We said ‘what if, okay so what if it's Tyler Seguin or Taylor Hall?' What if it is?
We were prepared to make that [trade]. We got a 21-year-old who scored 36 goals in the NHL last year. I'll make that trade again today.
Check out the rest of the press conference over at the Globe and Mail.
about 2 years ago
Chemmy
265 comments
0 recs |
Email
PrintComments
What is he supposed to say?
“Shit, I never should have made that trade”
He should have just shut his fuckin pie hole
Fairweather fans can go to hell
When people ask him silly questions, they get silly answers.
Brain: The irony of it all, Pinky. Years of trying to take over the world, and all I had to do was say "truculence".
Follow me I'm Boring!
by blindfolded tank driver on Jan 14, 2010 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
He was kind of screwed if he did/screwed if he didn’t on this one. I guess he’s at least solidly on record saying he thought of the possibility of the Leafs giving up a lottery pick?
In the Name of the Holy Truculence
What I like is that he isn’t (appearing to be) panicked about having that on his record. That limits the chance that he’ll do something short-sighted to get out of it.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
I’m really surprised that no in the media had the stones to point out Burke traded a Hall/Seguin this year, plus a second round pick and another first rounder next year.
Wait. Actually, I’m not surprised at all.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Yeah, who knows how deep the draft class is going to be next year?
If we ship out Kaberle plus a couple of our free agents at the deadline, then the Leafs will be even WORSE off next year, thus even more likely to give the Bruins a lottery pick in the 2011 draft.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
Well
This one was up until September so I wouldn’t stand by that assessment so far from the draft.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
If we ship out Kaberle plus a couple of our free agents at the deadline, then the Leafs will be even WORSE off next year, thus even more likely to give the Bruins a lottery pick in the 2011 draft.
Part of that will depend on how badly the Leafs’ freshly signed overpaid UFAs underperform next year.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Also on how much said upcoming UFA’s ask for. Overpaying for a player is still overpayment even if losing that player weakens your team.
In the Name of the Holy Truculence
Ok guys, let’s get thru this season and this offseason before we debate about 2011
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Yeah
It’s depressing enough now without having to talk about failures that haven’t happened yet!
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
I think it's depressing
that we have to think about another losing season before we can even think about sneaking into the 7th or 8th playoff spot in the following season.
And I think it’s even more depressing that the earliest the Leafs will return to respectability is 2012-2013.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
Welcome to the rebuilding process.
by PassivelyTruculent on Jan 14, 2010 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
RESPECTABILITY 2012!!!!111
Ya, it continues to be difficult to bleed blue and white
Leafs Nation: A drinking team with a hockey problem.
by nhlcheapshot on Jan 14, 2010 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
you mean
his unlicensed use of the HNIC logo for personal gain had nothing to do with it!?!?!?!
so glad you’re here to show us the light.
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 2:57 PM EST up reply actions
In terms of answering the question.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
haha, burke is a dick
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 1:50 PM EST reply actions
I’m not sold on Burke being the GM who will save this team, but he does produce some great quotes.
by Its Cold In Here on Jan 14, 2010 1:52 PM EST reply actions
Are your colleagues in the GM business being kind to you these days?
Oh yeah, we’re getting wonderful offers. It’s a great group. It’s like watching National Geographic and there’s a dead zebra and there’s vultures everywhere. Only the zebra’s not dead yet.
He should stop threatening the refs though.
by Its Cold In Here on Jan 14, 2010 1:54 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I think it will be OK
as long as Leafs management lets him try to do his thing for a good number of years. Lets say 10.
Same with Wilson – Burke’s right that firing him would be a boneheaded move. Lindy Ruff is a great example of what a coach can do, and what he can’t.
Things will turn around one day. Soon the baggage like Blake and Toskala, and what’s left of Tucker’s buyout will be gone.
I recommend playing Toskala from now until the deadline, and hopefully letting him build what passes for skillw ith him. Maybe someone who needs a backup will give us a 2nd round for a semi-competent Toskala at the deadline.
Things will turn around one day. Just not this year.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 2:29 PM EST up reply actions
If you had 10 Toskalas playing for 10 seasons I don’t think they’d post 10 shutouts, in total, between them.
You might get a 10th round pick for all 10 of them though. Teams do need to hit the salary floor.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
The way Fergie [former GM John Ferguson] rigged this was very smart. John Ferguson’s taken a lot of abuse in this market and a lot of it’s not fair. The way this was rigged was, he has a no trade – but if our team misses the playoffs, the no trade disappears from when the draft begins until the middle of the summer, I think it’s August 15th. So at that point, the player is subject to be traded to 29 other teams. He loses any control he might have over that process.
Last year, Tomas’s agent gave us a list. I won’t take less than 10 teams. So he said to me, if Tomas wants to keep some control over this process, what about if we give you a list of teams? I said it had to be double digits, 10 teams – I’m not taking three teams or five teams. If he wants to do it, it’s got to be double digits.
nice…wait
The way Fergie [former GM John Ferguson] rigged this was very smart
whaaaaat?
