa.No go.
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions
That would have led to a scary Avs team.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure!
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Jul 2, 2009 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
i don"t think that"s right. we"re down our 2nd for the grabovski trade, and down our 4th to be rid of mccabe forever.
http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2009/3/4/780831/leaf-draft-pick-trading-cl
Thank God Daoust showed up!
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Fun with math! Or, Math Is Delicious!

"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
questionable content rules!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Got that straight. Someday, Jared, you’ll have to come to Peterborough, we’ll catch a Pete’s game, see some blood-punching by Barron Smith, etc.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
good times, good times
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
I may be wrong…but wasn’t the 2nd used last year? And I don’t remember if any picks were involved in the McCabe deal……thanks for the update though
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
I've Never Liked Kubina
And I’m glad he’s gone. He was, and still is, completely overrated by his supporters.
Yes, he racked up points, but even with those points he’s freaking -15, which just sucks, even if you hate that particular stat. The guy is a machine built to turn over the puck and make ridiculous mistakes, which in turn were covered up by the occasional game winning goal.
I think this will end up being an addition by subtraction thing. The Leafs add some lower end pieces, and subtract Kubina. While we may lose the point production, we might also gain a little bit about defensive acumen, and of course, truculence.
Unable to actually speak French since 1980.
by Pamplemousse on Jul 2, 2009 10:21 AM EDT reply actions
And we can’t forget his balsa wood sticks.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Exelby is a guy who continually takes himself out of position to make a hit, creating time and space in our zone for the opposition.
So rather than turning the puck over, he’s rarely in position to have the opportunity to do anything positive with it to begin with.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions
but he very well may kill someone doing it
Taylor Hall!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions
dare to dream…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Dare, dare to believe you can surivive!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Cam Fowler!!!!!!!! Taylor Hall will go #1 to montreal…and then will refuse to sign.
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions
nah, Burke will go for a forward me thinks, if not Hall, then that Russian kid who broke ovies jr record
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s kind of sad that it’s July 2nd, 2009 and we’re already looking forward to next year’s draft. Knowing the Leafs they’ll finish 7th or 8th last again out of the running for the great players.
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
Meh
We just came off of the last draft and free agency. We’re talking additions. We have all summer to talk about our current team.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Hall to the Leafs
Tank for Taylor
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
He’s reduced that aspect though.
Getting out of position for the big hit I mean.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
and
Wilson can coach that out of him. I like Exelby. I like what we’ve done – big, mean defensemen now that’ll punish you for entering our zone. Komisarek, Exelby, Shenn and Frogren can all hit, hard. White and Kabby can easily pass the puck up out of our zone.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
He usually gets a stoppage in play after one of his big hits.
So they can take the other guy off in a stretcher.
"Remember all the days you spent alone with just your T.V. set, and I, well I can barely smile"
This trade is a little “huh?” right now. If Burke lands Beauchemin I don’t think we’ll care that Kubina is gone when we can trot out
Schenn-Komisarek
Kaberle-Beachemin
Exelby-Van Ryn
With Stralman and White as our injury callups for game 2 when Van Ryn explodes into flames while watching television.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
i’d agree with that.
I think no matter how you paint it, we gave up Kubina for fairly little. If Burke can rectify that through some signings or additional trades, I’ll calm down…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions
i think white will get another go round as a forward
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
that’ll depend on how NHL ready Hanson, Bozak et all are come camp…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
i didn't
“et all”
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
ah…so sorry..me not all the way awake yet.
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m hoping White is trade bait. He had a career season last year, let’s move him while he’s hot.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
makes the most sense
package him with Kabby and chances are we get the upper hand on any trade proposal involving him.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions
I dunno
Burke coulda gotten a 2nd for him at the trade deadline and held on to him… has his value gone up at all?
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
who
White? or Kabby?
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Van Ryn will be healthy all year…he doesn’t have to worry about the cheap shots in montreal now that Komisarek is a team mate.Oh,wait that means Komisarek takes out Mike in practice? Hope not!!
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
he is Orrs problem now
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
If Orr wants to be welcomed then game one versus the Habs he should remove Kostopolous’ head from his body.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
And spit on his quivering corpse.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
and then Punch Mayers for not finnishing the job last year
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions
the first time yes…but Mike was hurt the next time in Montreal as well.
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Some humour relief-
BREAKING NEWS
TSN trades Pierre McGuire and a pamplet detailing the difference between insight and speculation to Rogers Sportsnet in exchange for Darren Millard and McCormick’s hairstylist.
From MLHS.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
Rogers insists on TSN throwing a muzzle into the deal….trade is held up
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions
We could have opened up a spot on the Marlies’ top two lines by telling Tim Stapleton to report to the ECHL.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
but then we might not have got Stewert back!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Meh, he’s not in the plans for the future and using him helped get the deal done. Not bothered by it at all.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
7 goals 10 points in 38 GP against the adults….hmmmm.
