Um, Yes, Goaltending.
by JP Nikota on Feb 23, 2012 7:00 AM EST
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As you have perhaps already noticed, Brian Burke has said that the Leafs will be shopping for a goaltender at the deadline, which, I guess, means he already is. Normally, a single, wretched performance like the one Jonas Gustavsson turned in against the Devils on Tuesday night would be nothing to worry about. "It's only one game", we'd say. "Heck, the team is still in the playoffs, how could we be mad?"
While a single game should, logically, seriously alter no one's opinion of a player, I'm on board with ditching rational thought in favor of anything that helps Brian Burke see Gustavsson as expendable.
Naturally, James Mirtle has the story:
"I’m not sure that we’re not going to be in the market [for a goalie] before we’re done," Burke said. "It’s something that we have to at least explore what the price tags are. The fact is we’re losing games because we’re not stopping the puck enough. … We’ve got to get our goaltenders to stop the puck."
And there you have it, ladies and gentlemen.
Jump for more links.
Leafs Links:
Leafs goalie guru Allaire preaches patience - The Globe and Mail
"We've got two young kids in the net," Allaire said. "Not a lot of experience. Nobody has more than 90 games in the NHL. So that's normal and we're right in the middle of [the playoff race]. From James Mirtle.
Toronto Maple Leafs' goaltending problem just won't go away
"Three of those goals have to stay out ... I'm not sure we're not going to be in the market before we're done." Brian Burke on TSN Radio. Link from Bruce Arthur at the National Post.
Fraser: Was there an instigator in Phaneuf-Clarkson fight?
Fraser is one to talk about lines of sight, but he does agree that Clarkson should have received an instigator. From TSN.
As Per @Real_ESPNLeBrun
Leafs front office met yesterday. Decision was made to at least search the goalie market.
Young Swede shines in minors for Maple Leafs
OK, so it's in Reading, Pennsylvania, but still. From Kyle Cicerelli of the CP at the Globe.
Brian Burke: the legend and the myth
From Michael Langlois at VLM.
We Should Hang Out Tomorrow
And by 'tomorrow', Jeffler means 'today'.
Born and Bred
John Lofranco with a few notes on the birth places of players.
Other Hockey Links:
Score-Adjusted Fenwick standings update
Leafs sit 19th. From Eric T at Broad Street Hockey.
Senators sink Capitals
Yes, the Sens win, but the Leafs are still in the playoffs.
Mike Smith’s Wile E. "Coyotes" mask is all kinds of awesome
From Justin Bourne.
KuklasKorner: Hemsky Reportedly Wants A 4-5 Year Deal
Jim Matheson of the Edmonton Journal is the source.
The Columbus fire sale begins; Vermette to Phoenix
A few thoughts on the deal from J.P. Quayle at Puck Drunk Love.
Bernier Is a Hot Trade Topic, but Are His Numbers Good Enough?
Relevant. From Jeff Z. Klein at Slap Shot.
TSN Said What?
Over at the Copper & Blue, dawgbone98 isn't sure he's reading this correctly.
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Comments
Khabibulin
For some reason,. I am thinking he might be the guy Burke might be kicking tires on…
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
Same feeling
Ok, maybe not shoot in the head kinda feeling, but,…… Who are the options that might be out there?
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 7:48 AM EST up reply actions
Pending UFA goalies
Pending RFA goalies (longer shots)
Pending UFA 2013 goalies (1 more year on contract)
Burke says his goalie search would be for an “immediate need” so likely in the first group (pending 2012 UFAs)
A lot of ugly names on there. Nabokov the obvious standout. If Washington ever throws up the white flag maybe throw something for Vokoun, although I doubt that comes to pass with them in “the hunt” still.
Clemmensen maybe? Again, FLA in the hunt, but Markstrom is waiting in the wings.
Harding is unproven but might be interesting July 1
Biron isn’t going anywhere while on a championship-potential roster.
Al Montoya isn’t exactly a rugged Vet but he’s on the list….
Curtis Sanford…. Ray Emery… not a lot of asset-worthy trades there.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 7:55 AM EST up reply actions
Ugly
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 7:59 AM EST up reply actions
Anyone know if Niittymaki is playing well since returning from surgery? He cleared waivers getting sent down so would cost nothing to acquire but has he regained form?