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 1:53 PM EST reply actions
To be fair
It set it up so that if the team is good they have a very valuable piece and if they are not they can move a good contract during one of the most active trading times.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
heh, yeah, I agree, and to be fair, while having a NTC the Kabby contract was a good one, it was everything else that makes me hate JFJ
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
It wasn’t ideal but it could have been worse.
Fuck, that’s what it’s come to :(
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Cliche time!
“Even a broken clock is right twice a day.”
…… So….. what was JFJ’s OTHER decent decision?
In the Name of the Holy Truculence
dominic Moore
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 2:04 PM EST up reply actions
I was never a big Kubina fan, but I also thought they brought him in to fill the wrong role. It seemed like they wanted him to be a hitter when clearly his strengths aren’t in that area. His passing is certainly solid and as it turned out he has a decent shot.
In the Name of the Holy Truculence
If, after five years on a high-profile job, my single biggets accomplishment was a lone sub-clause in a single contract I’d pretty much expect my next job to centre on saying: “You want to supersize that?”
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
he wasn’t a bad player, this is true.. but he was signed when we already had McCabe and Kabby.. his signing was bad in terms of distribution of cap money.. it would be like the pens going out and getting another top flight centerman (wow the i think i found the only possible way to compare JFJ era leafs to stanley cup champs)
I can wear it one day, then not wear it the next day. It's like a pair of glasses, some days I wear it, some days I don't. I'm not wearing any underwear either. There is no reason. - Mogilny "on Visors"
by AkiSchennberg on Jan 14, 2010 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
The problem with that signing, which I feel is the same about Finger’s, is that they signed a player that needs to play a certain role to justify their salary (# 1PP) and then they never really used them in that role!
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Yeah, it could have been worse. Instead of trading a first round draft pick for a dud, twice, Ferguson could have traded two first round picks for a dud!
Oh wait, it IS worse!
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
Anyway
I guess the point here is that it was not necessarily that he assumed that the Leafs wouldn’t pick in the lottery and if he is to be believed then the truth is that after consultation with everyone relevant that they thought it was still a worthwhile deal if it was Hall/Seguin straight up.
Not sure if that makes me feel better but it’s on the talent evaluators and Burke.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
A lot depends on if they’re right about Kadri, in that case.
"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into Iraq"
- Major Mike Shearer
Yes
He’s not backing down from his plan.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Burke is selling FAs on the Leafs...
Does that mean you don’t listen to offers or be tempted?
I don’t know what part of that wasn’t clear. I’m not going to ask him to waive it. It’s for much bigger reasons than a particular deal – every player in this organization knows there’s fairness and equity here.
That to me goes well beyond as far as our ability to attract free agents, to get people to come here, that notion that players know they’ll be treated fairly rises above any deal or offer I might get on one player.
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 1:55 PM EST reply actions
Which is why even though everyone is howling for it that he is not demoting veterans that are working their tail off just to cover the mistakes of a predecessor.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Then why did he say the opposite to start the season?
(sorry – do not mean to snipe the overlord).
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 2:26 PM EST up reply actions
This has been a huge beef of mine. Nothing undermines accountability faster than hollow threats.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Although I was pretty pissed that some of the younger guys didn’t get the chance with the big club after preseason I think it’s become clear that the bozak’s, hanson’s and kadri’s could still use the development. As for not sending the vets down? See PPP’s reply below – “LOL”
In the Name of the Holy Truculence
It’s not really about whether he does or doesn’t. It’s about meaning what you say and saying what you mean. Or just be quiet.
Maybe I’m a little frustrated, eh?
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
I hear you. I was insanely angry about this even as early as the final roster cuts. In the intervening period I’ve come to the opinion that I’d rather Burke changed his stance as the season progressed (if that is indeed what has happened,) than stick to his guns on this matter and disrupt the development of the young players.
In the Name of the Holy Truculence
Maybe he sees that the vetran players are playing to the best of their abilities and simply suck? The youth is better suited not learning to be dominated by real NHL’ers and destroyed by the media, he would hide salary (as he said he would) but there is no real need to as the team is losing and there is no better use of dollars immediately available, and such a move would simply disrespect a player.
I can wear it one day, then not wear it the next day. It's like a pair of glasses, some days I wear it, some days I don't. I'm not wearing any underwear either. There is no reason. - Mogilny "on Visors"
by AkiSchennberg on Jan 14, 2010 2:54 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly, so we send Exelby to the marlies… what do we do with the million dollars we get back against the cap? Nothing.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
It’s not about finding cap space, it’s about creating a new culture and holding players accountable.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
I don’t see how sending a player to the minors, and not being able to call him back up without putting him on re-entry is holding them more accountable than just sitting them.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Ask Burke, he’s the one that threatened it.
Let me be clear: my whole point is that Burke is full of hollow threats and it’s a detriment to the team.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
He said he isn’t afraid to send players to the minors and bury their salary. He never said he WOULD do it as soon as someone underperformed. Other than Wallin, nobody has played CONSISTENTLY poorly for more than 4 or 5 games.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Well that’s why he isn’t playing much, we aren’t going to send him down and call up joey joe joe
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Toskala and Wallin have ceratinly played poorly for more than 5 games. Mayers too.
