Mats Sundin Retires After 18 Seasons, One Heartbreak
by PPP on Sep 30, 2009 9:58 AM EDT
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PrintMats Sundin has officially retired from the NHL after 18 seasons. The player that always gave his all for the Leafs has finally admitted that his body can no longer stand up to the rigours of an NHL season. It's a decision that was relatively quick in coming and was probably hastened by his recent nuptials. Other fans won't have Mats Sundin to kick around anymore. Considering his love for Toronto:
"Toronto held a place in my heart for 13 years. It is, and will always be my second home and home away from home."
It's a shame that the ending to his career had to take an almost farcical route as his myriad accomplishments deserved much better than to retire as the greatest player to ever don the Vancouver Canucks jersey. His dithering last season led some of us to insanity as we wait
ed to see where he would utimately end up and when the decision came it wasn't all that well received but that came with a caveat:
However, a few years from now after Mats has hung up his skates (for real this time) the Leafs will announce that they will be raising number 13 to the rafters. The team will hopefully have found success and fans will begin to remember the good times that he provided us. I'll probably find a way to get a ticket to the game and along with everyone in the building I'll give him the standing ovation that he deserves. Much in the same way that Habs fans re-embraced Patrick Roy the softening of Leafer's hearts will be gradual but at the end of the day the great memories will vastly outweigh the unfortunate way in which things ended and we'll tell the next generation of fans about how we were lucky enough to see Mats Sundin cruising the ice in Toronto, carrying a team on his back, and leading from the front.
Despite his refusal to waive his no-trade clause, his dithering about his future, his conflicting statements, and his eventual signing with Vancouver there's no doubting what the vast, vast majority of Leaf fans felt for the big Swede:
Seeing Mats as a Canuck will ultimately take on the same akward legacy as pictures of Bobby Orr as a Blackhawk, Darryl Sittler as a Flyer, or Lanny MacDonald as a Flame. Those images seem to come from some alternate reality where things did not turn out the way that nature intended. At the end of the day, I believe that his Hockey Reference caption is how Mats Sundin will be remembered:
First player to score 500 as a Leaf. All-time Leaf leader in goals and second in assists. 20th most goals scored in the NHL and most overtime goals in NHL history. Nine-time all-star. Captain of the Swedish Gold Medal Olympic team. Greatest Leaf Ever.
Thanks for the memories Mats. After the jump, I'll share a few of my favourites. Share yours in the comments or the fanposts.
I was actually in the building that night in 2001 when his slapshot ended the game in overtime to give the Leafs the 1-0 in what was eventually a sweep. We were on CBC because my dad and a couple of friends had painted our faces and were decked out in blue and white. Mats ensured that we left chanting "Go Leafs Go"
Sundin's 500th goal came at the end of a vintage performance. It capped off his hat trick after he had kept the Leafs in the game with his first two goals, it came short-handed since Mats always did what was required to help the team win, and it came on a huge slapper.
One of Mats' commercials of which there are quite a few. It's easy to forget how prevalent he was in NHL marketing at one point. He was a rare thing: a Leaf that the league used to sell the game.
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Hey eyebleaf: http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/179932/sundin.jpg
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I have a picture of that on the wall in my office.
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The internet at the time.
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I need.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
nice
except for being tainted by McCabe.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Other pictures hanging up in here:
Belak glove tapping the bench after his goal with Kaberle in the background grinning ear to ear.
Chad Kilger and Mike Peca arms in the air after scoring on Ottawa with #14 on the Sens looking frowny. :(
Darcy Tucker arms over his head after scoring on Ottawa.
Tucker jumping in the air in front of Kipper.
Sundin scoring a breakaway on Lundqvist.
Tucker in front of Carlton both doing the same pose.
Sundin and Tucker celebrating behind Gerber.
Sundin celebrating next to Gerber.
Sundin scoring on Miller.
Papelbon pouring Budweiser on the AL Trophy while smoking a cigar.
A-Rod slapping the ball out of Arroyo’s glove photoshopped with a purse.
Tom Brady doing the tomahawk chop after headfaking Urlacher in 07.
Manny with his hands over his head standing on home plate while everyone in Fenway does the same pose and the Sox run out of the dugout while the ball is still in the air in the 07 ALDS.
Papelbon fist pump.
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by Chemmy on Sep 30, 2009 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
that’s a lot of wall space
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Well they’re just printed out 8.5×11
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I can't
even find room to put up a proper full size calendar…
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh. I have tons of space.
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what a photo. thanks chemmy. my cubicle’s covered with photos of the wife and kids right now, but i think mats has earned his spot with the fam.
jesus, the more i think about mats really being gone the sadder i’m getting.
Don’t forget to frame it!
I have a little Mats McFarlane here but I need a photo.
by Hungry Leafs Fan on Sep 30, 2009 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I need both.
I’m off to NHL.com for some emotional shopping.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
What a goal. I was also at that game. My favourite Sundin goal.
by general borschevsky on Sep 30, 2009 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
That’s probably my favorite Leaf goal I’ve seen.
