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My Mount Puckmore Four

Editor's Note: Here's another Mount Puckmore this time from our resident historian.

I've tried coming up with a lead paragraph that cleanly explains my thought process in making these choices.  They haven't worked.  Instead, I'm going to jump straight into my list and explain each choice as I get there.  (Apologies for the formatting, apparently you aren't allowed to centre things in fanposts anymore.  The more one learns....)

My Mount Puckmore Four:

Hap Day
Ted Kennedy
Doug Gilmour
Bill Barilko

Star-divide

Hap Day

One_horton01_medium

Hap Day instructs a young Tim Horton and (I think) one of the Hannigans - via www.legendsofhockey.net

 


Scj05_24a_medium

Hap Day enjoys a Cup with Stanowski and Metz - via www.hhof.com

 

 

Clarence "Happy" Day was an original Leaf.  A holdover from the St. Patricks, and one of the few Conn Smythe chose to keep around, he was the Leaf captain for their first full season and wore the C for a decade (though I don't think they actually wore a 'C' in those days, so it's figurative).  The teams he played for sported names like Conacher, Primeau, Jackson, Clancy and Horner - hall of famers all, but it was Day who led them.

That's not the reason I chose him, though.  Day is there as my executive.  In choosing Day, I'm bumping Conn Smythe.  Smythe is the owner who made so much happen.  He bought the team, he changed the name (though this might have been in the works anyway), he set the tone.

Day, though, took the Leafs and made them champions.  The teams of the 30's had a ton of flash and dash, but also had a tendency to get to the Finals and lose when it mattered most.  Day was the one who developed and implemented the defensive system that would make them champions and that ultimately defined what winning Leaf hockey was all about.  Succesive leaf coaches maintained this.  Joe Primeau won the 1951 Cup with the Leafs still playing Day's system.  Even Imlach owes a lot to Day. 

It's all forgotten now, but Day was very well-known for his defensive systems.  Late in his career, when asked how it was that he played defense so incredibly well despite his age, Tim Horton would remark, "Are you kidding?  I broke in under Hap Day."

 

Ted Kennedy


Ted Kennedy makes my list as the prototypical Maple Leaf.  Gritty, intense, hard-working and both offensively gifted and defensively sound, he was a natural choice to succeed Syl Apps as captain.  Fans who watched Kennedy play were convinced he'd never survive playing the way that he did.  The strain of it would destroy him, it was thought.  It never did, though. 

I have long thought that the kind of love that Leaf fans held for Ted Kennedy has translated into a preference for players who in one way or another emulate him - guys who are visibly working out there, guys who aren't necessarily graceful in all that they do, but will tear themselves to pieces trying to succeed.

 

Doug Gilmour

Doug Gilmour is kind of Kennedyesque, in that sense.  Having read the comments in the FTB, I kind of conclude that my choice of Gilmour may be an age thing.  People who grew up watching Sittler are Sittler fans for life.  My mother swears by Dave Keon. 

I missed out on the Leafs of the late 70s because we didn't live out here.  For me, I knew the Leafs of the 80s, the ones where Ballard was at his worst, and where the teams were most in flux.  I never saw a Leaf team that was actually good.  The closest we ever came was in 1989-90, and then that was torn to shreds before our very eyes.  It was a completely dismal time.  It is because I lived through those teams that I'm not that perturbed about the recent streak of bad play.  Compared to where we were in 1991, I'm positively thrilled about the team we have today.  There is hope now.  There was none then.

Into that mix came Doug Gilmour.  The Leafs didn't make the playoffs that season, though they made a great run that ultimately fell short when the season was cancelled for a week (nobody remembers this).  His 1992-93 and 1993-94 seasons were the best that I have ever witnessed by a Leaf player.