You don’t get to 28th place without being consistently bad.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
I don’t mean overall, I mean like 5 games in a row. Mayers will have a few bad games, probably gets chewed out or threatened, and then steps it up for a bit.
Wallin is a bit of a mystery but who knows what he was guaranteed in his signing.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
If we’re letting a marginal NHLer hold a playing time guarantee over our head for a marginal goaltender we’re pretty fucked.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Don’t disagree there. But who knows how many friends Wallin has back in Sweden who he could tell and blacklist the Leafs for signing SEL players.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Pretty sure Frogren’s got that part covered.
by PassivelyTruculent on Jan 14, 2010 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
The worst part is that Frogren was a lot more useful than Wallin
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Frogren was fucking terrible and cost us a draft pick.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
I still think he was better than Wallin. And Frogren didn’t cost us the pick, he didn’t draw up the contract.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
He was a shot blocking monster, for a #6 or #7 dmen I think he was pretty good.
by PassivelyTruculent on Jan 14, 2010 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
i would resign frogren
this offseason. for like $1M.
Seriously, he was a perfectly capable third pairing guy.
The leafs just have too much money on the backend as it is, they need so cheap minute-munchers
He’s better than Exelby and much cheaper than Finger (while being only slightly less effective)… I’d take him over either as a 6th or 7th guy any day.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
I totally agree
I don’t care for Burke’s big mouth, I want to know if he has big balls.
If he has some balls to him, he’ll dump every damn pending UFA we have at the deadline for picks or properly scouted prospects. ALL OF THEM. Not just Toskala and Wallin. Poni, Stajan, Hagman, White.
He needs to have balls to do that because that will practically guarantee a lottery pick to Boston. It’s not what Burke needs. But it’s what this team needs.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 3:05 PM EST up reply actions
Hagman’s a UFA in 2012.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
yeah, but at 3 mil a year, you can trade him now.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
For what though?
Rival GM’s are lowballing Burke (as he said metaphorically in his press statement), are you going to be happy if he gets a 3rd/4th round pick for him?
by PassivelyTruculent on Jan 14, 2010 3:15 PM EST up reply actions
You really think we need to dump Poni and White?
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
God, I really need to finish that Ian White article.
Getting rid of him, unless we get a king’s ransom, is a HUUUUGE mistake.
Resident Capologist
Toskala Cap Counter - only $1,860,966 to go!
Why?
Because he’s a “fan favourite”? He “works hard”?
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 3:12 PM EST up reply actions
No, because I pored over the stats from last season and the first half of this season to find the most comparable players to Ian White.
The end result is that there are some pretty solid No. 2/ No. 3 defenceman on the list, and White performs better than them on several fronts.
I’m finishing the post tonight after my hockey game. Expect something tomorrow.
Resident Capologist
Toskala Cap Counter - only $1,860,966 to go!
by clrkaitken on Jan 14, 2010 3:13 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
how about
he’s good
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
Because he’s our 2nd best defenseman, he’s young, hes a team leader, and he has the potential to be MUCH better.
We trade Kaberle: we get more than we would for White, and we know what we’re giving away.
We trade White: He could end up being a franchise defenseman.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
“and he has the potential to be MUCH better.”
No, this is where I disagree. White’s as good as he’s ever going to get. He’s good because he works hard not because of talent.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 3:14 PM EST up reply actions
And you know this how?
He’s offensive, he can keep the puck in the offensive zone when it seems impossible, he’s got great vision, and he’s a good skater. He also can hit and fight.
You have no way of knowing how much talent he has that he can still unlock.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
[White] is a team leader.
Shield – I would really encourage you to talk to any of the beat reporters that cover the Leafs. Ask them if White is a team leader. Would love to know what you hear back.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
MF
You said you play with media types, have you heard otherwise?
Im not siding with either, just curious
Fairweather fans can go to hell
They all speak very highly of White. Good quote, good interview, nice guy.
They’re reaction on questions of leadership are VERY different.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Now you are just teasing, this is getting me intruiged.
I’m not disagreeing, just interested in how a nice guy, who’s a hard worker and obviously cares a lot about his team, can be a poor leader.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Send Mirtle an emal and ask him.
I’m amazed at how many reporters are willing to exchange emails if you’re rational and keep it short.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Agree
Berger’s actually answered three of my sanes e-mails, Eric Francis too, but you only get one follow-up. They are “too busy”
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Where have you heard he isn’t? His interviews seem to get shown a lot on Sportscentre, Sportsnet, etc, meaning he is obviously someone who’s opinion the reporters care about.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
A buddy lived in the same building as him during his first couple of years in Toronto. Said he was arrogant, entitled as hell, then he got busted for a DUI and then driving without a license (which he got caught doing because he was driving without a seatbelt).
His reponse was basically “So what?”
