JVR's comparison to other forwards picked in the top 5 of the NHL Draft

by LeafFan1989 on Jan 12, 2012 12:41 AM EST

JVR for Schenn is a hot topic right now among Leaf fans. I decided to take a look at how JVR's career thus far compares to the career of other top 5 forward draft picks from 2000-2009. I looked at the top 5 picks as a comparison since most folks here have taken this pedigree into account when discussing the merits of trading for him. Also considered the ages of 20-25 since that seemed like a good age group to determine how players did before JVR's current age and how they progressed afterward. It's my first fanpost and there's nothing fancy going on but suggestions are certainly welcome

Stats from Hockey DB and are presented in Games Played, Goals, Assist and Points. Production for each player is listed along with the age at which they were playing.

2000

Dany Heatley (2nd overall)

@20:77 41 48 89

@21: 31 13 12 25

@22: Lockout

@23: 82 50 53 103

@24: 82 50 55 105

Marian Gaborik (3rd Overall):

@20:81 30 35 65

@21: 65 18 22 40

@22: Lockout

@23: 65 38 28 66

@24: 48 30 27 57

Rostislav Klesla (4th Overall)

@20: 72 2 14 16

@21: 47 2 11 13

@22: Lockout

@23: 51 6 13 19

@24: 75 9 13 22

Raffi Torres (5th overall)

@20: 14 0 1 1

@21: 17 0 5 5

@22: 80 20 14 34

@23: Lockout

@24: 82 27 14 41

2001

Ilya Kovalchuk (1st overall)

@20: 81 41 46 87

@21: Lockout

@22: 78 52 46 98

@23: 82 42 34 76

@24: 79 52 35 87

Jason Spezza (2nd Overall):

@20: 78 22 33 55

@21: Lockout

@22: 68 19 71 90

@23: 67 34 53 87

@24: 76 34 58 92

Alexandr Svitov (3rd Overall)

@20: 40 2 9 11

@21: Lockout

@22: not in NHL

@23: 76 7 11 18

@24: Not in NHL

Stephen Weiss (4th overall)

@20: 50 12 17 29

@21: Lockout

@22: 41 9 12 21

@23: 74 20 28 48

@24: 74 13 29 42

Stanislav Chistov (5th overall)

@20: 56 2 16 18

@21: Lockout

@22: Not in NHL

@23: 1 0 0 0

@24: 60 5 8 13

2002

Rick Nash (1st overall)

@20: Lockout

@21: 54 31 23 54

@22: 75 27 30 57

@23: 80 38 31 69

@24: 78 40 39 79

2003:

Eric Staal (2nd Overall):

@20: Lockout

@21: 82 45 55 100

@22: 82 30 40 70

@23: 82 38 44 82

@24: 82 40 35 75

Nathan Horton (3rd Overall)

@20: 71 28 19 47

@21: 82 31 31 62

@22: 82 27 35 62

@23: 67 22 23 45

@24: 65 20 37 57

Nikolai Zherdev (4th overall)

@20: Lockout

@21: 73 27 27 54

@22: 71 10 22 32

@23: 82 26 35 61

@24: 82 23 35 58

Thomas Vanek (5th overall)

@20: Lockout

@21: 81 25 23 48

@22: 82 43 41 84

@23: 82 36 28 64

@24: 73 40 24 64

2004:

Alex Ovechkin (1st overall)

@20: 81 52 54 106

@21: 82 46 46 92

@22: 82 65 47 112

@23: 79 56 54 110

@24: 72 50 59 109

Evgeni Malkin (2nd Overall):

@20: 78 33 52 85

@21: 82 47 59 106

@22: 82 35 78 113

@23: 67 28 49 77

@24: 43 15 22 37

Andrew Ladd (4th overall)

@20: 29 6 5 11

@21: 65 11 10 21

@22: 63 14 16 30

@23: 82 15 34 49

@24: 82 17 21 38

Blake Wheeler (5th overall)

@20: Not in NHL

@21: Not in NHL

@22: 81 21 24 45

@23: 82 18 20 38

@24: 58 11 16 27

2005:

Sidney Crosby (1st overall)

@20: 53 24 48 72

@21: 77 33 70 103

@22: 81 51 58 109

@23: 41 32 34 66

@24: 8 2 10 12 (so far)

Bobby Ryan (2nd Overall):