Kabanov…listed at #2 behind Hall in THN Draft Preview..no stats listed
damn sneeky russians
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions
and it pisses me off that Eric Wellwood got drafted(Pittsburgh?) when he was in Leaf camp last September.His not being signed reminds me of the infamous broken fax machine that has cost the Leafs Matt Cooke…Kyle Wynveig and a few others over the years
Phoenix
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
RFA comp rules up-
http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=34760
GROUP 2 – SUBJECT TO COMPENSATION AND RIGHT TO MATCH
These players have been tendered a qualifying offer by their respective Clubs and are subject to draft-choice compensation and right to match. The draft choice compensation scale is based on compensation offered by the new Club:
OFFER COMPENSATION
$994,433 or below None
Over $994,433 to $1,506,716 Third-round choice
Over $1,506,716 to $3,013,434 Second-round choice
Over $3,013,434 to $4,520,150 First-round and third-round choice
Over $4,520,150 to $6,026,867 First-round, second-round and third-round choice
Over $6,026,867 to $7,533,584 Two first-round choices, one second- and one third-round choice
Over $7,533,584 Four first-round choices
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
Where's Odin??
Mirtle’s saying the Yotes signed Adrien Aucoin….
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 12:04 PM EDT reply actions
The more I look at this trade, the more I dislike it. I think Burke planned on signing Komi before doing this trade. That’s the only way it makes sense. Also, I have a feeling Burke has more in store later on (Kaberle trade? Gustavsson? Rick Nash next year?).
Anyway, Hall ’10!
I do
wonder how Ron Wilson feels about it, he seemed to LOVE Kubina and not be so hot on Kaberle.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
so
Dwayne’s World (love that chemmy!) is saying Kabby to Vancouver (e4)
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 12:25 PM EDT reply actions
well since its crap it doesnt matter, but what the hell for? Hodgeson? Schneider?
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Hodgson
is not touchable. I had a feeling that Nonis was still high on Grabner and if Kabby does go to Vancouver (please no…. that’d break my heart) Grabner would be included coming back.
Schneider maybe, but only if we don’t get Gustavsson. I think right now the Canucks are looking at him as their backup.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, I just couldnt think of anything else that they have that would make sense coming back, all they have is defensemen and Burrows, and do not want Burrows
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Looking at the Kubina trade, my guess is the Leafs would land all of Darcy Hordichuk for Kaberle.
How long ’til someone makes a plan the parade joke?
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
that's my worry
I don’t think Burke got hoodwinked by Waddell (despite all appearances to the contrary) but the value of Kabby doesn’t seem all that astronomical to me.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s not a hoodwinking. If there were better deals out there then Burke would have made it. And one has to evaluate the trade on more than just the players.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions
the currency of a trade, to me, is almost entirely consisted of the players involved. I can see, in some instances where the contract values come into play if you’re hard up against the cap. We’re not.
If Exelby becomes the second coming of Scott Stevens (not being sarcastic, it’s possible. Stevens wasn’t the game changer he’s known as now until he got moved to New Jersey…) then this is a steal. Stranger things have happened, but it’s a rare occurrence when they do.
I’ll take the mf37 school of thought and choose not to speculate on the what ifs as far as other trade options for Kubina. If this is top value for Kubina however, then we’re in trouble with our Kaberle expectations….
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, Stevens was a “game-changer” for years before going to New Jersey in the most ludicrous arbitration decision in the short history of arbitrated compensation. If Exelby had that kind of potential it would have been obvious long before now.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Jul 2, 2009 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions
they actually don’t have many defensemen. They have a dearth of prospects, actually, I don’t know that they even have 6 NHL quality defensemen signed right now. They lost Ohlund yesterday, but added Rome (who played what 6 games last year?) They need to get Beauchemin or they’re sunk, I think. Salo-Bieksa-Mitchell-Edler are their top 4, Iand then they have Shane O’Brien. They need a legit #1, which is probably where this Kaberle rumour comes from.
Gillis wanted Bouwmeester, and I think he put all of his eggs into that basket.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions
heh, should have specified, i ment they didnt have anything other than D that id want on my team, Want Bieksa
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Edler
please and thanks.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions
yes
Edler>>>>Bieksa.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions
the Leafs need a #1 centre…whether he is a legit #1 or not,is open to discussion,but Kesler is a stud in the faceoff circle…an area the Buds need a lot of help in.
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
no
no Kesler.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I was never in favour of moving Kubina unless it made the team better or acquired prospects – there was never any need to do a salary dump, and he’s decent value for his contract.
A year of Stuart and a downgrade on defence doesn’t do it for me. Stuart looks like an interesting guy, maybe Burke sees something in him and will be able to resign him if he has a good season. Or maybe he’s just a younger Jamal Mayers.
Komisarek is younger than Kubina, and I guess has the potential to be a much better shutdown defender if he recovers from last season. Certainly based on last season I’d rather have Kubina. And if there really is money for Beauchemin’s demands to round out the D, then there was no need to move one K to make room for the other.
Right now Burke is doing exactly what I’d hoped he wouldn’t: chase after toughness and perceived toughness (Kubina can’t be tough, he’s European) without regard for whether his acquisitions can play hockey. I can’t believe he thought signing Orr and Neil was a productive idea.
I've been looking at the sky
welcome to the minority.