It also was scored with one of the very first one piece composite sticks and really helped popularize the Synergy, so on top of being awesome it’s kind of an interesting turning point in hockey.
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Thanks For Everything, Mats
Too bad you couldn’t retire a Leaf.
by RobOuttaSoCal on Sep 30, 2009 10:04 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Unfortunate the way things turned out
But he left us with a bunch of great memories.
Like daoust, the 500th goal is burned into my brain.
Although he played on the Canucks last season, it was still nice to see him playing the game.
Mats will be missed.
I’m hoping I can snag tickets for Sundin night.
by Hungry Leafs Fan on Sep 30, 2009 10:07 AM EDT reply actions
I’m actually sort of bothered by how little this news is impacting me.
Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.
by Down Goes Brown on Sep 30, 2009 10:07 AM EDT reply actions
hitting me harder than I thought it would too
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions
not rather
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions
Might be because he’s basically been retired for over a year. How many Canucks games did you really see?
I really only saw him play in the playoffs so I’ve been thinking of him as retired since the 2007-2008 season ended.
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same
There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"
by Matt_Roberts on Sep 30, 2009 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions
i remember watching game 6 vs the hawks in last year’s playoffs. mats scored early in the 3rd to give the canucks the lead, and i thought that maybe mats would play the hero, force the series to 7, then play the hero to win the series for the canucks. luongo and patrick kane had other ideas unfortunately.
I said good bye after the playoffs, when his contract was up and the Nucks where eliminated I could love him again, and was pretty sure he wasn’t going to come back
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Ok
I know what I said in the other post, but I just watched the overtime winner and 500th goal and now I have something in my eye
Resident Cook and IT Superman
Truculence FTW
Sadly
I too am ambivalent about this whole thing.
Maybe we did already say our goodbyes.
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 10:35 AM EDT reply actions
I think some of us did
the night he came back as a Canuck
Un ananas (truculent) qui parle? Impossible!
He retired last year, the day after the final regular season game
and that’s how I’m remembering it.
Bye Mats
At least no one here will be cheering for the Canucks in the playoffs this year.
You were a pretty awesome fucking Leaf.
Oh, and I guess Steve Simmons was right, just off by a couple years. That guy, he’s always right!
Great leaf, not greatest….SIttler, Apps, Salming, Mahovlich, Kennedy…certainly in the modern era, Sundin stands taller than any other.
Meanwhile, the local radio here in Ottawa are comparing Spezza to Steve Yzerman…
by BesterThanYesterday on Sep 30, 2009 10:43 AM EDT reply actions
well
they both wear red jerseys and the number 19, right?
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Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
wasn’t stevie Y considered a one-dimensional player for much of his early career? lazy defensively, etc?
spezza is past the “early in his career” stage
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions
He’s also nowhere near the offensive talent Yzerman was to begin with.
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Couple of names missing from your list, but the perspective is appreciated.
Leafs Rumination: hockey and sesquipedalianism.
by puckurgently on Sep 30, 2009 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
See
This is why I don’t listen to the local media here. Too much stupid for me to handle without flying off in a murderous rage.
Being a Leaf fan here requires one to be sufficiently lubricated... and truculent!
That’s why I do MBA’s, lfstio. It’s a safety valve post.
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
by kidkawartha on Sep 30, 2009 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Remember
the good times, folks.
Sundin’s a warrior.
Thanks, Mats.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
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The guy is on fire. That’s three articles in a row I’ve liked.
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maybe someone removed his brain slug
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Poor fella starved to death
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Sep 30, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
It's a tribute to the Leafs
that I can vote “Great” instead of “Greatest”. I think I’d still give the latter honour to Killer, but Sundin really makes it close (also some of those earlier guys like Salming and Teeder).
My cousin is a Habs fan who hates the Leafs and runs down their players the way PPP runs down the Habs. He was always clear about Sundin, though – he would have had #13 on his team in a heartbeat.
I've been looking at the sky
the way PPP runs down the Habs
With aplomb, verve, and wit?
He was always clear about Sundin, though – he would have had #13 on his team in a heartbeat.
So there’s hope for him. I think that looking at his career as a whole there’s no reason for opposition fans not to have respected Mats.
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How about with tenacity and consistency? I’ll leave the wit to you; “Jim Carey Price” is an appellation that I hope turns out to be as incorrect as it is biting.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Sep 30, 2009 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
I can’t believe that you didn’t use truculence :(
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Oh, sure, you're truculent sometimes
but why weren’t you truculent in November…
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Sep 30, 2009 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions
the only
reason is that he was a Leaf. The last year he donned our blue and white, living out here, I heard about how much he sucked and how we overrated him.
Come July 1 and Gillis’ insane offer, everyone here was the biggest Sundin fan. It made me so mad.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLmwElcaF7c
I wonder why no one mentions this ad of Sundin with Gretzky. Anyway, Sundin will be missed.
“Nice shot Mr. Fancy Stick”
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I’ll have mine with large fries
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
brilliant!