@20: 23 5 5 10

@21: 64 31 26 57

@22: 81 35 29 64

@23: 82 34 37 71

@24: 41 15 10 25 (so far)

Benoit Pouliot (4th overall)

@20: 3 0 0 0

@21: 11 2 1 3

@22: 37 5 6 11

@23: 53 17 11 28

@24: 79 13 17 30

2006:

Jordan Staal (2nd Overall):

@20: 82 22 27 49

@21: 82 21 28 49

@22: 42 11 19 30

@23: 34 15 6 21 (so far)

Jonathan Toews (3rd Overall)

@20: 82 34 35 69

@21: 76 25 43 68

@22: 80 32 44 76

@23: 43 22 20 42(so far)

Nicklas Backstrom (4th overall)

@20: 82 14 55 69

@21: 82 22 66 88

@22: 82 33 68 101

@23: 77 18 47 65

@24: 38 13 29 42 (so far)

Phil Kessel (PHIL!!!!) (5th overall)

@20: 82 19 18 37

@21: 70 36 24 60

@22: 70 30 25 55

@23: 82 32 32 64

@24: 42 24 24 48 (SO FAR!!!!!!!)

2007:

Patrick Kane (1st overall)

@20: 80 25 45 70

@21: 82 30 58 88

@22: 73 27 46 73

@23: 43 10 28 38 (so far)

JVR (2nd Overall): Will get to him in a bit

Kyle Turris (3rd Overall)

@20: Not In NHL

@21: 65 11 14 25

@22: 17 1 7 8 (so far)

2007:

Patrick Kane (1st overall)

@20: 80 25 45 70

@21: 82 30 58 88

@22: 73 27 46 73

@23: 43 10 28 38 (so far)

JVR (2nd Overall): Will get to him in a bit

Kyle Turris (3rd Overall)

@20: Not In NHL

@21: 65 11 14 25

@22: 17 1 7 8 (so far)

2008:

Steven Stamkos (1st overall)

@20: 82 45 46 91

@21: 41 29 18 47 (so far...)

2009:

John Tavares (1st overall)

@20: 79 29 38 67

@21: 40 14 25 39 (so far...)

Matt Duchene (3rd Overall)

@20: 39 12 12 24 (so far)

Evander Kane (4th overall)

@20: 41 18 13 31 (so far)

Brayden Schenn (5th overall)

@20: 13 2 1 3 (so far)

And now, the stats you've all already read and analyzed a couple dozen times:

James Van Riemsdyk (2nd Overall in 2007):

@20: 78 15 20 35

@21: 75 21 19 40

@22: 36 11 11 22 (so far)

My take: He hasn't really performed thus far to the caliber of a star top 5 pick. This is not to say that he won't develop into a first liner but his counting stats don't really scream a young player ready to make the jump to stardom. Most top 5 picks who turned out to be stars had already started piling up significant goal and/or point totals at the 20-21 age. My comparable for him would be Blake Wheeler but he played his rookie season at age 22.

Right now, I would not do a straight up deal for the two as it would be trading Schenn at likely the lowest value of his Maple Leaf tenure while bringing in someone who isn't a sure bet to exceed the production that can be provided through internal means. Mind you, Schenn is no sure thing either and has probably played his worst hockey this season, but people smarter than me have pointed out that it takes young defensemen far longer to become shutdown material in the big leagues. Also, I am not sure what else the Flyers could include along with JVR as I doubt they would be willing to pay much more for a shutdown D-man who is anything but at this point. Put your ideas in the comments.

Comments and Suggestions are welcome.

Poll

Would you do a deal for Schenn and JVR?

Yes, Straight up and run away happy

179 votes

Yes, if it involved another pick/prospect coming from the Flyers

73 votes

Nope, stick with Schenn

106 votes

In Burke We Trust

66 votes

424 votes | Poll has closed

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but people smarter than me have pointed out that it takes young defensemen far longer to become shutdown material in the big leagues.

These people are Jared

"I will actually score as many times as Kulemin assists me."
-Mikhail Grabovski

by MapleLeafMole on Jan 12, 2012 12:28 PM EST reply actions

i like pointing, it’s fun
you can make your hand into a gun and play spies!
pew pew!

Resident Internet Tough Guy

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 12, 2012 2:41 PM EST up reply actions

Smarter?

