Vesa Gustavsson Doesn't Apologize. Leaves That to His Fans
by Greener on Feb 22, 2012 10:01 AM EST
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Print"Superstar NHL caliber goalie Gustavsson was given the challenge last night of matching up against one of the greatest goalies of all time on a surging Devils team in order to keep the Leafs playoff chances alive! The bounces went against our Boys in Blue on the night, but if not for Gustavsson, Toronto would have left the ice with no points instead of a much needed 1!"
- Gustavsson Apologists R.I.P. 2009 - 2012
One of the most over-valued, over-protected and over-used Leafs in recent history tripped on his way into the winners circle Tuesday night, falling fantastically onto his sword for the final time in a beautiful sweater with a certain Leafy motif. The Japanese have a name for such a ritual. They call it "切腹" or Seppuku. The only difference is they use it to save face and honour by not giving in to their enemies, and Gustavsson did it to secure a good laugh from the internet guy with "Losers Since 67" written on the back of his jersey.
Done now for good is any notion of Gustavsson's position as Maple Leafs possible #1 goalie. Necessarily going with it are the hopes, dreams and excuses of the throng of Leafs logicians who ignore little things like objective analysis, stats, and the power of love to insist that Gustavsson is anything but a sometimes good back-up goalie. In the Swedish Elite League.
These fans are surprisingly large in number, emboldened by Gustavsson's wonderfully annoying habit of making insane 10 bell saves fairly frequently. But these apologists always come to praise Gustavsson, not to bury him; They quickly renounce prototypical bad Gustavsson goals as "flukes" or "a bad bounce" or "Luke Schenn's fault". Any honest Gustavsson reel would show reams of goals going through a gaping five-hole or trickling through on the short side, always coming at a crucial time when the team really needed him to make the stop, ie: every time.
The Cult of Gustavsson, seen here gathering in Maple Leafs Square (and PPP comments sections), is saying to themselves, "Wait a sec Greener, haven't we heard this before?!" And the answer is yes, I was yelling this at you last November. "But wait", you now aren't saying, "Greener, what do you know that we don't?" Well, besides Chemmy's home phone number and the combination to PPP's bike lock, the answer is nothing much, really. I just think that being brutally honest with the Leafs and the performance of its players is one of the hard-won awards of following a team like the Leafs. We always have to view them through an honest, flaw-free prism. Just remember, thinking critically like this is one of the things that separates us from the animals, and by that, I mean Canucks fans.
Continue to look at my flaw-free prism @Le_Greener
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First!
Really though, first time commenter.
I don’t even know what to think about this guy anymore. He almost loses them both points, somehow saves them one, then promptly loses them the second. I have never yelled ‘HOLY FUCK’ so many times during one game with so many different emotions.
by eugeeeene on Feb 22, 2012 10:13 AM EST reply actions 4 recs
Welcome
Thanks for joining.
Now never post ‘First!’ again please. Thanks in advance.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
by PPP on Feb 22, 2012 1:12 PM EST up reply actions 8 recs
Noted.
In all seriousness, it irritates the shit out of me as well. However, given the situation, I really couldn’t resist.
I thought it was appropriate.
"I myself am made up entirely of flaws, stitched together with good intentions."
First ever? I let it slide ;)
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
Thank-you!
Maybe there is a silver lining to last night’s heartbreak, after the game Wilson seemed quite dissappointed in the Monster’s ability to stop pucks. Maybe this means Reimer gets a little more slack and hopefully he can put together some starts and re-gain his mojo.
On another note, since the asking price for Nash is likely to be way too high, maybe there’s a deal to be made with LA for Bernier. There’s no denying that Goaltending is the number one need for this team right now. Bozak has been a pleasant surprise so I think we can get by with what we got up front. Goal scoring is clearly not the issue. I remember hearing awhile ago that LA called about Kulemin/MacArthur, soooo maybe one of them plus a first for Bernier? Toss is Holzer? Waddaya think?
In AA I trust
by FirstChurchofBLawrie on Feb 22, 2012 10:42 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
It is,in my opinion,time to pick up the phone and talk Bob Murray into sending us Getzlaf and Hiller…for whatever it takes,short of giving back Gardiner….or,barring that…phone JD in St. Louis and paying whatever it takes to get Halak.
I realise that there is an enormous volume of message traffic to this page,on a daily basis…but I have asked repeatedly for an update on Jusi Rynass….being that I live in Calgary and the rags out here don’t print anything about the city or the hockey team in my home town unless it is negative…I don’t think it is an unreasonable request……
If Rynass is ready…turf Gustavsson for as high a draft pick as possible and move on,Brian…hell,you don’t even have to admit that you made a huge error with this guy…just turf him and all will be forgiven…at least for today :)
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:06 PM EST up reply actions
Getzlaf AND Hiller? They would want everything we have back.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 22, 2012 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
In regards to Rynnas
He is currently playing in the ECHL as he was overtaken by Scrivens last year and Owuya this year. He is currently number 5 on the Leafs depth chart.