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Bobby Orr as a Blackhawk
But there isn’t a video of Orr scoring the shootout winner against Boston.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Sep 30, 2009 11:11 AM EDT reply actions
yeah, but we had the class to cheer him for it
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions
That was pretty great.
I have no idea how bobby was received in boston as a blackhawk, if he even played there. I do know his agent is a dick, but everybody does.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Sep 30, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m gonna stab the next sens fan that bad mouths Sundin and then proclaims Alfie is better.
I am dead fucking serious
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 11:13 AM EDT reply actions
And I’ll help clean up the mess.
Being a Leaf fan here requires one to be sufficiently lubricated... and truculent!
I’m excellent with a shovel. Just find me a nice out-of-the-way place to dig.
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by kidkawartha on Sep 30, 2009 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
ive got some bodies piling up in the basement, ive been wondering what to do with them for years
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by Matt_Roberts on Sep 30, 2009 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions
From the outside looking in, what exactly does “greatest Leaf” entail?
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First player to score 500 as a Leaf. All-time Leaf leader in goals and second in assists. 20th most goals scored in the NHL and most overtime goals in NHL history. Nine-time all-star. Captain of the Swedish Gold Medal Olympic team. Greatest Leaf Ever.
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions
True Jared, but FloridaLeaf said:
Sundin may not be the greatest Leaf
So I was wondering why.
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well its all a matter of personal opinion. Mats wasn’t given his props until later in his career and was never held in the regard of Dougie or Wendel, he also never brought the Leafs a cup, or a run as memorable as the 93 experience that crystallized Leaf fandome for an entire generation.
The older gents will point to Hall of Famers, and cup winners as better, but I never saw em play so I can’t say yay or nay to that.
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions
“Greatest” is such a subjective term and there are several Leafs that could be debated as being the greatest based on what criteria you chose to base your argument. Choosing my favorite only has one criteria…me. I have been a Leaf fan for 35 years, but a serious one (thanks to satelite TV, internet, etc) for about 15, and Mats was “The Man” during that time. Therefore, with his skill, grace, poise and abilty to score the big goal, he is, to this day, my favorite Leaf.
Is it October yet?
by floridaLEAF on Sep 30, 2009 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Lots of great Leafs that the vast majority of us never saw play. Hard to put him ahead of guys with lots of rings I guess.
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Yeah, I guess that’s the real underlying factor here or anywhere in terms of defining a great player.
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Captain of the Swedish Gold Medal Olympic team.
With P.J. Axelsson, hell yeah!
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Sep 30, 2009 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
FYI: He’s on Frolunda now.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Sep 30, 2009 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Sorry to be celebrating a player who never played for my team in my own way, then.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Sep 30, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
I suppose that depends on how one defines greatest?
Might not have any cups to his name but statistically, he was the greatest.
It’s tough to compare eras due to changes in the game but in my opinion, he was the greatest Leaf I have ever witnessed.
Dougie is up there but having less than 5 seasons in the blue and white kind of detracts from that.
Wendel is the only other player I could make an argument for but his crash and bang style really took a toll on him as evidenced in his returning stints as a Leaf.
Picking the greatest Leaf is like picking the greatest Beatles album.
There’s so many good ones to choose from (though Abbey Road is the right answer).
by Hungry Leafs Fan on Sep 30, 2009 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions
I love Dougie but he played in an awful lot of places.
I love Wendel but his career was too short.
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Greatest in our eyes
Look, the Leafs are a franchise that rode to the top of fame and the pure bottom of infamy.
In the end though, it’s a spectator sport and Sundin with his massive reach, great shot and ability to clinch those great goals was one of a kind. It’s indicative of how entrenched he is in Leafs lore that I have trouble picturing him in a Nordiques or Canucks jersey. He WAS the Leafs in period where we had some decent to middling teams.
He was worth watching, he was worth tuning in for. And, stick-swinging and bar hopping aside, never got the tongue-waggers going.
I can only hope Schenn, should he get the “C” someday, will be as poised.
by BesterThanYesterday on Sep 30, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions
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Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 11:26 AM EDT reply actions
Greatest Leaf.
I have tonnes of great memories of Sundin. He never won a cup, but it wasn’t for a lack of effort. He was fantastic.
Brad Stowe
Maple Leafs Hot Stove
by RepressedOptimism on Sep 30, 2009 11:26 AM EDT reply actions
Definitely a great Leaf. Too difficult for me to say whether or not he was the greatest. So much history with the team, so many great players, and so difficult to compare the eras in which they played.
I think I can comfortably say that he’s easily in the Top 5, maybe even Top 3, Leafs of all time. And that’s nothing to sneeze at.
Thank you Mats. Thank you.
Being a Leaf fan here requires one to be sufficiently lubricated... and truculent!
I feel the same way I did today, that I did the day John Candy died. I’ll always remember his greatest moments and that great big smile.
(Note to Heatley and Ovechkin – go see a fuckin dentist you cheap scumbags!)
by Another Good Kingston Boy on Sep 30, 2009 11:41 AM EDT reply actions
I think Ovie likes having the tooth missing.