The most dramatic thing, though, was what it meant to be a Leaf fan.  He resurrected this franchise.  Leaf fans, many of whom had disappeared into the woodwork hoping for an end to Ballard, got their first taste of sunshine in over a decade.  It actually became possible to talk smack as a Leaf fan.  The teams of '93 and '94 didn't win the ultimate prize - they weren't deep enough and the loss of Cullen and Borschevsky to injury was crippling, but they restored the honour of this team.

Gilmour, to me, played the best hockey I have ever seen a Leaf player play.  Add to that his role in killing the Ballard era and he merits inclusion on my mountain.

Apparently, in choosing Gilmour, I have to explain why I'm not choosing Sundin.

Let's be clear - I I like Mats Sundin.  A lot.  If I had a seven person mountain, he'd be on it.  I'd probably have to add Conn Smythe back in as my fifth, and at 6-7 I have to start looking at the Hortons, Salmings, Clancys and Apps(eses) of the world, but I don't think I'd get past seven before Mats was there.  I choose Gilmour over Mats for two reasons:  First, Gilmour, though for a shorter duration, was the best player I ever saw here.  Second, he was the catalyst behind the end of the Ballard era.

Mats was a fantastic player for a long time.  I watch a lot of old games on LeafsTV and I'm always stunned by just how good Mats Sundin was.  The guy was money.  I think Mats Sundin suffered from "big player syndrome" much like Frank Mahovlich did.  Big guys, just by virtue of their size and shape, don't appear to be working as hard.  They don't look like they're skating as hard or as fast and they rarely get the credit for the effort they put in.

I never held the "traded for Wendel" thing against Mats.  Besides, Wendel was back twice after that.  I made the comment that I never believed in Mats and his teams the way I did in Gilmour and his.  That comes off as a shot at Mats when it really isn't.  I never believed in anything again that way.  Again - that might just be an age thing.  Or I can blame Kerry Fraser, which is easier.

 

Bill Barilko

For my last choice, I'll start this way: there are three photos in hockey that I think are truly iconic.  There is Bobby Orr scoring against Glenn Hall in 1970.  There is Yvan Cournoyer bear-hugging a jubilant Paul Henderson in 1972, and there is this one:

Billbarilkocolour_medium


Bill Barilko, apparently, isn't to be included on the mountatin because his tenure was too short, he wasn't the dominant defenseman of his era (though Turk Broda would beg to differ) and he's primarily remembered because of the circumstances of his death.  Some of this is true, I suppose.  His four Cups in five NHL seasons is a matter of happenstance, to an extent.  And the mystery surrounding his death, the whole bit about the Leafs not winning another Cup until they found his body - well, that's nothing to do with him, really.  Again, it's just circumstance.

At the same time, ask yourself this - if there is one figure in Leaf history who truly is wrapped in legend, can you come up with one bigger than Bill Barilko?

Obviously, his death plays a part in it - but so does the death of Georges Vezina and Howie Morenz.  It's that layer of tragedy that makes the story so compelling.  Bill Barilko was an up and comer.  He'd come to the Leafs out of nowhere to make the team in 1946.  He was brash, good-looking and hit like a freight train.  If he hit you, you were "Barilkoed."  Everyone knew who he was.

And yet he could play.  Turk Broda called him the best defenseman he'd ever played behind.  His game was become more rounded, more polished.  He was poised to anchor the Leaf blue line for another decade, at least.

The goal he scored in 1951 was risky, a gamble.  He left his position on the left point to chase a puck in no man's land with the Richard line on the ice for Montreal.  Hooking skates with teammate Cal Gardner (heading to cover him at the point), he was prone and out of position if that puck went back up ice.  And this was overtime.  It worked, though.  Bill was the conquering hero.  And then he was gone.

His disappearance occupied the minds of Leaf fans for a decade.  While it was generally assumed he had perished, all kinds of crazy rumours floated.  The plane was overloaded because they were smuggling things.  Barilko had survived and had gone back to Russia to train their hockey players.  Anything.  The only difference between Barilko and Presley was that Bill was never seen flipping hamburgers in innumerable roadside diners.