Goalie depth chart:
Reimer
Gus
Scrivens
Owuya
Rynnas.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 22, 2012 6:14 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He’s another guy that looks great, gets hurt and looks like ass intermittently. Very inconsistent
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 22, 2012 8:18 PM EST up reply actions
no…La didn’t initiate that call…BB phoned them…kicking the tires on Bernier and Johnson…offering to take Penners’ deal off their hands …Grabbo Schenn and the 2012 1st is what was on the radio out here…but again I am in Calgary..believe at own risk…the radio I mean
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:08 PM EST up reply actions
Last time Greener wrote a sarcastic post about Gustavsson, he went on a tear winning 7 games and going .926 in January.
Not that I’m saying it’ll happen again. But really, does Greener only show up to write obits for Gustavsson every few months?
Move along. Nothing to see here...
by Van Ryn's Neurologist on Feb 22, 2012 10:51 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
= hope? For a rebound? Not the bad kind?
Kids, the untradeable prospects of our future! Develop them well in the minors.
by The Blue Spirit on Feb 22, 2012 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
We’re desperate to try anything.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
by PPP on Feb 22, 2012 1:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
OMG!! does that bring back memories…..but now that you mention it…what is Senator Kelly doing on his off days..he could outcoach Wilson without even thinking about it
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
YES YES YES!
Loathing the Habs with every fibre of my being since 1963.
by Pyramid Power on Feb 22, 2012 6:53 PM EST up reply actions
Do you have a sensor that goes off at the mention of your name?
by gettingcozywithsarkozy on Feb 23, 2012 8:52 AM EST up reply actions
For those who point to Gustavsson’s saves in the 3rd period and say “He kept us in the game”, THAT’S HIS FUCKING JOB!!! Do you look at the guy who hands you fries at the drive thru and say “You saved me from starving!”?
Goalies are expected to make big saves, otherwise the stat ‘Scoring Chances’ would just be the score.
The pitchforks were out for Wilson when the PK was terrible. When do they come out for Allaire, now that he can’t get a goalie to stop a beachball?
by DeanoTPS on Feb 22, 2012 10:56 AM EST reply actions 8 recs
It should also be noted that Gus wouldn’t have had to “keep the Leafs in the game” if he’d made two easy saves earlier in the game, both of which actually resulted in goals.
Riding the Leafs bandwagon since 1991.
Check out my art!
by CanadianMaple09 on Feb 22, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Do you look at the guy who hands you fries at the drive thru and say "You saved me from starving!"?
I laughed
RE-SIGN GRABBO
by Chris Stoikoff on Feb 22, 2012 1:44 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Do you look at the guy who hands you fries at the drive thru and say “You saved me from starving!”?
No, I say “Thanks for the future heart disease and diabetes!”
by Paper Bag Leaf Fan on Feb 22, 2012 4:10 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
that’s….not as funny
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
by elseldo on Feb 22, 2012 4:25 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
So where was Reimers in the last game?
He stunk up the joint. Maybe there wasn’t a perfect moment to go Aha but whatever enjoy your victory because its a rater sad victory.
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by Yotes Lover on Feb 22, 2012 11:05 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Reimers last bad game isnt even in the same stratosphere as gustavssons last game
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 11:13 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Keep in mind though, he made a few enormous stops that should have been goals. Reimer’s last few games were just mediocre-poor all around. I don’t remember any great saves anyway.
But that last goal… man, that was harsh.
Kids, the untradeable prospects of our future! Develop them well in the minors.
by The Blue Spirit on Feb 22, 2012 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Reimer made some 10 bell saves in his past two starts, he just doesn’t flail like a dead fish when he makes them
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
Perhaps – nothing really stands out. They’re both letting in very weak ones at the moment.
Right now though – what can be done to fix it? Without a stable goalie, we’re done for. I guess I don’t really imagine Burke getting one though.
Kids, the untradeable prospects of our future! Develop them well in the minors.
by The Blue Spirit on Feb 22, 2012 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
you'd have to overpay to get one at the deadline
and then we’re right back where we started.
Sad as it is, I’m kind of hoping we stand pat at the deadline and somehow get enough luck to eke out a first round loss against either the Rangers or Bruins.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
I’m hoping the Burke-o-matic 3000 trades our spare parts for dark horses the likes we’ve gotten quite lucky with recently (read: Lupul, Lombardi to a lesser extend, but at least he’s playing) – Burke is pretty savvy at pulling talent where no one was looking, and if anything, I’m guessing THAT’s what may happen. I don’t see us getting marquee talent and I’m glad of that too, since we’d be overpaying.