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 8:00 AM EST up reply actions
Nevermind that….0.891 in the AHL
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 8:02 AM EST up reply actions
Niitty has been awful
TSN last night suggested Nabokov and Lindback are the two names that Burke might look at.
Not sure Lindback makes the Leafs better “right now” but if the price is right I wouldn’t be upset… maybe helps now but might help in the future.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 8:03 AM EST up reply actions
Not to mention he is GIGANTIC!
He and Rinne are the tallest goalie tandem in NHL history I believe..
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 8:13 AM EST up reply actions
I've been as anti-Grabbo-trade as there can be
Grabovski for Lindback+NSH 1st would give me pause to consider.
I still prefer re-signing, but that trade addresses a need for both teams….
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 8:20 AM EST up reply actions
We were talking about this last night
Lindback’s numbers are really unimpressive at all levels in North America
I think if Burke is going to be trading with Nashville for Grabo he’d (should) be trying to get Colin Wilson in return.
What would the Leafs have to add to make Grabo+ for Lindback+Wilson.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
You mentioned COlin Wilson… that sets off the birky signal
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
I'm at work/ Don't know what Birky looks like so I can't photoshop this to fit 100% but...
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
We love you Gary Roberts!
I shot a moose once, in upstate New York.
by not norm ullman on Feb 23, 2012 11:00 AM EST up reply actions
Somewhat relevant.
At least it's not Lebda.
by Nifty Mittens on Feb 23, 2012 12:33 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Lindback is currently worse than both our goalies. He’s a long term move, not immediate help.
If we send Grabbo to Nash, Lindback is going to be a throw in with Wilson + 1st rounder.
Lindback is going to be a throw in with Wilson + 1st rounder.
I’m a huge Grabbo fan but even I think that’s overpayment.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:43 AM EST up reply actions
It would only make sense if Nashville also took Gus which would be just silly on their part.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:45 AM EST up reply actions
Their system would make Gustavsson put up .950’s and Toronto media would show the world how stupid Burke is.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:48 AM EST up reply actions
so you’re saying Gus is better than Rinne?
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:49 AM EST up reply actions
It would show Mitch is a better goalie coach than Frankie
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
they made amends apparently
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Oh when was that?
Last I heard they had a serious hate on for eachother.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 12:16 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
The Washington Capitals are not trading their .920 goalie to the team they’re one game behind in the playoff race.
The plural of "anecdote" is not "data".
Internet Champ. I'm on Twitter too! - draglikepull
by Draglikepull on Feb 23, 2012 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
this guy looks like paul maurice
Glenn Healy = Human sewage.
Scrivens on a prayer...
by Future_considerations on Feb 23, 2012 8:58 AM EST up reply actions
Haha, no
Khabibulin is the one of the few goalies who will actually make us worse
I've always wanted to kick a duck up the arse
When I think of Khabby, all I hear repeating over and over again in my head is
..old guy in the FRONT seat, headcase in the BACK seat…
Come get your duds in order 'cuz we're bound to cross the water, HEAVE AWAY, me jollies, HEAVE AWAY -- Bowl of Fruit Lups in the evening gets the playoffs started!!
Which one is Khabibeerin?
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
He can be in the front AND back seat at the same time?
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
So no one is going to say this is a bit Knee-Jerk on Reimer? Are there really options worth chasing for first round playoffs that we should sell him up the creek? The whole team doesn’t look ready for the playoffs. Let’s not hope for something rash.
Play Reimer. See what happens.
So, apparently I can now be followed.. but no stalking. @alsonamedphil
No, i agree. It’s crazy to try to find a stop gap at this point. Let the players play it out.
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
If he doesn’t find anything for a decent price, he doesn’t find anything. No harm in testing the market for a position that has had very little improvement since Burke arrived.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 8:02 AM EST up reply actions
I think it makes sense, if not at the deadline, then July 1st. Gus isn’t coming back (I hope) and I think Reimer needs more time to develop. We need someone to shoulder the load to take the pressure off of Reimer, let him find his groove again, instead of just throwing him in net and hoping for the best.
by JohnerstonRex on Feb 23, 2012 10:19 AM EST up reply actions
So no one is going to say this is a bit Knee-Jerk on Reimer?
What are people saying knee-jerk about Reimer? We need two goalies either way. It’s Gustvasson that’s not part of the future and not getting the job done.