The guy works hard, plays well, but I don’t know if that makes a leaer.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
during his first couple of years in Toronto
A lot has obviously changed since the start of last season on the ice, could it be possible that a lot has changed off of the ice as well? My personal guess has been that marriage and fatherhood have made him grow up.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Definitely
I’m not privy to those changes as I was to his problems.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
before i go to work.
there’s a story about white in juniors coming back after the WJC or some tournament and not giving a SHIT about his teammates or the team, and not practicing or lifting weights.
I’ll try and find the source later and post it. But needless to say the story surprised the shit out of me.
Who wants to hear a funny ass joke?
here is one site
that posted a piece on Ian White from a book
This has been posted many times over, but what the hell
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Yeah I remember that junior story as well, the bus and the benchpress thing. But as said before, how he acted 3-6 years ago has little or nothing to do with how he acts now that he is an adult.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
yesterday on Leafs Lunch
Watters asked him about that first goal by Staal. To paraphrase, he admitted he made a mistake BUT their should have been a winger there as well.
Come on, dont say that shit on the air
Fairweather fans can go to hell
To quote Bob Slidell
he’s a straight shooter with upper management written all over him
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
I agree that that should come internally BUT I think White messed up. He effectively vacated the lane Staal used to score. Forget the winger, he followed the puck across to his d partner.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Oh he totally screwed up, the argument in his favour here (which he would DEFINITELY not say on the air) is that he screws up a lot less than most of the guys on the team.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
I agree
I’m just thinking that he shouldn’t be on the radio aportioning blame
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Oh no doubt, social norms and what not, though I would much rather live in a world where being a little more truthful about these things was accepted. I’m sure we’d be doing a lot less guessing about things such as the Wallin issue.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
i'm down with keeping White
But given he’s going to cost, say $3M a year, we can’t keep him and Kabby. WAY too much money on D already
So as much as I’m a Kabby fan, I’m fine with signing White and then trading Kabby in the offseason, restocking the prospect cupboard and giving White the minutes.
I really don’t see how we can have both. You cant have 5 Dmen making north of $3M a year in the NHL and win, i dont think
Exactomundo. Signing White for 3-3.5 mil while trading Kabby will save cap room next year, and even more in the long run considering how much it would be to resign Kabby when hes up.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
No, I agree. it’s a one or the other proposition.
Resident Capologist
Toskala Cap Counter - only $1,860,966 to go!
And considering the time it will take before we get competitive (after Kaberle needs to be resigned for around $6m per), it makes more sense to go with the younger, cheaper option that we can sign for 4 or 5 years.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Ian White plays against harder opposition than Kaberle.
Ian White plays with worse teammates than Tomas Kaberle.
Tomas Kaberle’s +/- relative to the team is -0.09.
Ian White’s +/- relative to the team is +0.038
http://www.behindthenet.ca/2009/new_5_on_5.php?sort=6§ion=&mingp=40&mintoi=15&team=TOR&pos=D
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Basically, Ian White could probably last more than 3 minutes in a fight against Wendel, which is 2 minutes and 59 seconds longer than anyone else in the league right now.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
I didn’t mean that literally… it was more of a Chuck Norris type analogy.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
As much as he's surrounded by whiners
I think Rick Rypien would try… he’s crazy enough to have a go.
Prefers pugnacity to truculence.
Ian White scores twice as many goals per 60 minutes of ice time as Kaberle.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Ok, let’s objectively measure how good he is.
What would White fetch at the trade deadline?
What would Kaberle fetch at the deadline?
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 3:18 PM EST up reply actions
That depends on if you’re measuring their worth in terms of trade value or what they deliver on the ice.
In a salary capped environment, I’d rather have six Ian Whites than six Kaberles.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Check the stats, I’d take Ian White in a non-capped league.
Not a big Kaberle fan and I haven’t been for a while.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Ok, here’s the point I was trying to make.
What’s an acceptable trade deadline deal for Kaberle?
A 1st rounder.
What’s an acceptable trade deadline deal for White? (who’s younger)
A 2nd + a conditional 4th.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 3:23 PM EST up reply actions
How is Kaberle worth a first rounder?
conversely, how is White worth a 2nd a 4th?
Are these numbers you’ve arbitrarily decided to apply here, or do you have something to back them up?
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
I’m guessing its from past offers.
by PassivelyTruculent on Jan 14, 2010 3:27 PM EST up reply actions
This. It is impossible to evaluate their values without knowing what the team that is trading for them is needing. If its a bubble team with injuries on the blueline and/or a lack of offensive dmen, then they are worth more.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
I don’t think Burke would trade Kaberle for less than a 1st rounder, and at the deadline, to an injury ridden post Olympics team, that’s what he’ll be worth.
White? Well, I think he’s worth what Gill was worth, and what Antropov was worth – a 2nd rounder at minimum, maybe with a conditional on top of that.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 3:31 PM EST up reply actions
Kaberle + first = Kessel.
Don’t see Kabby netting a 1st. Not with the change in approach GMs have made to the draft due to the cap.