There was a story in a paper a little while back that mentioned he was driving somewhere in Russia and stopped at a little mom and pop type shop to buy a drink and the girl behind the counter looked at him and asked if it was really him, he said yes and to prove it she got him to smile.
Life as a Toronto Sports Fan?... *sigh*... It is what it is...
I would think that being one of the ugliest chuds in the Eastern Hemisphere, that everyone would recognize him as soon he walked in a room.
by Another Good Kingston Boy on Sep 30, 2009 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Seeing Mats as a Canuck will ultimately take on the same akward legacy as pictures of Bobby Orr as a Blackhawk, Darryl Sittler as a Flyer, or Lanny MacDonald as a Flame.
I can understand your guys’ pain over that. I’ve always been a huge Mats fan. When he came to Van it was an added bonus for me even though the road was rocky.
Thanks for the post here, PPP. I had to come over and read a Leafs perspective. You all are being classy!
Adiose Mats. Thanks for everything.
It's not a doll
it’s an action figure…
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Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 11:53 AM EDT reply actions
I have that in blue
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
i have that one
There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"
by Matt_Roberts on Sep 30, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
the only white jersey one I have is sitler
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Greatest Leaf ever?
The only year he took us past the 2nd round, we got smoked by the sabres..
oh dear…
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
He was an amazing player, dont get me wrong. But we deified him like we do all of our best players of any era. If you give some of the all-time Leaf greats 82 games a season for their entire career, they would dwarf Sundin’s numbers…
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
But the same can be said for other teams and their all-time greats.
So because the previous players can never been compared statistically together because the games played difference and game difference no new player can ever be considered a teams all time greatest?
Life as a Toronto Sports Fan?... *sigh*... It is what it is...
You give the all-time greats an 82 game season in the clutch-and-grab era with players like Jonas Hoglund, Lonny Bohonas and Sergei Berezin on their wing for most of their career and we’ll see if they still dwarf Sundin’s numbers.
by Hungry Leafs Fan on Sep 30, 2009 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions
ding ding ding
Sundin lit it up in the dead puck era.
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Sundin scored more than 80 points once in his entire tenure with the Leafs. there were consistently 15-20 players league-wide with more points than him each and every season. If he is our greatest, then that doesnt say much about the Leafs
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions
ONCE?
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=5252
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions
sorry, was lookin @ pims, haha… so he hit 83 twice and 94 once
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions
big whoop huh...
lots of guys retire at a better than a point a game pace.
he’s in the top 25 points ALL TIME.
have some respect…
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not disrespecting him.. my first post said I thought he was amazing.. just not the greatest ever
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
well, who is the greatest then, and why?
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Sittler.. Over 30 goals a year for 8 years straight. If he played as many games as Sundin, he would have more points.
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
In his career Sundin had five seasons under 30 goals and one of them was the 95 lockout season where he scored 23 in 47GP. Another was his rookie year and a third was last year in Vancouver.
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[Sundin’s the] Greatest Leaf ever? The only year he took us past the 2nd round, we got smoked by the sabres..
Sittler’s your favorite Leaf?
Jesus didn’t need a brother to be great. Neither does Luke Schenn.
Gilmour is my favourite Leaf. and Sittler was a damn good one too. and either of them could be the “greatest”. but by your own words, for a Leaf to be the greatest (as you ascertain Sittler was), he has to have taken his team past a 3rd round demolishment vs the Sabres
Jesus didn’t need a brother to be great. Neither does Luke Schenn.
No, i was giving one reason as to why Sundin wasn’t the greatest. The fact that Sittler didnt win us a cup either is a reason why he might not be the greatest as well. Thats why this is all conjecture
So then byt that logic, nobody could be considered the greatest Senator of all time…
Actually, I’m okay with that.
Resident Capologist
by clrkaitken on Sep 30, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
also
being in the top 20 of 300+ players every year is a pretty freaking special accomplishment.
Sure he’s no Tim Brent, Alternate Captain to the Silver medal winning2004 Canadian World Jr’s team, sadly he’ll have to hang his hat on:
First player to score 500 as a Leaf. All-time Leaf leader in goals and second in assists. 20th most goals scored in the NHL and most overtime goals in NHL history. Nine-time all-star. Captain of the Swedish Gold Medal Olympic team. Greatest Leaf Ever.
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Mogilny, Roberts, Gilmour… you can twist it any way you want to
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly, You could also twist it around and say if Sundin played in a different era where he wasn’t being hauled around and hooked he would of scored more.
Life as a Toronto Sports Fan?... *sigh*... It is what it is...
I’m just trying to put things in perspective. I judge “greatest” on what one has achieved for the club. We’ve got a long and storied history that dates back almost a century. Its great to be passionate, but to throw the “greatest” tag around so loosely kind of mocks some of those other players
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
And despite a century of history Sundin is our all time goal scoring leader.