Reimer has at times been great but not spectacular since his head injury in October. He’s signed for 2 more years and is 23 and even here we rated him the #3 Maple Leafs under 25.
See what happens.
Status quo isn’t really getting the job done with 6 losses in 7 games. If the position could get stabilized for a mid-round pick? Nobody is saying sell the farm for a small hint at playoffs.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 7:59 AM EST up reply actions
I think it’s more than just the 6 losses in 7 games, but the overall inconsistency in net this year. Stretches of good, stretches of bad, stretches of crazy. Burke knows the team has plenty of goaltending depth through the minors, but the team is thin on NHL-ready talent.
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 8:58 AM EST up reply actions
Reasonable heads have this opinion. Others are holding the “new goaltender or everything sucks” type of attitude. I see enough problems throughout the team that don’t involve both goaltenders that the growing charge that the Leafs must sign a new goaltender is, I think, the wrong way.
Reimer has barely gotten a chance to find consistency as soon as Wilson went to this “win and your in” strategy, which I think was a very bad idea (what was it? Reimer stopped 32 of 35 and lost but they felt better about Gus who stopped 21 of 24 and won? That was rotten.). Reimer had a decent February so far, with the only truly bad game being against Montreal (I didn’t see Vancouver, but figured they’d have hung either goaltender out to dry). I still think the wise move is to give Reimer the load and then chase options in summer if necessary – there will be more then, undoubtably. Reasonable deadline guys are going to be Nabokov and… er… yeah. That probably won’t help.
So, apparently I can now be followed.. but no stalking. @alsonamedphil
If it was my preference, I’d let Reimer run with the starter job for the rest of the year, and give Owuya or Scrivens the occasional start to see if either of them can give us better back-up performances than Gustavsson has been. I really do not want to give up assets for rental players in a season where we’re clearly not a contender.
The plural of "anecdote" is not "data".
Internet Champ. I'm on Twitter too! - draglikepull
by Draglikepull on Feb 23, 2012 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
Even though it’s becoming clear that Gus might not play again I’m not sure they’re ballsy enough to throw him on waivers
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
Clear to us (and seemingly Burke) but apparently not to Wilson, why else the secrecy / hedging about tonight?
by GettinGiggy on Feb 23, 2012 12:46 PM EST up reply actions
Reimer
I STILL feel Reimer is going to be a #1 goalie, I never disputed that. The issue is we need options in net an right now, we don’t have them. Despite losing 6 out of 7 we are STILL in the playoffs (which blows my mind) Safe to say Gus is done in TO in my opinion. Reims has no confidence right now…..
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
Not selling the farm
Agreed, not sure who , but whoever it is, isn’t going to cost a roster player …….maybe Rosehill, Boo Hoo! Late pick…
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
Nabokov might cost a 2nd. I don’t see how you could pay more for 20 games (+hopefully playoffs) of hockey
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 8:03 AM EST up reply actions
If we could get Lindback who is RFA i might prefer that. More of a roll of the dice but young and potential… more of Burke’s continual improvement MO
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 8:04 AM EST up reply actions
Goalie Potential
I thought we had a wealth of “potential” in Rynnas, Scrivens, Owuya (IS the guy to watch) A proven guy woulnd’t break my heart! Rynnas and Scrivens are RFA, so Burke is going to need to figure it out….
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 8:09 AM EST up reply actions
“Potential” is nice.
Keep them simmering in the minors.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 8:18 AM EST up reply actions
I asked above what it would take beyond just Grabo to get him and Wilson before I realized that Lindback is no better a fit for us than anyone we currently have on our team or in the system. Lindback has faced a grand total of 799 shots in the NHL for his career with a svp% of .909. In the last 2 years he’s played a combined 38 games. Reimer has a career .913 svp over 62 games and 1845 shots in his career.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
And by no better fit in the system I mostly meant Reimer is more proven as a starter with better #‘s, and that Lindback is so raw and unproven he doesn’t help us this year. I thought Lindbacks #’s were worse than .909.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
Also, Reimer has put up much better numbers in both AHL and ECHL (and before that). Lindback hasn’t even put up decent numbers in the AHL or really in Europe
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
Right. Lindback is another lottery ticket at this point.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
Side note: if you’re not following Fake Lindback, you should be.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
Trade Deadline Prediction
Ales Hemsky doesn’t get traded before the deadline and walks UFA on July 1. Oilers fans cry.