F|73RR08 The fan and artist formally known as FLYERROB ~ I do not advocate to be the comments of any fan base or any NHL Team but rather my own individual self ~ if that upsets you - Sorry. ~ Lori Wilson Gray ~ April 07th 1967 - May 27th 2011 ~ Bob Wilson JR. ~ July 03rd 1944 - November 06th 2011 ~ ~ I love you Sis & Dad !

by FLYERROB on Jan 12, 2012 6:46 PM EST up reply actions

I know, it’s a hard word

Resident Internet Tough Guy

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 12, 2012 7:09 PM EST up reply actions

~

More like an inaccurate word. And congratulations if you stated

have pointed out that it takes young defensemen far longer to become shutdown material in the big leagues.

as that is a pretty obvious “Gimme”. So, ergo, thats not a Smarter person who states the common knowledge.

by FLYERROB on Jan 12, 2012 7:16 PM EST up reply actions

you are applying the meaning to the wrong part of the sentence, he called me a smarter person than him
it doesn’t matter what I said
and clearly it isn’t common knowledge because most people don’t know it
ergo, you don’t know how to properly break down a sentence

Resident Internet Tough Guy

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 12, 2012 7:23 PM EST up reply actions

LAST WORD LAST WORD LAST WORD !

by FLYERROB on Jan 12, 2012 8:47 PM EST up reply actions

right, that is totally what this is about, getting the last word, you sure are a smart one rob, way to go

Resident Internet Tough Guy

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 12, 2012 9:02 PM EST up reply actions

nice to see you found a new fall back plan when you start losing an argument, instead of playing the victim, you play the moron

Resident Internet Tough Guy

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 12, 2012 9:07 PM EST up reply actions

awwww ! Name Calling

My Feelings now have a big boo boo !

by FLYERROB on Jan 12, 2012 11:22 PM EST up reply actions

hook.line.sinker.

Resident Internet Tough Guy

by JaredFromLondon on Jan 13, 2012 6:10 AM EST up reply actions

Troll much?

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 10:01 AM EST up reply actions

* cough *

Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.

by Chemmy on Jan 16, 2012 9:16 PM EST up reply actions

Ricola for your cough ?

by FLYERROB on Jan 18, 2012 6:52 PM EST up reply actions

JVR is not a TOP 10 NHL Pick

I think he is a good 2nd Career Liner but he is not in the Caliber of Toews Kane Stamkos, Kessel, Malkin, Crosby, Ryan, Staal or Ovechkin and he never will be. I think he should have never been picked higher than 15th overrall but at the time he was putting up some serious numbers in the Junior and AHL, but that always doesnt equate to a super star in the NHL.

But I cannot change the fact that he was picked 2nd overall back then. That was then and this is now. I am stuck with him now. Would I trade JVR to the Maple Leafs for Luke Schenn ? Hhhhmmmmm…. Thats a good question. As of right now Mid January 2012. No. If Brayden Schenn develops more and more and eventually Replaces JVR’s Production or out Produces him, then maybe I would consider a Trade to Bring Brayden Schenn’s Brother on the FLYERS.

Pretty Good Post with the Stats !

by FLYERROB on Jan 12, 2012 6:53 PM EST reply actions

So if you had the number 2 pick, who would you have taken? Aside from Kane, who went number 1, others in the first round included Turris, Alzner, Gagner, Voracek, Couture, Sutter, McDonaugh, Eller, Shattenkirk, Pacioretty, M. Backlund, and Perron. Of that group, I think Couture is the only one I’d take immediately over JVR. There’s a few others in that group that could be argued, but none that stand out as obviously a better overall pick (based on present ability and potential).

Finally on the Twitter train, @j6events. Follow me, I swear I'll have interesting thoughts soon!

by BetterThanBester on Jan 12, 2012 8:16 PM EST up reply actions

Your pretty much right

Its was either Patrick Kane who was a GIVEN NHL’er or not much else. The rest were Potentials. We had the worst record but lost the Ping Pong Ball race and Chicago won the Ping Pong Ball Race and Got Patrick Kane and he goes on to be the one who puts the nail in the Coffin against (Sigh) Leighton in the SCF to solidify the Blackhawks winning the Stanley Cup against Philly.

The Hockey GODS smited us !

by FLYERROB on Jan 12, 2012 8:47 PM EST up reply actions

*smote.

Patron saint of quality footwear.

by fat_daddyo on Jan 16, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions

Patrick Kane wasn’t a given with his size. That 2007 draft overall is pretty weak.