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50 years ago, they played about 25 games a year
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions
a couple years of an aging Mogilny, a declining doug gilmour and Roberts, who i loved, but was never to be mistaken as an offensive dynamo….yeah
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
it was an example.. Lonny Bohonos played on his wing for about 6 minutes
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions
the point is, Sundin never had a plethora of allstars on his wings
Mario and Jagr
Gretz had any number of players
hell even Spezza had heatly.
and while Mats never was gretz or mario, im pretty sure their wingers helped out their career totals a might
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions
The Leafs were a regular playoff team for a good portion of Sundins time here. He had a solid team around him
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
you mean
he had a solid goalie behind him
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
?
what I am saying is that while Sundin obviously didn’t do it all on his own, his most successful years weren’t do to an improved supporting cast but top notch goaltending in the playoffs.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
None of whom were in their prime when playing with Sundin.
The point is Sundin never had an elite winger on his side during his time with the Leafs.
Some other notable stats
Sundin scored 20+ goals in 17 straight seasons (including the lock out shortened season!)
How many other players can you say did that in the dead puck era?
25+ goals every year he was on the Leafs except the lock out shortened season.
by Hungry Leafs Fan on Sep 30, 2009 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Sittler scored 30+ goals and had more than 80 points for 8 straight seasons. Sundin had more than 80 points in only 3 years out of his entire career. Not saying Sittler is the greatest either, but it cant be so cut and dry as to who is the greatest ever. (which is the only thing i argued)
by laple meafs on Sep 30, 2009 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Give Sundin games in the 40s, 50s, and 60s and he’d destroy the league.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
guys like lemieux? the only guy ever even close to lemieux was gretzky
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
who was Ron Francis playing with? Jonas hoglund or Lonny Bohonas?
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by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions
He was playing with Mario Lemieux, one of the top 3 or 4 hockey players to ever play the game.
He was playing with Jaromir Jagr, quite possibly the greatest European to ever play in the NHL.
Doug Gilmour is my favorite Leaf, but he’s jack squat compared to those two.
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Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
naslund, nedved and murray were pretty good back then too
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions
absolutely
Kevin Stevens scored over 50 goals playing with Lemieux one season.
comparing Sundin to Lemieux is pointless. No one on here is saying Sundin is Lemieux-esque in talent…
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Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
and speaking of Stevens
after leaving the Pens and not playing on a line with Lemieux and Jagr, the most he scored was 20 something.
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by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions
of course having jagr, lemieux, neved, zubov, naslund and murray didnt help that out a might
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions
And unfortunately, the Leafs’ greatest player isn’t one of the three greatest players to ever play in the NHL.
You’re confusing Greatest NHLer ever with Greatest Maple Leaf.
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You’re bringing up players that have nothing to do with the Leafs as a reason to say that Sundin isn’t the greatest Leaf.
No one’s saying you can’t disagree. A lot that saw him play would say Keon was the greatest ever. But don’t say “well Gretzky got 212 points 7 years before Sundin was in the NHL so Sundin’s not the greatest Leaf”.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
he was
and Lemiuex is one of the top 3 players of all time. Don’t post his point totals to put down Sundin.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I posted his point totals to prove that goals were scored in his era. By alot of players not named Lemieux as well
Lemiuex
was in the league earlier, and was older. You can’t compare.
Also, you’re forgetting the quality of linemates discussion.
No, Sundin is not the greatest NHLer ever. He wouldn’t even break top 10.
But he was a Great Leaf, and I don’t think anyone can dispute that.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Greatest??? who are we to say unless we’ve seen them all play
We can say that at this moment he is the greatest if we think it and hope that some day someone will come along and smash his records.
And if they do they’ll have had one hell of a career.
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Kadri!!!!1
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Sundin would score ten goals a night every night against opposition from the 40s.
You can’t compare players across eras mainly because in the past players used to show up to camp out of shape. Unreal.
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You just said that he would put up ten a night in the 40’s. But then say that you can’t compare players across eras?
Which is exactly why you can’t compare players across eras.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
well then we cant say gretzky was the greatest oiler ever, or lemieux was the greatest pen ever
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Sittler did a lot less for the Leafs than Sundin. He’s been eclipsed in points despite Sundin playing in the dead puck era.
If he’s not the greatest then argue about Leafs that are greater.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
ok then, you cant say Richard was the greatest Hab ever, or Hull the greatest blackhawk, whatever
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions
it wasnt me that said you cant compare players across eras…
You can make a case for many players: Conacher, Horton, Sittler, Salming, Sundin… whos right? I dont know. But you cant say withits Sundin just because hes got the most points and scored the most OT winners
I just paypaled you ten dollars US.
Buy two beers and toast with whoever mentions my name first to Sundin and the 09-10 Leafs.
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by Chemmy on Sep 30, 2009 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions 8 recs
Already rec’d.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Sep 30, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Mats Sundin
is what made me fall in love with hockey. I didn’t realize it until last year, when I saw him first step on the ice as a Canuck and I realized how much I missed him. He was my favourite player for years (even though if you’d asked me at the time, I would have had a different answer) and he’ll always have a special place in my heart.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:04 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Anybody else notice that we’re now using eyebleaf’s arguments against somebody who is arguing what we argued when Mats was still a Canuck? I love us.