I’m thinking all the same things…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I love Kubina
but frankly, he wasn’t very hard to play against last year. I do see the case for keeping Kubina and signing Komisarek, but I think what it comes down to is that when the Leafs turn the corner and become a contending team, Kubina wasn’t going to be a part of it, so he had to go while we could get something for him. I don’t think Exelby or Stuart will be Leafs past this year either, but their contracts end this year leaving us more room next summer, while we still would’ve had Kubina for another year. Assuming this is the year the turnaround starts, next summer will be a big one.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Kubina’s contract is up this year too.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Jul 2, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
are you sure?
I thought he signed a 5 year contract with JFJ, and he’s played 3 years with the Leafs…. I’ll look it up.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions
4 years $20M.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
oh boo
then yeah I don’t know. I do know that I like that Burke is our GM because I feel he’s smarter and better at that job than I am, whereas I felt at least as qaulified as JFJ. This means I am very uncomfortable questioning Burke’s moves because I don’t know that I fully understand them.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
As I pointed out, this deal still gives the Leafs’ cap space this year while getting Komisarek signed.
The move amounts to getting cap space, a player that will be a cornerstone of the defence (vomit), two third pairing/fourth liners that make the team tougher while still leaving spots open for the kids to play.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Unless Burke can sign Grabs or a Grabs-equivalent AND get the Monster, then this off season will get a fail from me.
I mean, maybe my expectations were too high but when Burke said he would “spend to the cap” i didn’t know he meant it would be all truculence and belligerence.
Someone’s got to score, somewhere.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I dunno
yeah, I’d like a high scoring forward, but at the same time I am warming to the idea of having the young guys compete for time up front…
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldnt mind One guy like Tanguay to fill the number one center roll, but I am actually excited to see how the kids do. not only will this show us what they have, but it will also help build chemistry.
Also, Kubina was (is) a tough hockey player, but so was Hal Gill, big durable, and cleared the net well. What he wasnt was a player that would make sure the net would never need clearing to begin with, someone who had forwards looking over their shoulder and making bad passes to avoid getting squeezed. Komeserik brings this….even though he is a cowardly cheap shot artist
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Tanguay
plays wing, though.
I would like a #1 center, but those are hard to come by.
Anyone heard anything else on the Clowe rumours?
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
hmmm, why did i think he was a center, oh well he’d look good on grabbos wing
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions
dunno
but my husband thought the same thing
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Well…there is always Domenic Moore.Not a legit #1 but the chemistry he had with Blake would be enough until Hall comes on board.
Or…just to piss off the habs..Vinny
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions
TRUCULENCE!
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
Does anyone remember how other teams teed up on the Leafs’ last year? Signing Orr and getting Stuart to fill out the 3rd/4th lines mean that maybe those guys aren’t seen as sitting ducks anymore.
Sometimes you have to give up from a position of strength to fill a gaping void. And Stewart is supposed to be good on the PK as is Komisarek. Do we all remember how the PK went last year?
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe
Certainly if hiring a goon really is a deterrent, then Orr’s your guy – and yes, I think he can beat up Lucic, he just can’t match his ice time. Then again, I also remember what’s-his-name teeing off on Kaberle in a season in which the Leafs still included Domi and Belak. I really doubt that having Orr manning the door on the bench will protect Grabovski from Lucic.
The Leafs were 27th on the PK last year, Atlanta was 25th. Likely it was goaltending that did them both in. I haven’t looked for detailed stats on Stuart’s prowess, but I don’t know that you need to give very much up to get another grinder. Travis Moen is still out there.
And not only was Komisarek not very impressive in any situation last year, they didn’t need to free up money to sign him. I hope he’s much better and improves the teams PK this year, but if Kubina was going to move it should have brought something back – or why move him?
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Jul 2, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Coaching will have a lot to do with the improvement we WILL see from Exelby.Komisarek on the other hand…..we better hope he takes to the role Wilson has for him.
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Koivu really going to Minnesota?
Как же так может быть? - Finland fails at life. Seriously, someone please adopt me?
Saku? Haven’t heard anything.
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
offered by the Wild
Koivu is thinking it over as of last night per Wysh on twitter.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
I love McKenzie’s blog on TSN re: Gainey
Bob Gainey spent $107 million on 20 years worth of contracts, but the jury is very much out on the moves.
$107M…dang.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:18 PM EDT reply actions
the grass is dead on montreals side of the fence
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
$107M…
in small forwards who for the most part, are on the wrong side of their career arc.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions
see? things could be worse!
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions
I am listening to the Fan 990 (montreal’s English sports station) and they played a Gomez clip.
Paraphrasing " Y’know when you don’t care anymore, you really don’t want to play"
From a guy getting an average of 7.5 mil a year.
I feel like saying to my boss “I really don’t care about work anymore.. so I am gonna slack off for a while, until you find somewhere else for me to work at the same salary. Thanks”
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions
i still think Cammalleri will be spectacular, and, for a few years, he and Gomez could be really special in the offensive zone.
but $107M…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
this is why we love you
Because Taking The Leafs Seriously Is Not An Option
by JaredFromLondon on Jul 2, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions
We may not get to the Playoffs this year
But Like Russell Peters said “Someone’s gonna get a hurt real bad!”
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I just read through all the comments. So much anger, so much infighting, so much depression.