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by red army line on Jan 16, 2012 1:31 PM EST up reply actions

You say that now, but would you have said that when he turned up the heat in the latter half of last season, or when he lit up the playoffs in 2010? Some people (not necessarily you, I honestly don’t recall your opinion on him back then) are very bandwagon-ish when it comes to JVR. I know it’s just one guy’s opinion, but I like him. I wish he could be more consistent (he was actually doing pretty well, though doing it quietly, in October and November, it’s December when he dropped off), but who knows, maybe that will come with age. I hope it will, I still see a lot of potential there.

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 10:08 AM EST up reply actions

~

My opinion of JVR during the Playoffs last year, Yes it would have been different, but also we didnt have a Matt Read or a Harry Z or a Couterier in the system last playoff run. No one would have known that these players were going to be doing what they are doing present day with the FLYERS. I am not selling JVR short. He is a top 6 forward in the NHL. He is what he is. We are in need of a D man (Yes we are in need of one – Pronger is out, Timonen is hurt, .. Now you know that between now and March or April someone else is going to get hurt. I dont care for Walker. Gustafsson is good but often injured. Marshall and Bourdon are rookies and make rookie mistakes sometimes.

Being a GM of a team is an on going assessment of your organization. Right now (January 2012) we need a top 4 Solid D man to solidify our D and we have a few Forwards that could be used to move to get one.

(The two players who I wish were not FLYERS ? Walker and Shelley. I wish we could let them go.)

by FLYERROB on Jan 16, 2012 12:04 PM EST up reply actions

Good point about having Read, Z, and Scooter now. I guess I’m still questioning if we need to acquire more talent on D since we’re doing okay right now, but then potential future injuries and playoff performance further complicate the problem.

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 4:11 PM EST up reply actions

Exactly my friend !

thats exactly what I am saying. Playoff push with Potential Injuries and now you have either Cobourn, Carle, Timonen ( Timonen~ we all know wears down if overplayed) or Lilja go down and now you have Marshall and Bourdon playing more minutes. Although they are doing well as I thought someday they would be, I dont want to go into the playoff push with some Rookie D Men holding down the blue line.

Sure Schenn is not Pronger and doesnt bring Veteran Leadership (YET) but someday he will be an asset and a Veteran Leader and he hits like Pronger used to hit when Pronger was with the Blues & Ducks.

It just makes sense for the FLYERS and the Maple Leafs (more for the FLYERS I must admit)

by FLYERROB on Jan 18, 2012 7:02 PM EST up reply actions

Flyers fan who disagrees with FLYERROB here

JVR’s got all the potential in the world. At our Flyers skill comp last season he was the fastest skater on the club, had the hardest shot out of all players and on top of that is one of the biggest forwards on the team. I think JVR showed us what he could do during the Flyers’ short playoff run last season – but this season he’s been bothered by a cam impingement which he’s going to get offseason surgery for. JVR’s value really will never be lower I reckon – which is why I don’t want to trade JVR for Schenn at all (as a Flyers fan)

Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.

One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.

by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 13, 2012 10:21 PM EST reply actions

everyone is entitled to their opinion

The more I thought about this the more and more I was swayed to likening the trade of JVR straight up for Luke Schenn, but it aint happening now. I think JVR will never live up to the billing of a 2nd overall pick in the draft. Some guys drop really low and are worth more than where they are drafted. (Giroux Clarke Lundqvist, Zetterberg, Franzen Weber) Some guys are drafted higher than what they are worth. I am not saying that JVR is not a worthy talented Player who is good to have on your team. I like his play allot. I just am saying that he is not a 2nd overall pick when you compare his stats which is what LeafFan1989 showed us above with this post but it doesnt mean that JVR is not a talented player. It just means that compaired to other top 10 overall pics like Kane, Stamkos and so on.

As of right now with the production of Harry Z, Read, Couturier, and B Schenn, and with the need of a Defenseman, the Luke Schenn straight up for JVR would be an Improvement for the FLYERS.

by FLYERROB on Jan 14, 2012 5:25 PM EST up reply actions

I just think that whether or not he’s an underwhelming #2 pick isn’t as relevant any more. It’s been 5 years since 2007 and now we should just consider him in terms of where he’s at amongst the league’s wingers and the Flyers’ forwards. I still think JVR is currently a solid top 6 player (concussion notwithstanding) and in the future he could be a top line winger and potentially put up 40 goals in a season if he stays healthy.

Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.

One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.

by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 16, 2012 6:07 AM EST up reply actions

Pretty Much

Agree with almost everything you said. I think he is a 30+ Goals a season kind of guy. If he ever hits 40 or breaks it with 40+ I think that will be his best season once or twice in his career but he is a solid top 6 forward and he is a 30+ Goals a year player.

by FLYERROB on Jan 16, 2012 9:20 AM EST up reply actions

I just am saying that he is not a 2nd overall pick when you compare his stats

Isn’t hindsight swell?

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 10:10 AM EST up reply actions

In hindsight, the Flyers should have tanked any other year then the one they did.

"Because wives and girlfriends aren’t on the road."

by BannedStreetBully on Jan 16, 2012 10:13 AM EST up reply actions

Hahahaha, so true. We can’t even get screwing up right.

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 10:14 AM EST up reply actions

We just got robbed of Patrick Kane and then the Hockey GOD’s did Smite us by having him score the Series winning goal to seal the Blackhawks Stanley Cup Championship against us.

Sigh ! Ouch !

by FLYERROB on Jan 16, 2012 11:56 AM EST up reply actions

Well when you compare all the players stats like the ones in this post form where they were drafted and what they are doing now.

Yes thats the whole point. Its ALL HINDSIGHT, as we cannot give the stats till AFTER they have played for a few years. If we did give the stats before they played it would be called a Premonition or a Prediction.

Thanks for the obvious ! Have a nice day !

by FLYERROB on Jan 16, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions

I’m just saying we couldn’t have known at the time whether or not he’d play “like a 2nd overall pick”, and you talk about JVR like he should have never been in the top 10 at all. There’s no way you could have known that. So you’re trying to pass off knowledge now like you believed it all along.

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 4:14 PM EST up reply actions

It's kind of funny

Because a lot of people at BSH believe a straight up JVR for Schenn swap would be selling low on JVR.

The perspective here on the deal has been very enlightening, both this post and Chemmy’s post on Luke Schenn earlier today.

Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Jan 14, 2012 4:58 PM EST reply actions

Well It aint happening now.

JVR out With a Concussion

by FLYERROB on Jan 14, 2012 5:13 PM EST up reply actions

Burke traded for a concussed Matthew Lombardi in August

It could still happen.

Deadline is also over a month away.

Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Jan 14, 2012 5:30 PM EST up reply actions

DOnt you have to clear the Physical when Traded

by FLYERROB on Jan 14, 2012 5:37 PM EST up reply actions

I think the team can still take him even if he fails the physical. It’s just a way to make sure teams don’t get rid of their injured players by concealing injuries. Everyone in the world knows he has a concussion and if Burke wants to take that on his team he can still opt to do so (I think).

Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.

One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.

by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 16, 2012 6:08 AM EST up reply actions

Huh. m-okay

by FLYERROB on Jan 16, 2012 9:20 AM EST up reply actions

Correct.

Patron saint of quality footwear.

by fat_daddyo on Jan 16, 2012 12:18 PM EST up reply actions

Special Circumstance:

Unload Lebda

by gettingcozywithsarkozy on Jan 16, 2012 2:24 PM EST up reply actions

Because a lot of people at BSH believe a straight up JVR for Schenn swap would be selling low on JVR.

To be fair, there are others at BSH who tell those people they’re being homers. Opinions are all over the map on this one. :-p

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 10:11 AM EST up reply actions

I actually think it would be selling low on Luke Schenn. If I was Burke I would want JVR and a Phantom or a Pick.

by FLYERROB on Jan 16, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions

Trading an offensive forward for a defensive defenceman is always REALLY tough to gauge.

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by PPP on Jan 16, 2012 9:12 PM EST up reply actions

Flyers still should have got the number one pick in the 2007 draft! By the way you have 2007 posted twice

by Megadelphia on Jan 14, 2012 5:15 PM EST reply actions

Key Point

Many (if not all) of these top-five picks played in Juniors before playing in the NHL.

JVR was a high school student when he was drafted. More importantly, he only played two seasons in college and a handful of games in the AHL before he made the Flyers at age 20.

Those who play in Juniors are better prepared to play the long NHL season than those who play in college, simply because saesons in Juniors are nearly twice as long as college hockey seasons.

It should not be surprising, therefore, that JVR’s trajectory is different from many of the players listed above.