The players found out that his body had been located during the Stanley Cup parade in 1962.  The significance was not lost on them.

This is the stuff legends are made of.  Sometimes, legends trump stats, at least on my mountain.


Barilko_300_medium

via cdn.nhl.com



So there you have it.  That's my four.  Too late probably, but out there just the same.

PensionPlanPuppets.com is a fan community that allows members to post their own thoughts and opinions on the Toronto Maple Leafs and hockey in general. These views and thoughts may not be shared by the editor of PensionPlanPuppets.com.

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Still don’t think Gilmour belongs on this list, and I really think Conn Smythe does.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 3:49 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m torn on Barilko. He is legendary, but I have a hard time figuring out why, exactly, he really matters to the Leafs in this day and age. I read Barilko – Without a Trace and thought it was great, but if anything it kinda swayed me to thinking that Barilko’s death is the only reason any fans still know his name. I really, really think one spot should go to one of the players who left the NHL to go to war. Maybe Syl Apps?

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

If I didn’t have Kennedy, I’d probably have Apps.

Barilko was kind of a criteria-based selection, too. I had my exec, I had my type-definer (Kennedy) and franchise-saver (Gilmour – yes, it’s MO) and I started to look for something larger than life, something that set itself apart just by nature of the story. That was Barilko.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Conn owned the team. Day made it happen.

IMO, anyway.

Gilmour is kind of a lightning-in-a-bottle thing. We’ve never had that since.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah but

Smythe built the leafs. He built MLG. He found players like Syl Apps. He’s gotta be there.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

For a lot of the time Smythe was "GM, " it was Selke and Day who did all the spadework – so says Howie Meeker, at least.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think I can be swayed from Smythe’s inclusion.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

but I also don’t see why you can’t have Smythe AND Day. Day was both player and coach, Smythe owner and GM.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

’Cause I only had four spots and nobody ever talks about Hap.

Personally, I think Hap Day might be the single most influential person in the history of the Leafs, at least among the people who did not own them.

Plus – go buy “The Leafs in Autumn.” It’s cheap.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh yeah

I was thinking about that this morning.
It’s actually in the library here, I’ll pick it up tomorrow.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

I read “the Boys of Summer,” which was his inspiration. “The Leafs in Autumn” is definitely the weaker of the two.

That said, it’s really interesting to hear from these guys. I’m not sure how many are even still with us.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also –
this fanpost is choppy as all get out. I’m out of writing shape and it shows. Gotta work off that writing gut.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have a secret little editor who fixed up my crap for me from time to time ;)

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Very well done. I think there’s a very strong case for Day; I marginally favour Smythe, but Day’s role as player AND coach gets him very, very close.

For me, I knew the Leafs of the 80s, the ones where Ballard was at his worst, and where the teams were most in flux. I never saw a Leaf team that was actually good. The closest we ever came was in 1989-90, and then that was torn to shreds before our very eyes. It was a completely dismal time. It is because I lived through those teams that I’m not that perturbed about the recent streak of bad play. Compared to where we were in 1991, I’m positively thrilled about the team we have today. There is hope now. There was none then.

This perfectly captures my feelings (we must be about the same age—I’m 35). Gilmour is #1 on my personal Mount Puckmore, but if I’m taking a broader view of the franchise as a whole he’s not even top 10.

Barilko’s an interesting choice—really comes down to your criteria. I can see the argument, certainly.

Glad to see Teeder on your list.

by The '67 Sound on Aug 10, 2010 3:55 PM EDT reply actions  

exactly, see below. A lot of this depends on your terms, which we’ve never been able to straighten out.