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 3:33 PM EST up reply actions
Kaberle + 1st for Kessel would mean Kaberle is worth a lottery pick.
SOMEONE CALL CAROLINA
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
So you want to trade Kaberle, check.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Exactly, Kaberle would get more, and White is a serviceable replacement. We also know how good Kaberle will ever be, we don’t know how good White will be.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
kabby fetches more
which is exactly why he’s the one to trade.
Buy low, sell high.
No
Because he’s really good on a bad team.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
It still comes down to issuing a very ill advised threat and promoting a culture of un-accountability by not following through.
Wallin has to have the worst pts/60 of any forward in the NHL.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
He is sitting though? That is still retribution for his suckiness.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
He’s played in 34 of 47 games, averages 11:47 a night, has 3 assists to show for it. I can’t begin to measure how bad that is.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Okay but there’s nothing we can really do with him… I also think he is useless and a liability in terms of giving up the puck, but I would rather just sit him than send him down… maybe everyone likes him? Maybe he is really trying to get better? There are an infinite number of possibilities for why he is being kept around that we would have no way of knowing about.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Okay but there’s nothing we can really do with him.
Really? Wallin can be waived, loaned to a Euro league or sent on a late night post-pub drive with Ian White.
388 NHL forwards have more points than Wallin. I’d hate to imagine where he’d rank in terms of pts/60.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
I get all of this, we can say what we think or what we want, but there is no way we can know what Burke and Wilson and Nonis and the rest of the coaching staff and management know. There has to be some unknown reason for what they are doing with him and I still think that sitting him up in the press box is a pretty good way of holding him accountable. Its better than sending him down or getting rid of him and having a young guy sit instead.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
There have been loads of waiver wire fodder that would have provided better results than Wallin.
ZIgomanis likely would have been an upgrade, the Leafs held his rights and they let him go to Europe.
You’re absolutey correct that we don’t know what the MLSE brain trust is thinking. But if this is their idea of accountability, they’re doing it wrong.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
I guess I have to believe that Burke knows what he’s doing because if he doesn’t know what he’s doing it’ll be a decade before this is a playoff team and I’m not sure I can wait that long to even be “decent”.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
I just wish he’d keep his mouth shut. Every time he opens it, it just raises more questions.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
I wish that our playoff drought won’t hit ten calendar years but here we are.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
We’ve got, what, four more years to go?
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
wooo over half way there!
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah and honestly we’re not making the playoffs this year or next year. Better hope 2013 is a great year.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Unless Wallin continues to sit for the next 7 or 8 games, and then gets a few games to prove himself, and is re-evaluated from there.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Good ol’ fashioned blind faith….I’ve lost it.
And why is Burke keeping mum on this unknown reason, but willing to blab about everything else?
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 3:30 PM EST up reply actions
has anyone asked?
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 3:31 PM EST up reply actions
I would guess that during this disaster of a season they want to expose as few youngsters to as few games as possible so that they don’t get labelled as part of the problem.
It’s been his MO to try to shield youngsters to different extents, it’s something the Red Wings do as well.
Wallin allows Burke to run a professional hockey player there and take the heat while the kids’ develop out of the spotlight.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
I like it when people say the things I was thinking but didn’t know how to express so well.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Which was why radical changes didn’t come during the crappy start at the beginning. Imagine the kids came up and struggled? Then it becomes: the kids suck! and they get bombarded by the pressure.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
…and never develop properly, get traded for late rounders in a few years, and end up being serviceable journeymen who could have been much better had they not been exposed to the hostile environment of being on a losing maple leafs team.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
This
is the best answer yet.
and
Poor Wallin, ha ha
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 3:40 PM EST up reply actions
However, again, the fact that Burke couldn’t see this before…He’s a paid professional, and he whiffed on this season.
But that’s just this season, and there is plenty of work to do.
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
Based on the players that he was using to shield the kids, the seasons they had last year, and the additions he made I don’t think he was off-base.
The players just haven’t performed.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
PPP – where did you see this team placing in 2009-10?
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
It’s probably written somewhere but 8th place if things broke well, likely 9-11 otherwise, which unfortunately puts the team in a precarious position if things break poorly.
I think a lot of fans issues are tied up with the way that they gotten where they are which doesn’t give a lot of hope that it’ll be better next year.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
If this year has demonstrated anything it’s that goaltending covers most sins.
If you have a question mark in net, the season will be a question mark.
I figured Toskala would continue to be middling and Gustavsson wouldn’t be a total saviour (these are the Leafs afterall, things don’t seem to break their way).
That’s why I went with 12th.
That said, I didn’t think they’d be this bad.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
goaltending covers most sins.
Watched the 1999 series against the Flyers and that is definitely true. The Leafs’ top six featured…wait for it…Christ McAllister. Yikes.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
devil's advocate
Who on the Marlies has played so “lights out” that a spot on the Leafs is being kept from him due to protecting a veteran?
Burke has said if they’re playing well, they’ll get called up. Stalberg was playing well with the Marlies, as was Hanson and both were given a shot and promptly did nothing. No better than Wallin, so back down they go. Wallin stays up, entry level deals don’t get days burnt off them and the kids keep working on their game.