We let in 293 goals last season. 293!!!!!1 I’m blaming anyone who played defense and goal for that fucking ridiculous number. I’m sure Burke tried to get the best deal out there. They had their eye on Exelby, so I’m sure this was the market for Kubina. He was going to be a free agent, and we saw last year that the market wasn’t that great at the deadline, and his no-trade really fucked us.
293 goals. I’m all for adding crazily defensive defenceman. Period.
And as for White, there is NO WAY, absolutely NO WAY, he becomes a winger, or gets dealt. The Leafs like this kid, he played his ass off for us last year – repped at the World’s too. He’s a part of that defence core, a lot more than Van Ryan.
293 goals. 293.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
293 goals. 293.
That needs to be emphasised again. 293 goals. Kubina was a big part of that defence.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I concur
soft defense. Sure, we had goalie issues too, but quite often they were hung out to dry. I want a meaner, tougher defense and isn’t that what we’ve got?
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Gary Bettman Hockey!
We are increasing the GPP stat!
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
thank fully Atlanta only gave up 279.
Exelby, part of the solution!
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
bah
now i’m getting pissy again…
i’ll shut up
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Exelby was -2 on a team that let in 279. Kubina, -15.
I know we don’t give a fuck about the plus/minus stat, but I have to throw it out there.
293.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
To be fair, Kubina played in front of the slut Toskalol, Curtis “my back!” Joesph and Pogge…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
agreed. sluts, all of them. but ATL isnt a goalie hotbed either
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
What do you mean?
They must have a deep goalie pool, or they wouldn’t have played about 20 different goalies over the last 3 years.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions
all i’m saying is 293.
Change has come to Toronto. (Said in my best Barack Obama voice.)
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
If we can’t win, I am fine with hurting people.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, if you don’t lose the game to the Leafs, at least lose some blood!
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions
no doubt, change needs to come.
what we gave up for Exelby and a grinder was an overpayment.
If you all think Garnet Exelby will solve the goaltending woes and "truculence’ (there’s a word I’m getting sick of already…) then it’s going to be a long season.
but hooray, we can beat people up.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not saying that we didn't need to toughen up
But there is a certain tipping point here. The good news is, we get to do this all again next year, when we get NASH!!1
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Stop looking at the deal in isolation.
If you think that Burke made the trade because he thought it was great despite there being much better options and don’t take into account the rammifications of the deal then you might as well start FireBurke.com
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions
but
what else is there to look at with this deal?
We traded for Exelby, and then signed Komisarek. They play the same game. We signed the same player we traded for.
that’s not in isolation.
and, we still overpaid for Exelby.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions
“they play the same game.”
exactly, they don’t play like pavel kubina, who was the #1 defenseman on a team that let in 293 goals.
fine by me, then.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
#1?
what happened to Kabby and Schenn?
- minute eater. also the only healthy guy we had on the blue line all year long.
40 points, 14 goals, 9 power play goals. all worthless because his plus minus (a stat that his ambiguous in it’s usefulness) his worse than exelby’s.
seriously, i’m done. i’m too annoyed to be rational at this point. you can all have the last word, just know, my mind ain’t changing any time soon. this trade, in isolation and as part of the greater “plan” sucks for me.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions
the last word
i love you blurr.
your passion, fuck, i just want to hug you.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
ok, now i’m smiling…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
* exhale *
We’re not going only by plus/minus but you are solely going by this trade in isolation.
Kubina is not part of the future right? So at some point kids have to start playing those minutes so that they can move into that role right? So Kubina leaving opens those spots up right?
Is there another way for the Leafs to find out how good the kids can be without giving them ice-time? I’d love to know how to figure out if Schenn has offensive potential or is Stralman can take Kaberle’s role as the PP QB or if White was just a flash in the pan. With Kubina eating up those offensive opportunities there was no way to find that out.
In addition, Kubina has a NTC so if the window shut then he’d likely be lost for nothing while he was racking up all of those stats AND costing the Leafs development time AND costing the Leafs pointless points in the standings.
The big picture is that Burke opened up space at the top for people to step into it and brought players into the bottom. He still has tonnes of cap space and he’ll have buckets more next summer (keeping in mind that this summer isn’t over yet) so that if no one can step up to fill the offensive void then he can try to get someone who will.
But yeah, Exelby isn’t a top pairing guy so this move is dumb.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
/louder sigh, rolls eyes
we replaced Kubina with someone else, and then signed another d.
what kids get to play and move into a d that’s now 9 NHL players deep?
we have holes in our forward ranks, so we can trade some d help for forwards, but it doesn’t change the fact that we added players to a position you’re implying we can give kids time to play.
Seriously, where are the open spots in our d? Which 5 of the 9 NHL ready d men are we trading to open up spots for?
If we’re going to start speculating, then let me know. I speculate Exelby shits magically delicious rainbows….
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Komisarek and Exelby are not going to play on the powerplay. That wa what I was implying by saying that Kubina’s minutes were up for grabs.
The summer isn’t over. More players off that back end can be traded or they can be stuffed in the minors.
There are holes in the forward ranks and there are players there that can get a chance to show what they can do (Bozak, Hanson, Tlusty, Stalberg).
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions
you're the boss
and i’m just a goofy musician who likes some hockey, i don’t doubt you’ve got a better pulse on this.
my enthusiasm is held in reserve, but i’m always open to change.
that said, i can’t wait to lose more games next season.