The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway

by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on Aug 10, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great list. I liked your explanation about Barilko.
This gimmick is somewhat ambiguous and allows for multiple interpretations. This is good and bad. If the writer’s interpretation is at odds with their readers it can get ugly. Just got and read the Hawks one and see how riled up people get. I think that when it comes down to it, the idea is not to list the 4 most talented players to have played for the team. The idea is to pick the four people who have shaped the publics’ perception on the team throughout it’s history. Unfortunately, as pointed out in this post that still leaves some ambiguity. Like you said a player like Barilko was a legend in his day and has become a folk hero/icon since that time. I really liked Birky’s idea of including Foster Hewitt. I think that I will agree with you on Kennedy and Day as it is clear that they defined what being a Leafs means to this day. I get your reasons as to why Gilmour should be there, but that’s what Sundin was for me. I remember when he went down in the playoffs and the team kept winning, all I could think was: “When Sundin comes back we’re going to be unstoppable”. I used to take it for granted that we would not only make the playoffs, but that we would win at least one round, Sundin was the reason. All that said My list has become:
Day
Kennedy
Sundin
this space still open.

The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway

by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on Aug 10, 2010 3:56 PM EDT reply actions  

The idea is to pick the four people who have shaped the publics’ perception on the team throughout it’s history.

So…. Harold ballard?

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I really can’t decide, I mean to me it would be appropriate to see him there. At the same time I think that focusing on the positives of our history is in keeping with the spirit of Mount Rushmore.

The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway

by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on Aug 10, 2010 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah I think it’s a real toughie. I do not want him there, but depending on the criteria, you almost have to.
Of course, I would rather have 3 people from pre-1967 on there, and then throw a player on – maybe someone like Sittler or Salming – as a tragic figure who probably would’ve been recognized as a League Great if it weren’t for the crap that Ballard pulled.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

That would be an interesting selection/explanation.
I’m okay with glossing over the negative to celebrate the positive. I understand why the guys from the Hawks put up both Wirtz. I would just rather give credit to some people who get lost in the past.
Although if we include Ballard maybe the Habs will include Rejean Houle, I read somewhere they were similar.

The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway

by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on Aug 10, 2010 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Similar the way a nagging cold and full-blown pneumonia are similar…. ;)

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is it true that stem cells may fight the aging process? … In the same way an infant may fight Muhammad Ali

The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway

by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on Aug 10, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

If the baby is colicky, my money is on the baby. :)

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m thinking Sittler would be the 4th there. He was the only player who ever really scared Ballard, and I think that’s worth something.
I’d almost go with 2 pre 67, Sittler and then someone modern.
Crap this is hard.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

it’s not a toughie. germany wouldn’t put hitler on their mount rushmore, would they?

Yesterday is dead, but not my memory.

by daoust on Aug 10, 2010 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is it considered bad form

To continue a thread after a comparison to Hitler has been made?

Awfukkit, I’m a rebel.

by Spezzal Teams Playa on Aug 10, 2010 7:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

depends on who you ask

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 8:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

i doubt it.

the idea of putting ballard on there is just f8cking preposterous to me, and borderline insulting. he was a plague on this organization. he shaped the public’s perception of this team, but in the worst possible way. that shouldn’t be celebrated or commemorated.

Yesterday is dead, but not my memory.

by daoust on Aug 10, 2010 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was talking about Hitler.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

i know. hence ‘i doubt it’. that country has spent 50+ years trying to forget about him, they’re not putting his mug on a mountain any time soon.

Yesterday is dead, but not my memory.

by daoust on Aug 10, 2010 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm with daoust here

No way Germany would allow Hitler to be recognized in any manner, good or bad. The country has a hard time trying to forget he ever existed.

Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell

by bkblades on Aug 15, 2010 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Your whole Ballard theory is so strangely compelling. I really don’t know how I feel about it, it’s like the two sides of my brain are squaring off. The “unabashed hate” side vs. the “logically, it makes pretty good sense” side.

Me: Any idiot could see that.
Mrs. P: You're not just any idiot, you're the most special kind of idiot.

by Sergei Puckizin on Aug 10, 2010 8:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha

It totally depends on the criteria. If that criteria is solely who had the biggest effect on the Leafs, he’s up there. If it’s about who best represents the franchise, he’s not.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

it’s pretty obvious that the original mount rushmore is meant as an homage to great men who had a hugely positive influence on America, not miserable old f8ckers who almost ran the country into the ground.