I believe you’ve said yourself that you’d prefer the kids be insulated from a losing, high stress environment. To have them developed properly and not rushed. That’s what it appears Burke is doing.
That’s a good thing, no?
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 2:40 PM EST up reply actions
It sure is a good thing. And that was always the expectation. It’s not easy to make the jump from the NCAA/Juniors to the NHL.
So then why say otherwise? My guess – put the fear of god in the Vets. Doesn’t seem to have worked.
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
Blake knows he’s retiring as a Maple Leaf – he knows he’s too crappy to be traded as a salary dump, he’s got too much time left on his contract, etc. He’s safe.
by Peter de Chatham on Jan 14, 2010 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
Burke looked at his line-up and he publicly declared, in the most media intensive environment in the NHL, that he would waive, trade and general purge the team of those who underperform or are unwilling to pay the price.
That’s fine, but what are the probable outcomes?
1) Some vets step-up and meet the challenge – it’s all good, Burke has delivered
2) Some vets falter, but the kids step-up – Burke can promote from the Marlies, and follow through on his threat.
3) The vets falter, the kids don’t step up. – Burke has now issued an empty threat, the team lacks accountability and his hands are tied.
Well, guess which one happened?
I’d like to think a leader or anyone with some strategic vision could have seen this coming and mitigated the risk by not opening their mouths.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
so
who gets purged, and who replaces them?
Beyond Wallin of course (that’s a given…)
curious is all.
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 2:49 PM EST up reply actions
The problem is, there’s lots to purge and none to replace – and it’s not like that outcome wasn’t particularly obvious.
Knowing that this was a likely outcome, Burke should keep his mouth shut.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
It makes
us question his foresight and assesment of the talent in the organization
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
really?
we’re spiraling into “All is lost” territory here.
The Leafs were a bad team that outhustled and outworked just about every team they faced in the 08-09 season. Goals were never a problem for the team, it was ALWAYS about goaltending.
Many, many, many an article was written over the off-season with GM quotes relating that the work Burke had done with the Leafs could very well be a success. They looked big. They looked motivated. Maybe not talented, but given the previous season, another year of hard work with better goal-tending could help the Leafs improve.
Suddenly, with hindsight, Burke is the only moron who never saw it coming…
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
Not
saying all his lost, just moved from blind faith, to questioning him. Serious.
I gotta say… I don’t think every Leaf fan/pundit agreed with Burke’s assessment. I think many a blogger, especially, made it known otherwise. I myself, included. But I put some faith in him. I’m starting to lose it. That’s me. I use this area to vent. (I do apologize for that, sucks to read a grown man cry)
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 3:35 PM EST up reply actions
sucks to read a grown man cry
It’s drier than having to watch!
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
It’s drier than having to watch!
TWSS?
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
There are several issues here, and unfortunately, I think Burke missed the boat on all of them.
The first is how this season might unfold. Burke, stupidly, used the word “playoffs” about this team. To be fair to Burke, he didn’t say the team would make the post-season, but he did say they would compete for the post-season.
This is not a media market or fan base that handles nuance very well.
In this instance, Burke should have been WAY more careful in his choice of words and left it as the team would “compete.”
I don’t think it’s a matter of hindsight either. I’ve said all along this team would finish out of the playoffs and likely in 12th in the east.
VUCOTA had the team dead last.
Almost every pre-season fan drive poll I saw had the Leafs out of the playoffs and in the bottom third of the league.
When you look at how many people predicted a bad year for the Blue and White, it’s not a case of hindsight.
Burke promised everyone a “truculent” team. I hated that word then and I hate it even more now.
If there’s one word that could describe the 2009-10 Leafs, truculent sure isn’t it. Permiter-players, softness, awful, talent-less – those words work.
Pugnacious? Not so much.
Burke was wrong again and perhaps if he hadn’t used six different words for “tough” it wouldn’t be something that’s so noticeable.
Lastly, he said this was a team that would be held accountable and that he’d use waivers or trades. He’s done neither.
I haven’t lost it.
I don’t think Burke is a moron.
But I do think it’s more than fair to question his decisions to date, to point out his errors, and to ponder about the future of the club.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
by mf37 on Jan 14, 2010 3:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I still kind of like to believe that he is playing the vets to improve their trade value for the deadline.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Sadly, I think that’s the only option the team has.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
And therefore, as the only option, make the option of sending down/waiving/sitting vets an impossible one, meaning Burke is doing the best he can?
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
Um, no.
A distinction has to be made between those that are good for a pump and dump and those who will not increase in value or return anything of value.
The former should be replaced to promote an agenda of accountabilty, the latter should be played judiciously to increase their value.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
I totally agree. I’m in a logic class right now so the future lawyer in my was just pouncing on the “only option” part of your comment. Just joshing around.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
My beef with VUCOTA is that even if it gets the final placement right, it does it for all the wrong reasons.