No no, dig UP stupid.
Hilarity ensues. Should have traded him last yr when he had value.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 9:01 AM EST up reply actions
This made me chuckle
Written by a Canucks fan who had Luongo as captain and gave the C to their best player as well. Yet no mention of that, but he criticizes CBJ and ANAHEIM.
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
I agree with his stated point, but then he goes on to criticize multiple examples where teams didn’t hand the C to their best player. Evidently what he really believes is that he knows better than NHL teams across the league who their captains should be.
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 23, 2012 8:49 AM EST up reply actions
plus in some cases players vote on the captain (Craig Rivet in Buffalo)
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
I think that’s a better system.
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 9:03 AM EST up reply actions
Great Site
If anyone hasn’t seen this yet..
http://www.eliteprospects.com/team.php?team=76
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
The Leafs have 22 scouts. Is that really enough to scour all the leagues of the globe effectively?
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 9:10 AM EST up reply actions
That’s not including former long time players who are involved with junior hockey that probably throw names our way (maybe?)
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:13 AM EST up reply actions
Yup, plenty of former players at OHL games.
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
Well I was thinking too of Mats and Borje in Sweden too
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:18 AM EST up reply actions
too many toos in that sentence
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:18 AM EST up reply actions
The only things Mats is scouting are bears
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 9:23 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
See no, he’s scouting for our next goaltender… 500 lb. Grizzly Bear in goalie pads named “Anders”… tell me who’s going to score on that?
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:29 AM EST up reply actions
There’s no rule saying a bear can’t play hockey!
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
Hey Anders brings the compete game in and game out
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:33 AM EST up reply actions
We could use a bear at no. 1 centre too
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 9:46 AM EST up reply actions
… we all know the history between Kessel and bears… that wouldn’t end well
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:48 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
We already had 1 monster – and a Swedish one at that
by GettinGiggy on Feb 23, 2012 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
Does that make him a Cub Scout?
Where’s my rimshot app…
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 23, 2012 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
I go to that site often for statistic information on European prospects. It’s one of the best.
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
Sorry, unauthorized hotlinking of copyrighted material not permitted.
oh god please make it stop
Ed Belfour
JS Aubin
Mikael Tellqvist
Andrew Raycroft
Vesa Toskala
Scott Clemmensen
Martin Gerber
Curtis Joseph
Justin Pogge
Jonas Gustavsson
JS Giguere
Joey MacDonald
James Reimer
Ben Scrivens
That's "Da-ooo". Oh, and I tweet now too @dannyd1976.
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by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 8:52 AM EST up reply actions
ouch
-"I'm not drinking and driving, I'm driving while I'm drinking....Right boys!?"
Lest we forget: Brett Lebda
Holy hell that is depressing.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 9:06 AM EST up reply actions
It sure puts 6 3/4 seasons if goaltending misery in perspective.
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by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 9:11 AM EST up reply actions
The graph may be worse than the list.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 9:15 AM EST up reply actions
Yes, but if the Lightning are any indication, than the Leafs are just a zombie away from reaching the Conference finals.
So what you’re saying is:
1) Trade for Brodeur
2) Play him
3)???
4) Conference Finals
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:35 AM EST up reply actions
Teams that compare
Columbus (13 goalies)
Steve Mason, Pascal Leclaire, Fredrik Norrena, Mathieu Garon, Marc Denis, Curtis Sanford, Ty Conklin, Martin Prusek, Allen York, Dan LaCosta, Brian Boucher, Wade Dubielewicz, Tomas Popperle
Islanders (15 goalies)
Rick DiPietro, Dwayne Roloson, Joey MacDonald, Al Montoya, Wade Dubielewicz, Yann Danis, Evgeni Nabokov, Martin Biron, Garth Snow, Mike Dunham, Kevin Poulin, Nathan Lawson, Mikko Koskinen, Peter Mannino, Anders Nilsson
Phoenix (13 goalies)
Ilya Bryzgalov, Curtis Joseph, Mikael Tellqvist , Jason LaBarbera, Mike Smith, David LeNeveu, Brian Boucher, Alex Auld, Al Montoya, Philippe Sauve, Mike Morrison, Curtis McElhinney, Josh Tordjman
Tampa Bay (15 goalies)
Mike Smith, Johan Holmqvist, Dwayne Roloson, John Grahame, Marc Denis, Antero Niittymaki, Karri Ramo, Mathieu Garon, Sean Burke, Dan Ellis, Mike McKenna, Olaf Kolzig, Gerald Coleman, Cedrick Desjardins, Dustin Tokarski
It’s interesting to see the re-occurring names on different teams
"The Passion Continues..."