Yesterday is dead, but not my memory.

by daoust on Aug 10, 2010 8:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yea, and that to me is the main idea, it’s about focusing on the positive contributions, not just the notorious ones.

The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway

by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on Aug 10, 2010 9:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

But much like Sam Fels alluded to in his Blackhawks piece, the patrons of the Mount Rushmore sculpture were doing just that – focusing on the positive contributions of four men who were human, and therefore flawed.

So in that sense, Ballard doesn’t really deserve to be commemorated for his undeniable influence upon the Leafs, but the man was not without some good influence over the organization. Hell, even Hitler had some good ideas, like building highways in Egypt, for example.

So, in what will surely get me driven out of PPP with torches and pitchforks, I will ask if it is possible to focus the positive contributions Ballard made to the team? [that was rhetorical, btw]

He groomed Hap Day as a coach while he was still playing for the Leafs, winning the Memorial Cup together with the Nationals. He won back-to-back Mem Cups with the Marlies. He supported the NHLPA by donating all gate receipt from the ’72 Summit Series to their retirement fund, as well as securing the television rights for the union. He commissioned gold medals for the ’87 Team Canada that had been disqualified for that bench-clearing brawl. And above all, he was the most truculent bastard to ever roam the halls of MLG.

by Spezzal Teams Playa on Aug 10, 2010 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

okay, you’re swaying me. i’m a positive guy and there’s too much good to draw from. i mean, it’s not like we’re the fucking senators or something.

Me: Any idiot could see that.
Mrs. P: You're not just any idiot, you're the most special kind of idiot.

by Sergei Puckizin on Aug 10, 2010 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s why i qualify the Gilmour comments with “it might be an age thing.” Killing the Ballard era is, to me, the most signficant event of the past 42 years. That’s an age thing, though.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly. That’s why this whole exercise is so difficult, age plays a huge factor. I idolized Gilmour but I was too young to appreciate what was happening.

The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway

by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on Aug 10, 2010 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

I just keep thinking about how incredible that Gilmour trade was and wanting to give Cliff Fletcher a place. Then, I think of Finger, and do not want Fletcher there at all.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s like Imlach 1 and 2.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fletcher also pulled off the Sundin trade, a strong case for the Silver Fox could be made.

The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway

by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on Aug 10, 2010 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

His biggest problem was knowing when to stop trading.

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

New exercise.

Near Banff, there is the Valley of the Ten Peaks. Instead of Mount Puckmore, which is a US import anyway, I suggest the Valley of the Ten Leafs. :)

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 10, 2010 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

great post!
if there is one figure in Leaf history who truly is wrapped in legend, can you come up with one bigger than Bill Barilko?

that line of thinking has sold me on Barilko. It also makes me think Horton should get a long look. The man makes a damn fine donut…

Gilmour and Sundin are toss ups, but I’d take either before Clark, Andreychuk or Potvin

This is my signature.

by blurr1974 on Aug 10, 2010 5:09 PM EDT reply actions  

Yeah I agree. With this explanation it would be cool to have Barilko.

by samspade on Aug 10, 2010 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Same re: Barilko. Fan-fucking-tastic post 67ers, I always get a grin when I see one of your posts come up anew.

Me: Any idiot could see that.
Mrs. P: You're not just any idiot, you're the most special kind of idiot.

by Sergei Puckizin on Aug 10, 2010 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

great post 67.

when you mentioned in another post that gilmour was on your list, i knew the ‘destroyer of the ballard-era’ was going to be your angle. i get that, and i understand what a great time that was for many fans and the organization (not to mention how great dougie’s seasons were those two years). but while he may be synonymous with the leafs and ‘the passion returning’ amongst leaf fans, i don’t think dougie screams ‘LEAF LEGEND’ to general hockey fans like Sundin or Salming.