I think we need to fix Gus / Optimus somehow for the seasons remainder and/or find a way to protect them better (though I’m not terribly optimistic about the latter).
Kids, the untradeable prospects of our future! Develop them well in the minors.
by The Blue Spirit on Feb 22, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
Burke’s a lot more apt at trading than he is on the free agent market, it’s true. So i’m holding out some hope. Best bet is probably him using MLSE’s financial muscle to take on an overpaid but solid G from a cash-strapped team. I don’t see any candidates but perhaps one exists.
I want a solid vet that can throw up a .910 over the entire season (not even that impressive, mind you) but then again i wanted that LAST July.
I think for this season, all we’re left with is handing the keys to our existing guys, and hoping for the best. Again.
I know it’s bleak, the the bottom of the east is such dreck that running out a few wins in a row buys breathing space. We are still in 8th, if only barely.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
I AM NOT ON ANY MEDICATION!!…there,thought I would say that first…because I happen to belive the Leafs can beat the Rangers in the first round…they remain the ONLY team to beat them twice at MSg..in RT…and both times it was Gustavsson in net…and guess who was out of town for the three weeks prior to those games?? Allaire….coincidence?? Probably but I AM grasping at straws here…..and I agree somewhat with what you’re saying…standing pat means showing confidence in the current roster…and it means the assets collected in the past 2 and a half years don’t end up going for a player that won’t help us anyway…unless that player is Getzlaf
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
i like the way they match up against NY than against anybody else near the top of the east, I’ll give you that.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
by pevans on Feb 22, 2012 4:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed, better than Boston. Boston would destroy us.
Kids, the untradeable prospects of our future! Develop them well in the minors.
by The Blue Spirit on Feb 22, 2012 5:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Reimer was pretty damn bad in the Sundin game (I was at). He let in 4 goals on 7 (or was it 8?) shots in the second. 4 goals on 15 shots against total. He was baaaaad.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 22, 2012 1:23 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
exactly my point. Where was the explosion of hate against him.
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by Yotes Lover on Feb 22, 2012 1:33 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
because he has a larger body of good work to insulate him?
he didn’t let in an OT winner that an empty net would have stopped?
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
No he doesn’t Jared. He doesn’t. THERE IS NO BODY OF WORK, NO “CAREER,” NO GRAND EVIDENCE to support Reimer being much of anything. This is what drove me to take up Gus’ case.
Reimer is still a complete cipher. He has TWO MONTHS in his entire “carer” with a Save % over .914. Two months. But hey, he was hot those two months, so thus it’s a body of work to insulate him.
Gus has 4, for chrissakes. For all we know, Reimer just happened to have two good months that landed early in his career.
Shit, Gus has only faced 2681 shots versus 1845 for Reimer. Neither have a body of work worth a damn. And this year, Reimer’s 903 Save % is behind even Gus’s at 905.
Let’s get a starter. A vet. And have Reimer in behind. Gus gone. But the Reimer love is as nonsensical as the Gus love.
Also, concussion. If we look at Liles, Armstrong and Reimer, none of them look as “with it,” or “on their game” or whatever you call it, as they did before. And yep, they can all pass baseline tests, but still not be quite right. I’ve had a truckload of concussions. Spent 5 years in Winnipeg, with the lights always turned down low. Just “liked it better that way.” Then last year, suddenly started wanting the lights back up. But I lived, played sports, worked, did all that shit… but was – looking back – still feeling effects of concussions.
I shot a moose once, in upstate New York.
by not norm ullman on Feb 22, 2012 1:48 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
larger body of GOOD work, which considering how much shorter his NHL career has been when compared to Gus’s it is kinda troubling
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
But there ISN’T a “body” of good work. Look at this year. We can tart it up all we like, but two shut-outs mixed in with ten games of 3 or more goals against, and 3 times being pulled? And in the 14 before that? Precisely 5 games over 910 save %’s. This is his ENTIRE past year.
And last year, his entire March and April were… mixed.
What we have is that he showed a lot in January and February, and has had flashes of “solid” since. I wish he’d never been run over, because he’s been unsteady since.
But there’s no “body.”