After his success in last year’s playoffs, everyone expected that this would be JVR’s “breakout” year. And at the beginning of the season, he was playing up to expectations. Then he suffered the camp impingement in his hip and has run hot and cold ever since. Now he’s concussed. I think if JVR were healthy all season, we would not be having this discussion of “JVR for Schenn” at this point because the former would be hitting his stride while the latter would likely still be finding his game at the NHL level. That’s not a knock against Schenn per se, it’s just that it takes longer for defenseman to mature than it does for forwards.

Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?

by mikefive on Jan 14, 2012 5:52 PM EST reply actions

Great points.

I’m still not 100% convinced that the Flyers are that desperately in need of more help on defense. I’m a little disappointed by the results of the last four games, but I didn’t get to watch any of them personally, so I can’t say whether it’s the offense, defense, or both that need work. I like JVR a lot and would hate to give him up, but I’m trying hard not to let that skew my opinion if we need to trade him to make a better team. In short, I have no idea what to do. :-p

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 10:21 AM EST up reply actions

Hintzy I think our d is a problem. I can tell you the last couple of games have had the same problems that the other games have had. We have no physical, clear the net dman. This along with his potential to be a top 4 dman is why I would probably pull the trigger on the trade. Only however, if we cannot or will not make a play for Suter.

"When the Flyers win a playoff series, as they did this past year, is when you yell at me for being wrong? Because I said the Flyers won’t win a round'?
Geoff Detweiler.

by Mattx on Jan 16, 2012 4:49 PM EST up reply actions

Gotcha, yeah we gotta be able to clear the crease. Does Schenn provide that physical presence we need? I honestly don’t know much about him, except that it sounds like he isn’t playing up to his potential at the moment.

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 16, 2012 5:12 PM EST up reply actions

I think he was in the top ten in hits last year and I think he is again this year. He is not afraid to play physical. I have not watched a whole lot of Toronto games this year, but I would say he would be our most physical dman besides Pronger by far.

"When the Flyers win a playoff series, as they did this past year, is when you yell at me for being wrong? Because I said the Flyers won’t win a round'?
Geoff Detweiler.

by Mattx on Jan 16, 2012 6:04 PM EST up reply actions

Top 10 in hits?

try he led all NHL D men in hits last year with 251.

He was 18th amongst NHL D men 2 years ago with 173.

He is currently 2nd in the NHL for hits by a defender with 138, despite averaging only 16:33 in TOI nightly.

If he was playing 18+ minutes a game he’d easily be leading the NHL in hits by a D man – again.

"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."

- Sir Winston Churchill

I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.

by Steve Burtch on Jan 16, 2012 9:33 PM EST up reply actions

take a deep breath buddy~!!!!! Not a Leafs fan I was just going off the top of my head!!!!!

"When the Flyers win a playoff series, as they did this past year, is when you yell at me for being wrong? Because I said the Flyers won’t win a round'?
Geoff Detweiler.

by Mattx on Jan 16, 2012 10:54 PM EST up reply actions

I like it.

Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced

by hintzy64 on Jan 17, 2012 6:21 PM EST up reply actions

Players on that list who didn't play Junior

who played College = Toews, Heatley, Vanek, Kessel, Turris, Wheeler
RSL/KHL = Malkin, Ovechkin, Kovalchuk, Zherdev, Chistov, Svitov
SEL = Backstrom
Slovakia = Gaborik

I wouldn’t suggest 14 of the 32 guys on the list qualifies as a possible “(if not all)”. I’m pretty sure this is a weak argument at best. It obviously hasn’t hindered any of the guys listed that they played developmental hockey in a league that wasn’t the CHL. None of the aforementioned leagues play a season much beyond 45-50 games in a year.

I wouldn’t even pretend it’s “key” at this stage.

"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."

- Sir Winston Churchill

I'm pretty sure he's talking about the Leafs.

by Steve Burtch on Jan 16, 2012 9:28 PM EST up reply actions

Pretty much what mikefive said.

As a Flyers fan, right now is about the only time I’d feel somewhat comfortable for trading Schenner for JVR. There’s no real way of knowing whether the elder Schenn ever develops into an actual D-man, and there’s no real way of knowing if JVR recovers fairly.

"Because wives and girlfriends aren’t on the road."

by BannedStreetBully on Jan 16, 2012 10:12 AM EST reply actions