by WendelMadeMe on Feb 23, 2012 9:24 AM EST up reply actions
Yep,
Garon, Roloson, Smith, Montoya all show up a couple times
the rest are either Steve Mason, Rick Dipietro, Bryzgalov, or retired/AHLd
by Ben Schnell on Feb 23, 2012 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
Your Isles list is flawed:
A. It only counts Rick DiPietro once.
B. It doesn’t count the fact that being an Islander Goalie is a good way to break into your post-hockey career – see Mike Dunham and Garth Snow.
Writer at Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times
Pitchf/x enthusiast.
http://twitter.com/#!/garik16
Two, maybe three Hall of Famers on that list.
A long way from the peaks of their careers, though…
I've been looking at the sky
by Back In Black on Feb 23, 2012 8:50 AM EST up reply actions
Could have used Giguere this year. He’s having an awfully nice year in Colorado.
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by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 8:54 AM EST up reply actions
Hindsight is a bitch
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Except I was advocating bringing back Giguere last summer, and especially not going with Reimer and Gustavsson which really was a disaster waiting to happen in my opinion.
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by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 9:02 AM EST up reply actions
I’m not too upset we didn’t bring him back… I think he burned his bridges when he tried to play on his groin and basically fucked the team out of a lot of points
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:08 AM EST up reply actions
Joey MacDonald!
Proud Members of:
#TeamRe-signGrabovski
#TeamKuleminIsMyGoat
#TeamTradeSchennNotGunnar
Yeah, I honestly wish we had kept him as a cheap back-up
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:09 AM EST up reply actions
He was horrible in his 6 games with us.
Useless comments since 2009.
by PassivelyTruculent on Feb 23, 2012 1:28 PM EST up reply actions
when you lay the names down like that, its soul-crushing
Glenn Healy = Human sewage.
Scrivens on a prayer...
by Future_considerations on Feb 23, 2012 8:59 AM EST up reply actions
it’s also sad that after we let Clemmensen go he’s been a .908 goalie or better.
Giggy too has done well since we let him go.
Move along. Nothing to see here...
by Van Ryn's Neurologist on Feb 23, 2012 9:20 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe it’s not them, it’s us. Sigh.
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 9:25 AM EST up reply actions
Even Raycroft has a .901 save % since leaving. Was .890 as a Leaf.
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by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 9:27 AM EST up reply actions
Better, but still terrible. I don’t think there’s a convincing argument that the Leafs are ruining goaltenders. Giggy played on a busted hip. Raycroft is still terrible. Toskala not only isn’t in the league any more, but isn’t winning in Finnish leagues.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
In fairness to Toskala, this time it really isn’t his fault.
OPERATION TANK IS A GO.
In an unprecedented move 9 teams in the Eastern Conference have decided to officially "pass" on the playoffs
Or from the other end.
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 10:01 AM EST up reply actions
.901 is pretty bleh, relatively speaking, but going from .890 to .901 is still a pretty significant difference
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 9:48 AM EST up reply actions
.901 is replacement level. Just about anyone in the AHL should be able to step in and put up .901 goaltending. Ben Scrivens put up a .904 in 8 games and we all remember him as being god awful.
The First Certified Grabbo Lover
Didn’t he have a couple of really good games and a couple of really bad ones?
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 9:57 AM EST up reply actions
He had like 2 good games. One against CBJ and one against St Louis
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
That seems so long ago now
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
38/41 on CAR, 38/40 on STL, 33/35 on PHX, 38/39 on CBJ. 4 good games.
He gets remembered for 5/7 on FLA, 9 on 14 of BOS, 19/22 on OTT, 18/21 on NSH. Two bad games, two “meh” games, all against playoff teams which were on some pretty nasty hot streaks at the time. Not suggesting he’s an answer right now, but I’m not about to write him off as a prospect.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
Im slipping
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
You admitting you were wrong? I am shocked!