I shot a moose once, in upstate New York.
by not norm ullman on Feb 22, 2012 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Last year he was great and this year he was great until the concussion. Will he ever get back to that level? I don’t know but at least he hit that level.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
by PPP on Feb 22, 2012 2:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Kabs was never the same after his either.
by Wan Ihite on Feb 22, 2012 1:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
he never hit 67 points again, which was probably a career outlier to begin with, but he managed 49 plus points in 4 of his next 5 seasons, and the 5th season he had 31 points in 57 games
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
oh he wasn’t BAD after, by any stretch… but possibly not quite completely his old self
(also hard to separate from reg’lar ageing, but what can you do)
by Wan Ihite on Feb 22, 2012 2:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
the same shot misses the net against Reimer too…isn’t that what made such a shitty goal to give up?
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
I don't get it.
You phrase it like a question, but punctuate it like a statement….
"I myself am made up entirely of flaws, stitched together with good intentions."
perhaps
it’s because he has a larger body of work to suggest he’s a good goalie, and that’s bought him some patience? Reimer has been far from great this year, but his stats and underlying performance suggests he deserves more chances.
Gus just doesn’t, I’m sorry. We’re playing him because of a lack of better options — a situation Burke swore he’d never get into again.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
by pevans on Feb 22, 2012 3:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Reimer was lights out to start the season…Gionta knew exactly what he was doing in throwing that flying elbow on him…..poetic justice? Gionta is done for the season
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It’s weird, to me. The tilt. But people don’t see it.
Yes, Gus lets in soft ones. But this has turned into people ranting about how he ALWAYS lets in the SOFT ones at the WORST times and then they LOSE games they otherwise should have WON.
As compared to Reimer. Our saintly friend and saviour. Who gets NO such wrath. Go ahead. Search for the comparable post saying he should be run outta town. Tain’t there. Why? Because his bad stats can be explained by him being younger… or the PK… or somesuch. At the same time, we’re doing to him exactly, exactly, what we did to Gus. Again. Instil far too much hope, with too little evidence.
Don’t think so? Think about those posts and battles about how Reimer’s stats still – still – prove he’s the real deal. His “career” ES save %.
Whereas in relaity-land…. let’s try this. Reimer’s last 5 starts… in none did he let in under 3 goals. Not one. Before that, two shutouts. But then the 5 games before that? Not a single game under 3 goals.
So. He’s stunk.
1. We need a starter.
2. Until he takes it away from the starter, Reimer should be the back-up.
3. Gus needs out of Toronto. We make wobbly players worse. And he’s wobbly.
It’s just that this site has been far far far more into Reimer than Gus, which is why I bothered defending him. A lot of people felt Reimer would lead us into the playoffs this year, even though it was the thinnest of straws to clutch at.
And now? Gus will be the reason we didn’t make the playoffs.
Ack.
I shot a moose once, in upstate New York.
by not norm ullman on Feb 22, 2012 1:39 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Here's the thing:
Reimer has been ass lately.
Gustavsson has been ass lately.
Neither has been winning games.
The difference is, only one of these goalies knocked a wide shot into his net in overtime…
RE-SIGN GRABBO
by Chris Stoikoff on Feb 22, 2012 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
shitty Reimer is miles better than shitty gustavsson
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 1:48 PM EST up reply actions
This is nonsense, again. You got nothing other than the fact that people want to rant today.
Neither one has been very good.
I shot a moose once, in upstate New York.
by not norm ullman on Feb 22, 2012 1:51 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
can you pull together any 40 of gustavssons games and come up with a 920 save percentage?
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 1:55 PM EST up reply actions
bah, that was a reply to the other thread
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 1:55 PM EST up reply actions
Kill them all.
Let the gulls take their flesh and spread it on the wind.
I shot a moose once, in upstate New York.
by not norm ullman on Feb 22, 2012 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
yes
19 Nov 2011 to 07 Feb 2012
20 GP, 545 saves on 591 shots, .922 save percent.
That’s pretty much the only one though.
But if Reimer has more of those but a lower overall percent, does that just make him streakier?
Would Hiller fare any better behind this at times,disinterested defence?..would Bernier?..Khabibulin?…Halak? if yes to any of these then make the deal Brian!!
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:27 PM EST up reply actions
because it is so easy and worth the price
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 4:28 PM EST up reply actions
Shitty Reimer is the same as shitty Gustavsson. Shitty.
Good Reimer is the same as good Gustavsson. OK.
Burke & Co. made a huge error last summer throwing a three year contract at a kid who did not deserve it and annointing him as our #1 goalie. Reimer did not deserve that. Not enough of a known commodity.
Should have signed a vet or traded for a veteran.
Why not grab Conklin off waivers now and see what he can do for the next few games? Good enough for the Wings at one point, good enough for this Leafs fan.
Loathing the Habs with every fibre of my being since 1963.
by Pyramid Power on Feb 22, 2012 7:05 PM EST up reply actions
Because Conklin’s numbers are worse than either of Reimer’s or Gustavsson’s and he’s been playing on a good Detroit team?