It just proves that I was right.
My point is: this is not the day to flog Sundin. Everyone’s done that for way too long already. Celebrate the career that was.
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agreed
this is not the day to flog Sundin
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Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
We’ll leave that to his lovely bride. Oops………..
"We've had an ongoing problem with Grabovski this year." Bob Gainey, 4/04/09
by kidkawartha on Sep 30, 2009 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions
i never used those arguments against mats, i just maintained that I was sore at him for being a Canuck, and that ended when the playoff run ended
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions
No we're not
A. we can bitch about his place in team history for the rest of time but not today unless it’s to stir up trouble. Especially when using examples of players from different eras.
B. the arguments with Eyebleaf, for me at least, centred around whether what Mats did was right not whether he was a great Leaf.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Mats is making his home just outside of Toronto or something according to Leafs Lunch. eye better start stalking. :)
We’re going to be very happy together.
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
If Mats is close by tomorrow then Burke needs to drop a surprise bomb on the fans and have Mats do the ceremonial faceoff.
that would be amazing
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions
please
Please make this happen, Burkie.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes
The roof would blow off.
I’ll always fondly remember being at the game where he took the all-time Leafs scoring record and got TWO ovations because they took away an assist that had appeared to give him the record the first time—so he had to do it again.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm going
to be rocking my Sundin Jersey all day tomorrow. SUNDIN FTW
A Nation of Masochists I can't believe "Stay Truculent!!!1" replaced goodbye.
Domi is on the FAN590 telling Sundin stories, such a great listen.
The more I reflect on Sundins career today, all the videos and memories of the great things he did on the ice, combined with hearing Domi tell us how much the players respected him and how much Sundin loved Toronto, the fans and the Leafs makes me want to punch all the Sundin haters right in the teeth.
Looking back to how he left the team makes me pissed still, it wasnt his job to fix JFJ’s mess and after all the years he spent as our captain he didn’t deserve to get slagged the way he did.
I will always respect Mats. One of the greatest Leafs ever. I hope he gets a job in the organization one day and I cant wait for #13 to be raised to the rafters.
There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E"
And on the Mats Sundin note: Happy Trails, Komikazi and Kabby have been named alternates. We are expected to have a captain by Nov.1.
link?
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=686638
It’s dirty hfboards but they got it from Leafs Lunch with Dreger and Watters.
you can speak to birds?
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More ESPN stupidity
Burnside doubts that Mats is a Hall of Famer:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/story?columnist=burnside_scott&id=4519619
Really? Bernie Federko yes, but Mats Sundin no? This shouldn’t even be a question. I don’t know if he’s the greatest Leaf ever—this team has a long history, and it’s hard to compare across eras—but he’s a Hall of Famer.
he forgets that it’s more than just NHL accomplishments. Mats’ contributions at the Worlds along with captaining sweden to the Olympic gold will also be remembered.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Scott “Who Will Score For Toronto?” Burnside is a dipshit.
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My Response
Bad news Marcel Dionne!
Despite your 731 goals, and 1771 points, and status as one of the greatest players of all time, Scotty here says that even though your career resume is an absolute lock, the voters have to go back and think about whether you belong in the Hall because you never played in a Stanley Cup Final.
Resident Capologist
also
Cam Neely, remember that HHOF induction thing…? Ya about that…
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Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions
he wasnt a leaf
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I think Neely has a good argument based on his peak abilities and his physical element, but you’re right, Sundin blows him away in durability and overall stats.
And if you’re into the “clutchiness” thing, Sundin was involved in a disproportionate number of huge overtime game-tying or game-winning goals
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
i thought I heard at one point that Mats had scored more goals in the 3rd period than any other player in history…
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions
captian clutch
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions
I’ve actually heard that used against him. The fact that in the clutch at times he appeared to almost score at will was used against him in that he didn’t score basically every time he was on the ice. Ridiculous.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions
haha
it was frustrating because you knew he had it in him to dominate the game, but he always saw it as a team game and wanted to make his teammates better.
He was never, ever selfish like so many superstarts of today.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions
And under Quinn’s system he didn’t play 24+ minutes like a lot of comparably skilled players did.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Bingo
Until Maurice came along Sundin was averaging around 18-20 minutes a game.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Active points leaders:
Rank Player PTS
1. Joe Sakic 1641
2. Mark Recchi 1442
3. Brendan Shanahan 1354
4. Mats Sundin 1349
5. Mike Modano 1329
6. Jeremy Roenick 1216
7. Teemu Selanne 1212
8. Sergei Fedorov 1179
9. Rod Brind’Amour 1165
10. Keith Tkachuk 1033
I think it’s fair to say that almost everyone on that list got more ice time and better linemates than Mats.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s all about the Mats love today.