Yesterday is dead, but not my memory.

by daoust on Aug 10, 2010 8:50 PM EDT reply actions  

Love the post. Totally forgot about Hap Day.

As a huge Gilmour fan, I love the rational for including him. He truly was kick start that revived the franchise.

No matter who ends up being the 4, there is a long list of others icons of the Leafs history that are going to be left off.

Brain: The irony of it all, Pinky. Years of trying to take over the world, and all I had to do was say "truculence".
Follow me I'm Boring!

by blindfolded tank driver on Aug 10, 2010 8:59 PM EDT reply actions  

coughFosterHewittcough

Negative. I am a meat popsicle.

by birky on Aug 10, 2010 9:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

see. How about King Clancy?

Brain: The irony of it all, Pinky. Years of trying to take over the world, and all I had to do was say "truculence".
Follow me I'm Boring!

by blindfolded tank driver on Aug 10, 2010 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah he could easily be included as well.

"The only way out is in a body bag. Go Leafs Go." - Blinky

by Karina on Aug 10, 2010 9:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

no Conn Smythe?

then you got no list. A non starter without him.

by Johnny Bower's Pokecheck on Aug 10, 2010 9:38 PM EDT reply actions  

Mt Fightmore

since its bullshit that fighters get cast aside as carnival acts and not hockey players on the internet, I am going to make my Mt. Punchmore*

Red Horner
Tiger Williams
Tie Domi
Wendel Clark.

*This list is NOT debatable

by Johnny Bower's Pokecheck on Aug 10, 2010 9:46 PM EDT reply actions  

hahaha

I like that you presented Mt. Punchmore so truculently.

Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.

by PPP on Aug 10, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not debatable my ass.... :)

no love for the Bomber?

This is my signature.

by blurr1974 on Aug 10, 2010 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ol' Kenny

Gets to cut the ribbo…while holding Kordics ashes in a beer cozy

by Johnny Bower's Pokecheck on Aug 11, 2010 12:13 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

I'm surprised slightly

That you of all people, 1967ers, didn’t include Syl Apps. I thought for sure he would be a guarantee. That being said, love reading about Hap Day and Bill Barilko, who would never be mentioned on a list like this despite being steeped in tradition and importance.

Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell

by bkblades on Aug 15, 2010 5:05 PM EDT reply actions  

I think the only thing that hurts poor Syl is that he wasn’t a Leaf as long as most of the guys being bandied about.

He definitely cracks my top 8

"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."

Albert Einstein

by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Aug 15, 2010 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Perhaps

But Syl Apps was a Leafs player longer than Doug Gilmour and Bill Barilko if we’re being technical. Syl Apps was considered a top-5 player of his era and certainly a top-2 premiere centre. Apps would have made it to a ton of more All Star games if they existed before he retired, along with a Conn Smythe Trophy as well. I’m not even sure Conn Smythe made Syl Apps either. At the very least it was a mutual relationship between the two.

Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell

by bkblades on Aug 15, 2010 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t have Gilmour or Bill in my top 8

"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."

Albert Einstein

by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Aug 15, 2010 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

again, neither played long enough with the Leafs

"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."

Albert Einstein

by Say *plan the parade one more time*... on Aug 15, 2010 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yep, that’s also my main reason why they wouldn’t be in my hypothetical Mount Puckmore either.

Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell

by bkblades on Aug 15, 2010 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Syl Apps was fanfreakingtastic. But he wasn’t a type-definer the way Kennedy was, a mythic figure like Bashin’ Bill, nor a demon-slayer like Gilmour.

Only got four spots, folks.

Charlie Conacher is the most dominant player this franchise has ever had, and he didn’t make my mountain….

Leaf, the universe and everything.
Now in year 44 of the 42-year saga.

by 1967ers on Aug 16, 2010 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

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