Cynically Sarcastic
Сертыфікаваны Grabbo Палюбоўнік
Give him a shot. Maybe he goes all Aubin for us. And he comes cheap as in for nothing.
Career redemption shot for him. Give him a shot I say. Can’t be worse than Reimer or Gus. Or can he? :)
Loathing the Habs with every fibre of my being since 1963.
by Pyramid Power on Feb 22, 2012 7:10 PM EST up reply actions
Conklin
YIkes! His numbers ARE freakin’ horrendous over the past two years in St Louis and Detroit. OK, forget about him. Sigh.
Allaire has done nothing for Toronto since his arrival. Nothing. He has not turned anyone into a decent goalkeeper. I question him and have been for a good long time.
Gotta find someone to blame. :)
What’s happening with Greiss, Nitty and Niemi down in San Jose? Anybody available?
Man, the Sharks are gonna be pissed when they come in here tomorrow. We’re in deep shit. Again.
Loathing the Habs with every fibre of my being since 1963.
by Pyramid Power on Feb 22, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions
Allaire has had who to work with exactly? The answer:
Giguerre- Pretty well established. Played well the first year, played injured the second.
Gustavsson-Oh no a European free agent goaltender didn’t turn out. Quelle horreurrre
Toskala- Refused to work with him
Reimer-Looking good for a fourth round pick to me
Scrivens/Owuya-both seem to be progressing well to me
Rynnas-Isn’t doing so well.
Important to note. All 4 of Burke’s UFA goalie signings have said that they came to Toronto because we had Allaire. ALLAIRE GOT US THOSE GOALIES.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
I think you need to compare the opinions on Gus in his first season with the Leafs against the opinions on Reimer with his first season with the Leafs. There were a lot less Gus bashers 3 years ago than there are now. People were generally optimistic. He had a few bad games, let in some stinkers, but people were willing to overlook it as he adjusted to the league and found his game. Comparing Gus now to Reimer now is unfair to Reimer. If, two seasons from now, Reimer is still playing for long stretches as he has the last few games, I’m willing to bet that there will be a lot more people on the “Run Reimer out of town” bus than there are at the current point in time.
Riding the Leafs bandwagon since 1991.
Check out my art!
by CanadianMaple09 on Feb 22, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
even though it was the thinnest of straws to clutch at.
Most people with a clue said as Reimer went so went the Leafs and that it was surely asking a lot of him.
Goose gives up more shitty goals of a shittier vintage. If I had the time I’d make a video of them for both goalies but it would take Scorcese to make Goose’s.
Reimer’s stunk post-concussion but if I had to bank on the odds I’d go with Reimer finding something he had than Goose magically discovering it after 100 games of searching.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
The difference is not, as others have said, that Reimer has a larger body of good work to make up for it. You’re right, he doesn’t. The difference is that he also doesn’t have a larger body of lousy work to drag him down, and Gustavsson does. With Gustavsson, we’re starting to be confident that he’s closer to the 2010, 2011, October and February versions of the Monster than the December-January version. With Reimer, we don’t know whether he’s closer to the 2011 and October version or the December version (which was really the only bad month of his career so far, SV%-wise).
Actually, now that I’ve looked it up, Reimer’s been .913 in February, which is exactly the same as he posted last March. In the case of either goalie, we really shouldn’t make too much of one game.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 22, 2012 3:42 PM EST up reply actions
Duh
Of course it’s a shitty victory to be right that a bad goalie on your team is, in fact, still bad.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
Gustavsson still has the best save percentage of any Leaf starter since the lockout, with the exception of Reimer’s half-season last year. That’s admittedly a low bar, and last night was probably the final nail in the coffin for most of us, conceding that the assessment he isn’t “anything but a sometimes good back-up goalie” is sadly accurate.
But that’s no reason to go off ranting about fictional apologists for last night’s debacle. This is supposed to be a site where cheering for the Leafs is allowed. IMNSHO Gustavsson deserved a chance, he got it, he looked briefly like he might even earn another season. I stand by that opinion even though analyzing the present results show “Vesa Gustavsson” to be a more apt nickname than “Monster”.
I've been looking at the sky
fictional?
I don’t want to name names unless you make me, but check the archives. Any time a post around Gustavsson comes up, anyone who points out (me included) that he’s not a “prospect” and has enough of a body of NHL work to be judged now as not very good at this level gets derided as being a traitor to the cause.
I wish him the best and would love to see him star but we’re on year 3 and it ain’t happening.
I haven’t seen many people dumping on those who say “man that sucked, i really want him to succeed! Why can’t we win” and if that’s the case i’m sorry. And also, your point that “he actually the best of a bad bunch” is sadly true. Many other goalies than him have had lousy stats in front of this team, so how much can be pinned on who is unclear. But we’ve rotated about 20 dmen through this team in the last 5 years, so how much of this is really institutional suckitude?