:)
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions
hahaha
That’s not it at all. I am just trying to pull you out of your depression and letting you know that there is a bright side!
You’re not an emo musician are you? :P
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
emo shoegazer to the hilt…
i write black thoughts in black ink in my black diary with black pages under black light
i thought i told you all that? :P
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I knew I forgot a question on the interview sheet.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Also
We want to see if Schenn can expand his game right? Well, maybe with Komisarek, Frogren, and Exelby maybe he won’t have to play so many PK minutes and he can start playing the PP.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions
i’m a feeler triple p
this change don’t feel so good…
we’ll see, we’ll see…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
By no means is Exelby a solution. It’s part of a plan. And that’s something that we haven’t had around here for a long time.
It’s better than having Kubina walk for nothing as a free agent, which was always a possibility, or getting a 2nd round draft pick for him at the deadline.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
OH YEAH
BECAUSE KUBINA HAS A NO TRADE CLAUSE.
Let’s not forget that small fact.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions
so does Komisarek.
different limitations, but whatever…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m mad at Burke for that, not only sign that d-bag but give him a NMC?
Ugh I don’t think I’ve ever been as unimpressed by a Leaf signing, not since Marchment, anyway. And I sorta grew to like that guy, begrudgingly.
Not quite a NMC
just a limited NTC (as far as I understand it). He could still be demoted, but can only be traded to a list of 12 teams he submits every September.
Hm, he’d never make it thru waivers anyway, but I just knew about the 12 team list thing.. Still, that’s a pretty big list I guess. Not like he’ll pull a heatley or something, at least you’d know where you stand before getting the offer nailed down.
Also
Burke is not afraid to bury money in the minors.. the proverbial Middle finger.
I bet that is where Heatley would be going if he was on the Leafs in the same situation.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions
While I'd LOVE to see that
Heatley, unfortunately DOES have a NMC, so no minors for him. Pressbox is unlikely also, giving his talent and salary.
The main reason I hate Heatley? He makes me sympathetic towards the sens. UGH
Let me check my sympathy box
Nope, none in there for the Sens.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Pressbox is unlikely also, giving his talent and salary.
You have no idea how far I would be willing to do to spite someone. But yes, that is almost an impossibility… Melynk just sunk 4 million in bonus on Douchely so he’s going to do everything he can to move him to recoup that 4 mil as best he can.
But man, imagine it he did that to the Leafs with their bottomless pockets? Burke won’t care, he’ll bench the kid’s ass for the rest of his contract and ruin him.
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
I wouldn't put him in the press box
I’d even go so far as to waste a lineup spot on him. Every once in a while look at him like you are going to tell him to take a shift, but instead say something like. “Fill up those Gatorade bottles” or “Drive any Ferraris lately?”
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree. Force him to play.
A Nation of Masochists a blog dedicated to Toronto sports fans, who are continually punished but keep coming back for more.
hahaha
good lord that would be awesome, dressing him but not icing him for the next 5 years?
that would destroy his career
I mean literally, no one will take him after sitting on a bench for 5 years
He’ll beg to go anywhere
"God's in His heaven. All's right with the world." - Robert Browning (1812-1889)
I can
be a bit of a bastard myself
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
a. Burke isn’t afraid to stash players in the minors
b. something like between 200-300 players have some form of NTC/NMC.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, massively different because
a. Komisarek is 27 and gives 12 teams that the Leafs can trade with
b. Kubina had no list of teams available and is old. Older than you even :P
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Without being a smartass…any longer than last season?
You know who has to be just creaming his suit pants right about now? One Donald S Cherry!!
Cannot wait for Coaches Corner.Especially after Orr and Co.Take out a third of the montreal bench in the first Bell Centre game!
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Unfortunately
This type of team didn’t really work for the Late Mississauga Ice Dogs
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Exelby played the most minutes on that Thrashers team? No. He didn’t.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
if he did, maybe 293 goals against wouldn’t look so bad…
:P
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm going to guess
That the goaltender played the most minutes on that team. Also, pretty sure he has some influence on the Goals against thingy
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
bingo ringo
here’s a cigar.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s meant to read ‘defenceman’ and not include the goaltenders.
Either way, one player was a huge piece of a team giving up 293 goals and the other was a scrub on a team that gave up 279.
Maybe Kubina’s a little overrated.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Van Ryn has a new nickname….either Roman(as in candle) or Phoenix as in he rises from the ashes of a disasterous season.
He was the best Dman we had in several games last season…there just wern’t enough of them.If anyone is stupid enough to take that contract( hello Gainey? Sather?) the Leafs should do it for a pick.
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
According to the star
“They’ll be with this team for the long haul,” said Nonis of the newcomers.
Referring to Komisarek, Orr and Exelby. And since Exelby is only signed beyond this year, the question becomes, what does he resign for? I sure hope he doesn’t get more than $2mil a year.
he will
that’s what all the cap space is for!
:)
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I would rather hear from Burke than Nonis
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Burke gets people to do shit for him…LIKE A BOSS
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
I know
but I saw Nonis a lot in Vancouver and am not a fan.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Burke is probably still stuck in Sweden…
nice gesture, but not real well thought out.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
They have phones in Sweden, right?