One more point I can’t resist about quality of teammates. Sakic led his team in scoring 12 times. Mats? 13. I don’t have time to go through everyone on the list but I can’t imagine anyone but Modano even being in the conversation on that point. If he got the opportunities some of the guys on the list above did he’d be a lot closer to Sakic, put it that way.
I’m not saying Mats is as good as Sakic. He wasn’t. But I think he is hugely underrated.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions
i’m not knocking him, it was more a shot at Burnside’s blatantly obvious negative bias towards all things Toronto, which drives hits, which ensures he has a job.
so i don’t read him.
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m going to leave this here because arguing it doesn’t belong in this comments section. Sundin is a hall-of-famer, Disney is a joke.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Sep 30, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions
agreed
I think Neely is a hall of famer, and I’ve got no beef against him. just using Burnside’s logic to point out the ridiculousness of it all
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by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I want
a calendar that has all Sundin pictures.
If I make one, do you think somewhere would print it, or do I run into the copyright law problem?
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 1:00 PM EDT reply actions
if you do it on Shutterfly, I think you’ll be fine.
"Sanity is not statistical." - George Orwell, a Leafs fan...
Stalk me here...
by blurr1974 on Sep 30, 2009 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Definitely a copyright issue, but if you look hard enough, you can almost definitely find a printer who doesn’t care.
Leafs Rumination: hockey and sesquipedalianism.
by puckurgently on Sep 30, 2009 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions
you are adorable when your excited
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions
i’m mad busy at work too.
i can’t wait unitl tomrrow
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WOOO
I BELIEVE IN HOCKEY!!!1
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by JaredFromLondon on Sep 30, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
SEE THIS POST FROM DR. MIRTLE
http://www.fromtherink.com/2009/7/9/943044/the-dead-puck-eras-top-scorers
A Toronto sports blog, where unabashed homerism is alive and well...
Some greats
Conacher, Jackson, Broda, Apps, Kennedy, Mahovlich, Keon, Horton, Sittler, Salming.
Sundin’s in the mix, just not sure where.
In terms of the single most dominant player of his era, I find it pretty hard to look past Charlie Conacher.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
Best player I ever saw
Short duration or not, was Gilmour. Mats is #2.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
I am with the 67 club on this.
Still, my top five favorite Forwards for the leafs(as in guys I got to see play regularly)
Doug
Mats
He of the #17
Mike Gartner
Mogilny – I loved that crazy Russian
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Sep 30, 2009 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions
If you go by Cups obviously all but the last two trump Mats, but I think that’s unfair. They played in a 6 team league with dominant Maple Leaf teams. I think we can just go by importance to the team.
Conacher led the league in scoring 5 of 6 years but his career (at least as a star) was basically over at 26.
Jackson wasn’t as good as Conacher.
Apps’ career was also short and if you account for only 6 teams, the fact he was in the top 5 in scoring a fair amount is less impressive.
Kennedy was a great leader but couldn’t touch Mats in scoring prowess.
Mahovlich is an interesting argument but he’s as much a Hab as a Leaf.
Keon? I just don’t see it.
Horton and Salming? Great D men but I can’t put them in Mats’ class.
Wow, I thought it was impossible to even consider but just in terms of dominance, longevity and importance to the team I think it has to be Sittler or Mats. And I give Mats the edge based on longevity and playing in the dead puck era—with bonus points for international play. Remember, a lot of people in Sweden thought that Sundin—not Forsberg—was their best player.
Fact of the matter is the Leafs have traditionally been about physical, team play, not dominant superstars. They haven’t generated superstars like Morenz, Richard, Beliveau, Lafleur, etc. I think maybe I’ve talked myself into Mats.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions
The Sweden thing is a big one to consider. With guys like Lidstrom and Forsberg it still wasn’t a question (as far as I know) who was going to captain Sweden.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
You end up talking about peak value. Conacher was the dominant player in the league before injuries caught him. 1930’s medicine doomed him.
Mahovlich is in no way, shape or form as much a hab as a Leaf. He was a Leaf for 10 seasons, a Hab for 3 1/2. He was an six-time all-star as a Leaf, once as a Hab. The Habs try to claim him, but he’s not theirs. It’s like saying Jacques Plante was every bit as much a Leaf as a Hab.
Apps’ career was short because he put 2 1/2 years into the Army. You look at the awards and accolades, though, and he was something else.
Horton was still an all-star at 39 and has 200 more games played than Mats.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
Bloody reply fail....
At no point in his career was Mats considered the best in the league at his position. Both Conacher and Jackson were, and by large margins.
I really like Mats. I think he’s today’s Norm Ullman and that’s something.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
This is like Koufax vs. Sutton. No question Conacher, Jackson and Apps had higher peaks. But if I could pick someone’s career individual performance I’d most like for my team, I’d have to go with Mats.
Mahovlich… it’s like he’s tainted by the Habs stench. Interestingly though, his career really makes a point about the Leafs’ style. He only topped 73 points once with the Leafs and was usually in the 50s, then exploded for 78. 70, 73, 96, 93 and 80 with other teams.