Three goals five hole and letting in an OT game winner that was MISSING THE NET blows, whether you’ve got Exelby/Berg in front of you or Lidstrom/Chara.
Optimism is good — it’s what makes sports bearable sometimes. But delusion just gets to me.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
Not fictional
When I made the comment I hadn’t yet noticed anyone making excuses for last night specifically. Now I see that there have been, and probably some before this post was written, so you’re correct that ‘fictional’ shouldn’t apply.
I don’t dispute that last night sucked or that for me (possibly much later than for you) he has run out of chances. I just stand by my statements in October/November that they should give him that chance before making up their mind, despite the fact that we now see he has wasted it.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 22, 2012 1:20 PM EST up reply actions
fair point
he’s been given chances. More than his statistics show he deserves.
He his far from the sole problem with this team, and I don’t want his head on a pike. I really just want him stapled to the bench or AHL for the remainder of the season, and then not resigned.
Reimer might not be the answer in net. But Gustavsson definitely isn’t.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
if we're going to suck, i want to roll with a player that has a hope of being on the team moving forward
and surely to god Gustavsson doesn’t qualify. He’s been waived 2x and nobody bit, he’s not a tradeable commodity. He’s a UFA after this season, so best of luck to him finding an NHL job somewhere else in the summer.
I am about 0.000000001% worried he “finds his game” with another club and comes back to haunt us in a “Jose Bautista for ???” sort of way but if it happens, I won’t blame Burke in the slightest for giving up on him because I have.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
I’m with you there. I said at the start of the season that I wanted to see Gustavsson get 25-30 games this year before they gave up on him. He’s had those starts and been unimpressive overall despite having the best stretch of his career. I’d be just as happy sending him to the AHL and using Scrivens as the backup the rest of the season.
Wait, has Gustavsson really been waived twice? I didn’t think he’d been waived at all.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 22, 2012 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
Gus has never been waived
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 22, 2012 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
i believe he was last year after his injury when he went down to the AHL towards the end of the season. Although that may have been an injury exemption, i’ll check
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
Conditioning stint, no waivers needed
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 22, 2012 4:30 PM EST up reply actions
right you are
I def recall a lot of consternation at the time that when he was getting shelled in 10-11, people were worried we would “lose him for nothing” if we sent him down.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
the deal he originally signed out of Sweden guarenteed a spot on the Leaf roster for the entire deal…after he made the team…at least that is what Bob McKenzie is saying
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:40 PM EST up reply actions
you know what happens don’t you? he gets picked up by Detroit and all of a sudden goes back to being a STANDUP goalie…who wins 40 plus games a year for them and wins a Cup…a la Larry Murphy
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:37 PM EST up reply actions
Fictional?
Oh boy, read my Twitter mentions. Not only are there people saying that Gustavsson is the answer in net but that he wasn’t really to blame for the bad goals against.
Cheering for the Leafs is fine. Hoping that Goose will be great because he’s had a rough go physically and personally the last few years and because he seems like a genuinely good guy is something and because it would help the Leafs is something I think everyone is behind. Thinking it will happen despite almost 100 games of proof to the contrary? That’s present and really shouldn’t be.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
Withdrawn
Last night I wasn’t noticing any defences of that performance. Clearly I underestimated the delusion. I’ve defended him before myself, but last night was a terrible game – by any standard – by a goalie who simply doesn’t have enough good games to make up for it.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 22, 2012 1:24 PM EST up reply actions
I hate to say it but I’ve all but given up on him too.
My question though is to what extend can an inconsistent goaltender, capable of fantastic saves, be made consistent? That’s where you hold out hope for him.
That’s what truly separates the professionals from the amateurs though – consistency. And increasingly it’s becoming undeniable that he will never be consistent enough.
Kids, the untradeable prospects of our future! Develop them well in the minors.
by The Blue Spirit on Feb 22, 2012 11:44 AM EST reply actions
James Reimer better be a hungry dog looking at a juicy steak.
This is his time time to bury this 1A 1B bullshit and get back into form. Jump on this terrible goal and the hate to be followed towards Gustavsson.