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Burke doesn’t know how to operate one, remember!!!!
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Still on hold with Chiarelli
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Sorry
I am in a bit of a weird, antagonistic mood today.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Burke would have said "They’re coming back, F*&@! You!
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s Chris Neil Money!
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Now, obviously not everyone can be a terrible GM but Quinn was trading with Don Waddell.
Mistaking one Irishman for another????
haha
I noticed that but forgot to mention it…
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions
They all look the same.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I can hardly wait
Though I am a little wary of too much of a good thing, healthy competition among wrestlers will certainly bring out the character in a couple of them. Think of it as a parrallel draft where many are chosen, then a few make the grade. Scoring will come, as some rise to the occasion and take advantage of a new role. What tilts the balance for me however, is that we now, in Grabs et Komo erectus, have two of the most despised Habs in recent history playing for us. My neighbors are already full of projectile bile and the season is still a few months away. As my grandmother used to say before those old Broad street bullies Leafs cage matches, I think there’s going to be fisticuffs during the game my dear. Who’s your fucking daddy midget boys? I heard that its Hall Gill.
Karlis Skrastins – funny name
Как же так может быть? - Finland fails at life. Seriously, someone please adopt me?
The reaction to Stuart reminds me of when the Leafs acquired Tyson Nash.
Look at the Leaf’s depth (don’t laugh) chart, I’m hard pressed to see who Stuart bumps out of the top 13 forwards. I don’t see this aspect of the trade as anything more than filling out the Marlies roster.
In 42 games in the A last year Stuart put up 9G 16A. Those are worse numbers than Andre Deveuax, Jamie Sifers and Anton Stalman and on-par with budding superstar (I kid!) Stefano Giliati.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
I don't know
The Falconer seems to think he can play and he’s pretty good at evaluating players in my experience.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions
numbers don't feel
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions
The Falconer is all numbers. He has no heart. Seriously. That guy is a stats machine. If he thinks he can play on the Leafs’ checking line I’d be surprised if he didn’t make the roster.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Problem is
The Leafs have 3 checking lines.
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
So the odds are great!
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
who is The Falconer?
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
The guy I quoted in the post. SBN’s Atlanta guy. He made the Daoust spreadsheet on speed.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Dude who runs the SBnation site for the Thrashers
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Kubina and the kids?
PPP, you wrote:
Kubina is not part of the future right? So at some point kids have to start playing those minutes so that they can move into that role right? So Kubina leaving opens those spots up right?
I’d be cool with that if a) the Leafs had any kids to play D and b) there were room among the 7 veterans on the blue line for these mysterious prospects you speak of.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
logic has no place here!
run while you can!
/hides before PPP gets out the beating stick
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe he meant
Another team’s prospects?
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Admittedly
It won’t be instantaneous gratification but Stralman and White could use a lot more powerplay time. They’re both candidates to be around when the Leafs get better.
Luke Schenn could get powerplay time as well.
As for the heavy blueline, Burke can still make more trades (I know, I was shocked too) and he can bury players in the minors/lose them to waivers to open up spots on the blueline.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions
all logicla
(seriously)
but I don’t see the Leafs, as a rebuilding team, able to afford losing players to waivers, unless they’re the kind we don’t relaly want in the first place, in which case, why not trade them? For anything…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions
holy spell check batman…
sorry about that
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Fixed
but I don’t see the Leafs, as a rebuilding team, able to afford losing players to free agency, unless they’re the kind we don’t really want in the first place, in which case, why not trade them? For anything…
Kubina’s NTC played a part in the trade. That was leverage for anyone inquiring about him.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions
ok
but you’re saying a rebuilding team can afford to lose players for nothing through waivers…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
he can bury players in the minors/lose them to waivers to open up spots on the blueline.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
heh
Yes, I am saying that. If worst comes to worst the Leafs can indeed lose guys for nothing.
Keep in mind, teams are likely to want to grab guys on waivers on the way up so that the Leafs are on the hook and so that they don’t then have to bring them back up and get caught on the hook for the salary themselves.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions
goody
so not only do we lose players for nothing, we pay for half their salary and carry that as part of the cap hit.
now the plan comes into focus and this Exlby trade to create cap space makes sense…
it’s so crazy it just might work!
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
No
We don’t lose them for shit or pick up their salary because we just send them down and don’t bring them up because then the Leafs DO get dinged.
So you’re against burying any salary in the AHL? Because I can’t remember who wanted to do that with Blake or other bad salaries.
When something’s buried it’s underground and remains there*.
*not Zombies
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
but, you said lose them to waivers…
i didn’t
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Can't bury Blake in the minors if i recall
due to his age when he signed, weren’t we still on the hook regardless where he played.
neither here nor there, just curious…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions
but
if there’s a young guy who deserves his roster spot, why not?
Just to make room, sucks on the cap, but we could send him down still.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Leafs have cheap D though, it’s not like a GM is going to balk at paying the whole freight on Stralman $700K, White $800K or Frogren $1M.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
Two of those aren’t guys that you’d bury in the minors.
And it’s an issue with bringing them up. If they claim them on the way down someone else can claim them on the way up.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
So the leafs risk Frogren?