Maybe Kennedy and Apps would have scored a lot more on more freewheeling teams.
But Teeder only led the LEAFS in scoring twice. The linemates factor comes back. You almost talked me out of it but I’m sticking with Mats.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
You’re welcome to, but don’t be knocking the rest of them. That’s crazy talk. :)
I can’t call Mats the best ever because he wasn’t the best I ever saw. Even though his duration counts for a lot, I felt Gilmour’s peak years were better.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
You’re right, I didn’t mean to knock them. I think Leafs stars of the past get underrated for the reasons I’ve alluded to. We should all remember Conacher, and Busher, and Teeder, and Syl, and all the rest (my first “favourite Leaf” was Bill Derlago) … and include Mats near the head of the class among them.
And I’ve never seen anything like Dougie’s two peak years.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions
There's also the great incomparable
Broda.
He might actually be my pick. Still leads this team in wins despite having many of his seasons contain <50 games.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
Yeah, goalies are different. I can’t even try to compare them to skaters. We’ve had some greats.
by The '67 Sound on Sep 30, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Teeder couldn't touch Mats' scoring?
He was top 5 in points three times, led the league in assists once, twice in the top 5 in goals. Add in three second-team all-star selections and five Cups – two as captain – and that’s not too shabby.
Remember that the early 50s was far, far more of a dead puck era than this last one.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
Don’t you old people know that everything today is better!? ;)
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
heh
If there’s one thing that irks me, it’s the “today’s players would maul yesterday’s players” talk. They might, but then again, they might not.
Everything comes down to the rules of engagement. That’s how a ragtag bunch of barbarians wipes out a Roman Legion.
How many games in the series? What rules standard? What equipment? How many bodies in the lineup? Do goalies get masks?
Let’s play today’s Leafs in a one-game match against the 1914 Blueshirts. Leafs get only seven skaters and no substitutions after the first, plus no mask for the goalies and they have to stay on their skates or it’s a penalty. Who wins?
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And you had to smoke 2 packs of Camels per period, and one during each intermission
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Sep 30, 2009 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions
so what you're saying is
Carey Price wishes the NHL was still back in the 50s?
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions
IDEA
All these great Mats stats being discussed here, i think i’m going to have no choice but to create a “This is Why Mats Sundin is the best leaf ever and most underrated player of his generation” spreadsheet. It will be hosted on the interweb for all time so that anyone looking for evidence of mats’ greatness will have it at their disposal.
haha
it’s very hard to make a case for greatest Leaf ever – for any player – but Mats is DEFINITELY the most underrated player of his generation.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I made one of those once (this is the great irony of me standing here talking about peak value). One of the great hidden stats about Mats is that they keep talking about the number of times he finished in the top 10 in scoring. Nobody seems to realize that on two other occasions he was 11th and once he was 12th.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
He was also a rediculous face off man.. don’t have the stats handy, but pretty sure he was in the top 5 in the league for many years
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Sep 30, 2009 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Sundin
is the reason why I’m a Leaf fan…what a sad day this is…
Allright kids, the word of the day is "Truculence"
A few things about Mats...
1. You cannot possibly argue the fact that Mats never got to play with great linemates for 90% of his career and he’s still up there in points with the best.
2. He is 5th all-time in Game Winning goals. He has 5 more game winning goals than Wayne fricken Gretzky. The man was clutch. End of fucking story.
3. He is #1 ALL-GOD-DAMNED-TIME in overtime goals. See last two sentences from point #2.
4. He captained his country to a Gold Medal in the Olympics and assisted on the game-winning goal. See last two fucking sentences of point #2!
5. I was sitting in the 4th row behind Kipper that night when Sundin scored his 500tyh which was also a hat-trick completing goal, an overtime goal, and the game winner. I’ll always love him for giving me and my friend that moment.
6. Last two sentences of #2, and don’t you fuckiung forget it!!
All the best Mats, enjoy sitting on 70 million with a hot wife with nothing to do but collect hobbies and memories. Wish it was me…
by The Muppet on Sep 30, 2009 3:18 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Mats
Was good at so many different things, but never the best at any of them.
Great goal scorer, great playmaker, great PP guy, great faceoff guy, great puck cycler, great downlow guy, great puck pressure guy etc etc.
Was he the best in any of them? No, not really. This is why Sundin is so underrated. He did ALL of these things at a high level, but never was at the top of any of them.
also, best backhand shot FTW
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
Albert Einstein
by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Sep 30, 2009 7:19 PM EDT reply actions
Yes!
Very underrated backhand…which also happens to be a very underrated skillset.
by Hungry Leafs Fan on Sep 30, 2009 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Stupid Canucks fans
listened to the radio a bit on the way home. On not even a talk radio station, they said Mats Sundin retired from playing hockey today, you may remember him as a Canuck last year, although he didn’t play much for them when he was here….
Ingrates.
"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero
by Karina on Sep 30, 2009 11:13 PM EDT reply actions
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