Our playoff hopes completely rely on it.
and you thought it was over...
pretty much
I’m no goalie expert but as far as i can tell Reimer’s struggles really come on the PK and in traffic. Hopefully that’s bad luck because most of the time he instills confidence in me.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
There’s likely no other choice to be honest. I don’t pretend to know what’s going on in the players’ heads but Lupul sure had the kind of look on his face after the goal that you would associate with a complete loss of confidence in a goalie.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
TSN Radio @TSN1050Radio
#MapleLeafs practice today: Liles, Lupul, Lombardi all absent from Leafs practice
Maybe trading the L’s for W’s?
by 9 Dollar Beer on Feb 22, 2012 12:29 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
/slow clap
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 22, 2012 1:26 PM EST up reply actions
Maintenance Day
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
Those most traumatized by the Loss?
by GettinGiggy on Feb 22, 2012 1:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
reimer vs gus
sure reimer isn’t the answer, and neither is gus, but the amount of times you just feel stupidly annoyed and angered and “WTF!” factor at a goal gustavsson lets in compared to that of reimer….gustavsson wins that hands down. Gustavssons goals just come at the most crucial point, where the softest goal just demoralizes the team, in the fact that the team is playing well and hard, doesn’t make a glaring defensive mistake (for once) and the puck still goes right thru him on a shot he should have (daugavins goal vs ottawa comes to mind right away), Lupuls face after the OT goal said it all last night. we all felt shitty but imagine how his teammates feel when they battle back (after he allows 2 other soft goals) and then he let’s in a 3rd softy. gustavsson is a master troll to all of us and to his teammates. stop feeding the troll
You could have posted a blank comment and I would have known your position.
by 9 Dollar Beer on Feb 22, 2012 12:44 PM EST up reply actions
is that because of my username….it was made during the Reimer hoopla last season, i regret it now and wish it had something to do with Grabovski
by OptimusReim on Feb 22, 2012 12:46 PM EST up reply actions
Hey no need to explain, it’s been a great story. The first few chapters anyway.
by 9 Dollar Beer on Feb 22, 2012 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
He’s stuck with it for a while. Tech team’s backed up.
Don’t lose faith in Reimer. He still has faith in you.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
It’s Sex Panther.
We settled this two months ago.
Got damn!
Cynically Sarcastic
Сертыфікаваны Grabbo Палюбоўнік
by clrkaitken on Feb 22, 2012 2:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Gus had a horrible game last night. There is no other way to explain it
That being said he still has the better S% and GAA than Reimer and for (likely) the rest of the year we are stuck with the two of them.
The mistake was made last summer when we (Burke) decided to roll with the two of them as the tandem.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 22, 2012 1:28 PM EST via mobile reply actions
he at least told Reimer not to start sucking. he did his job.
Move along. Nothing to see here...
by Van Ryn's Neurologist on Feb 22, 2012 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
That made me laugh AND cry :(
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
the story I remember…long before Burke was hired..is that JFJ was offered Vokoun straight up for Toskala and he turned the Panthers down…..don’t know how true that is or was..but where would we be now if Vokoun had become a Leaf and stayed after his deal was up(the reason he was being offered)?
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:46 PM EST up reply actions
what the hell? where do you hear these things?
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe this is progress
The only really good thing about Gustavsson’s performance last night is that I think he showed a lot of mental fortitude. It’s always good to see a goalie bounce back after a bad goal. He let in 2 absolutely awful goals and still managed to keep them in it in the 3rd. Unfortunately he followed that up by allowing easily the worst GWG I have ever seen. I’m pretty sure if OT wasn’t sudden death he would have made some more huge saves.
Yeah well that’s the kicker, ain’t it?
by 9 Dollar Beer on Feb 22, 2012 1:54 PM EST up reply actions
right, Gustavsson was what kept the Leafs in the game in the 3rd
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
thanks for doing your job one 4th of the time gus, here is a cookie
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 2:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Forget a unicorn, what this team needs is a GOALICORN
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
Sorry, unauthorized hotlinking of copyrighted material not permitted.
by Frag on Feb 22, 2012 1:59 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
Take Joseph’s face out of the mask and that thing is fucking terrifying.
by 9 Dollar Beer on Feb 22, 2012 2:01 PM EST up reply actions
WE NEED A CENTRE FOR KESSEL AND LUPUL
by wayne scarlett on Feb 22, 2012 4:48 PM EST up reply actions
I’m not trading Kessel and lupul for a centre. he’d have no wingers
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
by elseldo on Feb 22, 2012 4:54 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
I have a feeling you read that a lot differently than what he intended to say.
Wayne Scarlett mean: We need to trade for a centre to play with Lupul and Kessel.
Elseldo read it as: We need to trade Lupul and Kessel for a centre.
Riding the Leafs bandwagon since 1991.
Check out my art!
by CanadianMaple09 on Feb 22, 2012 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
*meant
Riding the Leafs bandwagon since 1991.