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
They could.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, they’re going to have to waive at least one D to get to a 23 man roster. I guess we’ll find out in October
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
November…remember,nothing matters until November!!
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions
so it comes out as Frogren costing us the bonuses he got AND that 4th rounder…..for a waiver claim?
Oh by the way since I have yet to see any mention of it yet…Grabovski signed for 8.7 m over 3 years and Antropov got 16 m over 4 from the Thrashers
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Schenn is a kid
in a man’s body, but still a kid. Get him some PP time, and increased minutes. THen there’s Stralman, same deal. Maybe Phil O if a trade is made.
Giving Schenn more minutes is not mutually exclusive with keeping Kubina.
There are seven, if not eight, guys ahead of Stralman on the depth chart.
I have no problem with moving Kubina, I just don’t see how the trade can be looked at as clearing way for the kids.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
No, it’s not mutually exclusive. Is it likely that it’ll happen? Nope.
The powerplay is just one aspect of the kind of minutes that Kubina eats. He also kills penalties.
And this move was made when the Leafs had control. There was no guarantee that they would have gotten anything better by waiting or that Kubina would have allowed a trade when he could just wait for July 1 and be a free agent. We already know that winning’s not that big of a deal for him.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree that this is likely the best deal to be had for Kubina.
I wasn’t a big fan of his anyways (has a tendency to be way out of position, his sticks explode way too often, takes dumb penalties in his own zone, doesn’t use his size, and on and on and on).
I was just commenting that the Kubina trade has next to nothing to do with developing the kids.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
I was just commenting that the Kubina trade has next to nothing to do with developing the kids.
Not on its own and not if the staff don’t decide to use it as such but the chance is there.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Don’t we still have that Russian kid on D….or is his heart still giving him trouble>
by wayne scarlett on Jul 2, 2009 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Vorbiev? I don’t even think he’s under contract to the Leafs anymore. The pull of the KHL was too strong for him to take a dip in NHL waters.
Bitter Leaf Fan: a life-long Toronto Maple Leafs fan comments on the team, the media and the exasperation...
anyone has any idea if all the 3 staals selected to the olympic training camp thingy can actually make the team?
Как же так может быть? - Finland fails at life. Seriously, someone please adopt me?
sure
almost definitely Eric, not sure about the other two.
But I think there’s a fan shot about this.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Eric will make it… Marc, probably not so much, too many good Dmen.
And for Chemmy:
WTF F(KIN Jordan Staal named to the Olympic Evaluation camp??? *expletive deleted
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess I may have inadvertently used the bold command on that
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions
GRABOVSKI RE-SIGNS
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
3 years, 8.7 million
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
someone give me Steve’s phone number ASAP. LOLZ!!!!!!!!!!!!1
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
2.9M per...
decent.
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions
SMILE, MY LOVELY BLURR, SMILE
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
Poni-Grabbo-Kulemin
our second line is all sewn up. now about that number one center business…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
I believe in Grabbo. He’s 5’11, as is Gomez. I’d love if he could turn out like New Jersey Devils era Scotty.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
wooo
I’m happy!!! Now…. where’s a #1 center?
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
you wouldn’t know anything about happiness, my good man, but i’m willing to hug you right now too.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
PLAYOFFS!!!!1
Hahaha, I can see that negotiation… “my client will not take anything less than 3 million”
Burke “2.9 – take it or leave it, bitch”
"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Jul 2, 2009 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Burke should permanently be mic’d so we can enjoy all these quips.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Jul 2, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Hello, and welcome
To the ‘Mike Komisarek is amazing’ bandwagon
I’ll be your driver.
Please keep all hands and arms inside the ride at all times.
Feel free to take as many pictures of Komisarek as you’d like.
The Handsome Man's Guide To Life- Now With 100% More Handsome!
KOMIKAZI!!!!
This all facilitated a signature update
The Handsome Man's Guide To Life- Now With 300% More Handsome, Thanks To Mike Komsiarek!
Komisarek has better puck skills than Kubina
He just never got a chance to show them in Montreal. Take a look back to the point where both entered the NHL. Komisarek came out of Michigan where he was consensus First Team All American and the second highest scoring defender in the league as a 19 year old soph (behind J.M. Liles who was a year ahead of him). Kubina at 19 was in the WHL and not among the top 20 scoring defensemen in the league despite HAVING PLAYED A COUPLE OF YEARS IN THE CZECH SENIOR LEAGUE already.
Both went to the AHL as 20 year olds. Komisarek scored 30 points (top scoring rookie blueliner in the league) in 56 games and made the mid season All Star team as a rookie pro, then moved up to the Habs where he was charged with the task of protecting all the smurfs and allowing them to spend all their time in the offensive zone cherry picking. Kubina had a grand total of 12 points in 55 games, then moved up to Tampa Bay where he was allowed to play a two way game. Still, it took him 10 seasons and extensive power play time to become a 40 point scorer at the NHL level. Put Komisarek on the same level of playing field and watch what happens.
Kubina had
…also, Ian White, the other guy you’re humping for PP time, managed 26 points in 78 AHL games as a 20 year old. White was half the size of Komisarek and had been playing organized hockey for about twice as long when he did it as well.
you do realize
if AHL stats aLWAYS translated to the NHL, Jason Krog would have us saying Gretzky who?