It suggested, for example, that Kaberle was going to hit for about 31 points and that there would not be a single forward who would score 20 goals. It suggested that team defense was going to be one of the points of improvement. It suggested that Tim Brent would play almost half a season.
If VUCOTA nailed the final ranking, it’s the 1-in-30 roll of the dice working out.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
I don’t really care for Vucota, or Baseball prospectus, or what have you.
They make relatively wimpy projections. If they happen to be right, it’s “hey! we are so smart!”
and if they’re wrong, it’s “well, we would have been right, but all of these things out of the player’s control went wrong”.
Point remains: this isn’t a matter of hindsight, lots of people predicted this would not be a good club.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
The charge was one of hindsight.
If people predicted this would happen, it certainly can’t be called hindsight.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Depends why.
If people predicted this team would struggle because they still can’t find their own end with both hands, then they have been proven right.
If the prediction was that the team would struggle because despite their newfound defensive excellence and top-flight goaltending, an offense dependent on Tim Brent just wouldn’t get it done, then no, they get no credit.
Leaf, the universe and everything.
Toronto is 19th in goals for and 30th in goals against.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
For me, it was too many questions in goal, lack of forward depth and not enough personnel changes on the pk.
Oh, and the general pessimism that goes hand in hand with following this club for 30+ years.
It also helped that a a hockey guy I know also said that this would be the worst year for the Leafs because of a number of the decisions made during JFJ’s tenure, mostly that lack of any talent that could step up if the current line-up faltered.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
It also helped that a a hockey guy I know also said that this would be the worst year for the Leafs because of a number of the decisions made during JFJ’s tenure
So you cheated?
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Not cheating per se, I benefitted from an informed opinion.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
Bingo
They had 3 goalies playing 30 games each.
It’ll be a fluke.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
right there with you
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 3:10 PM EST up reply actions
LOL
No problem. I can’t remember the exact quote but I have been kicking around a post on why he’s probably not doing it.
I think it was to the effect that he wasn’t afraid of hiding salary down there but clearly in his mind there were caveats.
As much as we love Burke’s quotes there’s definitely something to be said for discretion (which I hear is the greater part of valour)
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
“As much as we love Burke’s quotes there’s definitely something to be said for discretion (which I hear is the greater part of valour)”
agreed x…oh I don’t know….x …let’s say … x1 million.
Wendel Killer Joseph
by MapleLeafMole on Jan 14, 2010 2:39 PM EST up reply actions
As much as we love Burke’s quotes there’s definitely something to be said for discretion (which I hear is the greater part of valour)
Agreed.
by PassivelyTruculent on Jan 14, 2010 2:44 PM EST up reply actions
I believe there was an interview with Nonis in the Star where Nonis alluded to Burke’s penchant for letting his mouth get him in to trouble.
wish I could find the link, as I recall it being a really well written piece….
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 2:48 PM EST up reply actions
Lasont one: my favorite re: Wilson's job security due to his friendship with Burke
Some people will say that’s because you guys are friends?
Some people would be idiots if they said that.
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 1:58 PM EST reply actions
Burkian wit is awesome sometimes.
Brain: The irony of it all, Pinky. Years of trying to take over the world, and all I had to do was say "truculence".
Follow me I'm Boring!
by blindfolded tank driver on Jan 14, 2010 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
I don't like that statement
Only because literally, it reads that some of those people would not be idiots.
Prefers pugnacity to truculence.
Maybe I just spend too much time with lawyers...
…beacuse I’d love to know if Burke is wililng to talk to Kaberle’s agent about waiving the NTC.
Burke could get a list of teams from the agent and pull the trigger on a deal while legitmately claiming to have never spoken to Kaberle about it.
Bitter Leaf Fan: because sometimes there's no option but to be bitter...
i linked it earlier
but Burke has already done that once.
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
While Burke is clever enough to do it that way, I think he likes to project the image that he would ask Kaberle first
Brain: The irony of it all, Pinky. Years of trying to take over the world, and all I had to do was say "truculence".
Follow me I'm Boring!
by blindfolded tank driver on Jan 14, 2010 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
Obviously if he says “i’m not going to ask him” he is basically telling teams “don’t offer me anything for Kaberle unless it blows our socks off”
Basically he is keeping the upper hand on any potential trades, if he says he will ask Kaberle or has asked him, he loses that advantage and tells everyone he is selling.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
What about Bob Gainey or Bryan Murray? They’re going to be jobless at the end of the season
Space Weed Says (Insert Generic quote about blog here)
"DO NOT get stuck behind Kyle Wellwood in the buffet line. This isn't really etiquette, but it will prevent you from starving to death"- Down Goes Brown on Etiquette for Jason Spezza's wedding
by Kevin Sellathamby on Jan 14, 2010 2:58 PM EST up reply actions
I was kidding around
Space Weed Says (Insert Generic quote about blog here)
"DO NOT get stuck behind Kyle Wellwood in the buffet line. This isn't really etiquette, but it will prevent you from starving to death"- Down Goes Brown on Etiquette for Jason Spezza's wedding
by Kevin Sellathamby on Jan 14, 2010 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
Sure, because Tallon did a superb job in driving that team thisclose to salary cap hell.