Check out my art!
by CanadianMaple09 on Feb 22, 2012 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
yeaup
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
by elseldo on Feb 22, 2012 5:07 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Stay on topic, hit refresh
Thread’s about Goose and Reimer and the Leafs’ goaltending not about ludicrous trade proposals. Take those to Hockey Buzz (ideally) or at least the FTB.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
eh, i think that was thoroughly talked out
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 3:00 PM EST up reply actions
my apologies for being off topic…just didn’t see another thread to post in and had to get some opinion (based on last nights performace) on an obviously ludicris trade….im loyal to PPP wouldn’g go to HB or FTB.
by killerninetythree on Feb 22, 2012 3:02 PM EST up reply actions
FTB is PPP
The Roar of the Masses Could be Farts.
by Self Destructive Zones on Feb 22, 2012 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
Some opinions are better left in your head.
Riding the Leafs bandwagon since 1991.
Check out my art!
by CanadianMaple09 on Feb 22, 2012 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
No problem
The morning links post is more of the random thread.
Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.
Like reading thoughts confined to 140 characters? I'm on Twitter too.
as what did I miss?
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
by elseldo on Feb 22, 2012 4:26 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Nabokov for the stretch run?
I think NYI is talking extension with Nabby to try to increase his value as opposed to actually wanting to lock him for the next 2 years where his value is worthless to them except in turning top-5 picks into 10th overall picks.
by scott tubbesing on Feb 22, 2012 3:35 PM EST reply actions
i dont think the islanders are that far away from being a playoff team. Good core of forwards, they — much like Edmonton — need some mobile defensive dmen and some stability in net.
Unabashed fan of the surprise 2012 Stanley Cup champs
If NYI is a playoff team the next 2 years
then the Atlantic Division is going to be ridiculous. I’m not sure that 5 teams can make it from that division and they are the obvious 5th team in that division unless Parise leaves NJ in FA and Brodeur retires.
by scott tubbesing on Feb 22, 2012 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
he is worse than any goalie the leafs have in their system
and yes
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 4:18 PM EST up reply actions
Parise will be the first player signed in FA..by Minnesota….and Brodeur said after the game last night that he is leaning towards coming back next season
he will not be signed by Minnesota just because he bought a house there
HE IS FROM THERE
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 22, 2012 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
by elseldo on Feb 22, 2012 5:03 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
To be honest, as much as the OT goal hurt, that doesn’t bother me as much as the two five-holers did. Because without those two, we wouldn’t have been in the position of OT in the first place. It was a bad bounce. It was weird. The second and third NJ goals were horrible, just bad bad goaltending. The last one could have happened to anyone. Do I still wish the Leafs had a better goalie? Yes.
by Leaf in Habland on Feb 22, 2012 5:10 PM EST reply actions
Actually I agree with this. It was not a good goal either of course, but easier to see it as a terrible bounce, mishandling yes, but the 5 holes were gawdawful. Weak shots, Gus seemed stunned, and we wouldn’t be talking about a terrible OT finish because there wouldn’t have been one.
Kids, the untradeable prospects of our future! Develop them well in the minors.
by The Blue Spirit on Feb 22, 2012 5:56 PM EST up reply actions
By the way, Gus did apologize and hold himself accountable
“Of course it doesn’t feel good right now,” Gustavsson continued, emotion raw in his voice. "Every time we lose a game I don’t feel good about it. But obviously when it happens like that of course you know you’ve could’ve done better and that’s what going to be in my head maybe tonight.
“It’s too bad. The guys worked real hard to get back into this game and a thing like that happens. I feel bad for them.”
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 22, 2012 6:40 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Cause and effect. Stop more bleeping pucks, you’ll feel better. You should feel bad for all of them Gustavsson. You should feel bad for every fan who spent 2 1/2 hours of their life they will never get back, 2 1/2 hours of a horror show that reminded all of us who have watched Maple Leaf hockey of how bad we have been in goal since before the lockout. You were supposed to make us forget Scandanavian goalies….
You wanted more than “I feel bad” and “I know I could’ve done better”? For as little as it matters, he is taking complete responsibility for the loss in that quote.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 22, 2012 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
From the November Gus thread, by Brunswick Bruiser
I close my legs
Only for a moment, then the puck goes through
All my dreams
Pass before my eyes, as I slide through the crease
Gus in the wind
All I am is Gus in the wind
Same old sound
Just a rain of booing in the ACC
All I do
Crumbles to the ground as players shoot at me
Gus cannot win
All they say is Gus cannot win
Can’t hang on
Nothing lasts forever but this Reimer guy
I slip away
And all my flailing wont a decent GAA buy
Gus to the wind
Leafs are casting Gus to the wind…
99% of player salaries are payed out to only 1% of players. #OccupyNHL
I'm a Twitter twat.
CanadianMaple09 is an effective Facebook stalker.
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