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions
…Krog is a worse example than Jason Blake to counterract my point. Again, you’re comparing an under 6-0, under 200 pound, one way forward, who has been playing hockey since he could walk, to a 6-5, 245 pound defenseman who didn’t take up the game until he was nearly in his teens. Krog was still playing Tier II hockey in Canada at the age when Komisarek was First Team All American at Michigan. Jason was an NCAA freshman who scored 20 points at the age of 20. Komo was an AHL All Star who scored 30 points from the blueline at the same age.
Hell, I don’t think Krog even made it to the AHL until he was about the age that Mike is now. Already a ONE TIME NHL All Star….;)
You don’t like Komisarek much from the look of it blurr, but he is the best player on your team in terms of talent and upside.
he is the best player on your team in terms of talent and upside
Alright, let’s not get crazy when he’s a joining a team that has Luke Schenn on it.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
…haven’t seen enough of Schenn to comment. They are similar in style, and were taken at around the point in the draft. Komisarek was 7th overall pick in 2001. But in terms of their “development curve” I don’t think they are far apart even though Mike is 7 years older. I would be willing to bet that Luke has been playing organized hockey for at least as long as Mike. Plus he was doing it in Saskatchewan or somewhere out there on the frozen tundra, while Komo had to pick up the game in suburban Long Island whenever he could get ice time while trying to dodge the football coaches who were after him every day to change sports.
27 year olds have no upside
they’ve either peaked, or just entering their peak.
Re: Krog and Blake, I don’t know what to say…
Every player is different, you somehow think stats that a guy put up 5-6 years ago are relevant to how he’s performed in the pros. Jason Krog, or any other 100s of career AHLers who put up huge points in the minors and junior then can’t hack it in the pros goes to show, once you’re in the NHL, all bets are off.
and you’re right, I don’t like Komisarek, you obviously have been stalking him for quite some time. Of the two sides, I’d like to think I’m being a hair more objective…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions
…well, I’m trying to use stats to back up my argument. That is more objective than simply slagging a guy because he pushed around your team for a few years. I noticed at one point you allowed that “Komisarek is not a dirty player” in response to one of my posts, then on a later thread went on about what a cheap shot artist he was. Hardly objective or reasonable.
Athletes mature at different rates according to their position (defensemen later than forwards), their size (bigger later than smaller), and their exposure to their sport at a young age. Komisarek is a defenseman, one of the biggest players in the league, and took up the sport at an unusually late age. All of those factors combine to suggest that he will reach his peak at a later age.
It is ridiculous to compare his development upside to some undersized, one way forward who has been playing the game twice as long.
I don’t have the numbers, but take off the power play points Kubina accumulated in his two 40 point seasons in T.O., then compare his point totals to Komisarek’s last two full seasons with the Habs. He missed a lot of time last year and the team was bleeped generally by the time he came back from injury.
i’m done…
"If you are going through hell, keep going." Sir Winston Churchill, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Jul 2, 2009 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Edit..
..I couldn’t find the assist figures, but Kubina scored 15 of his 25 goals over the past two seasons on the power play. That is 60%. Assume the figure holds for Kubina’s point totals means he average 16 EVEN STRENGTH POINTS PER SEASON the last two years. Komisarek had 18 and 19 EVEN STRENGTH POINTS in his last two full seasons in Montreal.
..tracked down the totals. Kubina actually had 18 ES points last season, and 21 the year before. Komisarek in 2007/08 had 18 ES points and 19 in 2006/2007. So there is only 2 points difference over two full seasons between the two. Kubina was 6 year older and wasn’t covering Andrei Markov’s ass the past two seasons either.
It ain't Courtnall for Kordic . . .
. . . but it’s close. Trading a 1st line D-man for “spare parts” — ie a couple of bruisers — while they still have a sieve in nets is not what I’d call the actions of a hockey genius — no matter what Burkie tells the mirror every morning. Wonder what happens when the Leafs miss the playoffs for a fifth year in a row to end SOF (Season of Futility) 43.
Kubina is a free agent at the end of the year, he doesn’t compare to Courtnall who was a young up and coming player.
As for the Leafs missing the playoffs it’s what I expected them to do anyways. Did you expect them to turn over the team in a year and become Cup contenders? He’s building from the ground up.
A Nation of Masochists TRUCULENCE isn't just a word, it's a way of life.
One more thing…Sorry I’m all over the place today. Courtnall for Kordic was a good trade ; )
A Nation of Masochists TRUCULENCE isn't just a word, it's a way of life.
Completely different circumstances.
robert ethan actually brought up another aspect of the trade that I hadn’t thought about and that I heard DGB mention on the Hockee Night podcast. Burke has a lot of kids in the dressing room. I don’t know that he wants guys in there that were willing to stay with a losing team out of comfort rather than waiving their NTC to go to a contender. He had to move him now when he knew that he could rather than lose him for nothing.
As for the goalie, Burke is working to address that so I wouldn’t judge it on day 2 of free agency when we’re still 90 days away from opening night.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions
p.s.
Welcome, thanks for joining.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
by PPP on Jul 2, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions

by 

