The Blackhawks would have been good anyway… and for potentially a longer timeframe than they might now… without some of Tallon’s boneheaded moves.
leaf fan stuck in ottawa, a localized black hole that will suck everything in that area to oblivion.
Dale Tallon? He did yeoman’s work in ensuring that the Blackhawks have one chance to win the Cup before the team has to be torn apart.
Granted, that is one chance for Tallon’s team v. one Stanley Cup for Brian Burke.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
we're feeding it, aren't we?
I have nothing interesting to say.
by blurr1974 on Jan 14, 2010 3:30 PM EST up reply actions
That’s such a copout.
If Bryan Murray were responsible for Anaheim winning a Cup, then the Cup would say GM Bryan Murray.
But it doesn’t, so it’s unprovable that he deserves the credit.
Resident Capologist
Toskala Cap Counter - only $1,860,966 to go!
the easiest thing to do is point to the great success that Murray’s had in Ottawa.
"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky
by Karina on Jan 14, 2010 4:44 PM EST up reply actions
exactly
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
In all fairness, that team would be A LOT different had Muckler chose Chara over Redden
Fairweather fans can go to hell
true, but Murray’s done a great job of screwing up the rest of the team.
Campoli for a 1st?
"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky
by Karina on Jan 14, 2010 4:48 PM EST up reply actions
Phil Kessel is more than one first round pick better than Chris Campoli.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
but no one mentions that because it was….well ottawa
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 4:51 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, I’m pretty sure we all feared Chara much, much more than Redden.
"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky
by Karina on Jan 14, 2010 4:51 PM EST up reply actions
Redden was McCabe who was slighly better defensivly and not as good offensivly also replace the stupid hair with a coke habit
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 4:52 PM EST up reply actions
Nope
Chara was already a physical, minutes-eating beast with a shot that could tear a goalie in two.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
hahaha
Ok, sure. I can see why you chose the username.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
best parts
Burke on the Leafs tendency to come back:
“I’ve never been impressed when a guy brags about how hard he’s perspiring shovelling dirt back in a hole when he dug the hole.”
Burke on his fellow GMs:
“Oh yeah, we’re getting wonderful offers. It’s a great group. It’s like watching National Geographic and there’s a dead zebra and there’s vultures everywhere. Only the zebra’s not dead yet.”
Honestly? I’m not sold on all of his moves, but i would really LOVE to have a beer with Brian Burke
I don't want anyone to panic but...
i would really LOVE to have a beer with Brian Burke
That’s how Dubya got elected…twice!
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Yeah but the second time around most people wanted to have the beer with him so they could break the bottle over his head.
Resident Capologist
Toskala Cap Counter - only $1,860,966 to go!
and yet, the result remained the same
Brain: The irony of it all, Pinky. Years of trying to take over the world, and all I had to do was say "truculence".
Follow me I'm Boring!
by blindfolded tank driver on Jan 14, 2010 3:35 PM EST up reply actions
Lol
I would love to have a beer with Jack Layton, though I would never vote for him.
Moustache Fever, not to be confused with swine flu.
I would really LOVE to have a beer
Down Goes Brown - Unapologetically nostalgic for the past. Brutally realistic about the present. Grudgingly optimistic about the future.
by Down Goes Brown on Jan 14, 2010 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
Your wife might get a cold some day and you’ll be able to sneak a quick sip while she’s sleeping.
Keep your chin up buddy.
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
Hey there, Mr. Grumpy Gus. When life gets you down do you wanna know what you’ve gotta do? Just keep skating, just keep skating, just keep skating skating skating. What do we do? We skate, SKATE! Ha, ha, ha, ha, ho. I love to skate. When you want to skate you want to skate.
They call me Splodeybones.
Sadly No
I checked the CBA too.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
if that was possible, id leave the kessel trade and take back the raycroft fiasco
THAT is the trade that will hurt the Leafs the most for a while
Puns, Innuendo and Bad Spelling, Yes We Got That
by JaredFromLondon on Jan 14, 2010 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Latest Puck Daddy - NHL from Yahoo! Sports
- Evan Trupp scores behind the net goal, stuns Las Vegas in ECHL (Video)
- Saturday’s Three Stars: Another Malkin 5-spot; Price spoils Sundin night
- The Chicago Blackhawks’ losing streak is bad for everybody
- According to NHL, here’s why Dominic Moore escaped suspension for Fedotenko hit
- How Mats Sundin’s no-trade clause controversy made fans reconsider loyalty in NHL
Latest stories and headlines from NHL.com
- WHL Roundup: A look at Saturday's games
- Shinnimin scores twice and adds assist as Americans beat Chiefs 5-3
- Reid with three goals and an assist as Winterhawks beat Thunderbirds 7-2
- Willick scores twice, including winner, as the Blazers beat the Rockets 3-2
- Simpson 41 saves, earning the game`s first star, as Silvertips beat Giants 4-2
SBNation.com Recent Stories
StatCounter
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