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 12:19 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I know, I too am shocked that I was wrong
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
why would anyone write off scrivens? because he’s 25? Whatever, goalies take more time and he took the college path. There are plenty of good goalies over 30, and Scrivens is putting up good numbers at the AHL level.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 10:49 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah. Got lit up against Boston and Florida, but outside of that, wasn’t awful. Good games were against CBJ, STL, PHX, and CAR. “Meh” against NSH and OTT.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:00 AM EST up reply actions
So yesterday Burke said, “we’re interested in a goalie that can help us now,” which tells us a couple things:
A) Probably not chasing Lindback or Harding
B) Probably still believes in Reimer longterm
C) He probably means either Nabokov or Khabibulin
http://bluechipprospects.blogspot.com
If he’s looking for a “goalie that can help us now” he better not mean Khabibulin. The only team Khabibulin is whoever’s shooting on him.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
Nabokov is the only one of the 2 that I’ve heard named that I would want on a short term basis. Maybe Biron on a 1 year deal for next year.
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 9:20 AM EST up reply actions
did he specifically say now?
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
I’m gonna get made fun of this, but how about Budaj? The Habs playoff dreams must have given up the ghost by now.
Plus he’s signed for one more year, which makes him a backup option for Reimer into 2012-13 season, giving time for Owuscrinnas to emerge as an alternative. And that makes any mid-round pick we give up less of a waste.
This year, he’s got a .906 SV% and a 2.73 GAA.
Next season of 24/7: "I am named Mikhail. I watch video to fold together strategy. I want outdoors to fight bravely."
by Peter de Chatham on Feb 23, 2012 9:38 AM EST up reply actions
I dislike the idea of giving up assets within the division for a guy who’s probably not a great help. His .906 is just one point better than Gustavsson’s season .905.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
Yeah I guess. His GAA is better too, but again not by a huge amount. However, he did have winning seasons with modest save percentages, like 31-16-6 with a .905 SV% in 2006-7, or 16-10-4 with a .903 SV% the following year.
Also, Montreal would presumably want to shed salary going into next year so they can grab free agents. Probably wouldn’t have to give up a lot for him.
Next season of 24/7: "I am named Mikhail. I watch video to fold together strategy. I want outdoors to fight bravely."
by Peter de Chatham on Feb 23, 2012 9:55 AM EST up reply actions
Don’t use Ws to evaluate a goaltender. Ever. If you do, you might start letting guys like Chris Osgood into the Hall of Fame, and we wouldn’t want that.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
I’d also like to point out that if Burke had an expectation that Gus would average out to .905 and 2.90 over the rest of the season, we’d probably not be looking for a goaltender.
Next season of 24/7: "I am named Mikhail. I watch video to fold together strategy. I want outdoors to fight bravely."
by Peter de Chatham on Feb 23, 2012 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
he’s been that all season with highs and lows in between. One game has not changed that.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
I’m gonna get made fun of this, but how about Budaj?
Now, why on earth would you think that?
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
I will never understand why you like Budaj so much. He is in no way better than Gus or Reimer. He has had one good season and besides that has done crap all and barely ever carried a heavy load. He is an average back up AT BEST and is more likely a below average back up.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 12:20 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Why not Harding now?
I know he’s injured, but he could be back relatively soon, I wouldn’t rule him out.
I think there are prospects like Lindback/Bishop who not only could help us now (they aren’t worse than Gus now), and are very likely to be better long-term as well.
I think Nabokov is probably the guy they’re actively thinking about, but I don’t think Burke’s statement means Harding is probably not being looked at.
by LeftNutForAStarCenter on Feb 23, 2012 5:46 PM EST up reply actions
Vokoun?
His agent is pissed Hunter threw him under the bus, so obviously it means he is coming to the Leafs…..
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
isnt his agent Walsh?
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Yep
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2012/02/23/vokoun_agent_walsh_upset_with_hunter/
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
Is it just me or is this not something agents should be doing. Agents act on behalf of the players they represent so this is only one small step away from Vokoun himself publicly criticizing his own coach which is far more ‘wrong’ than anything Dale Hunter said. If I am Vokoun I’d be mighty ticked off that my agent felt the need to directly interfere in my day to day relationship with my coach. If I am another player with Walsh as my agent I immediately call him up and tell him to shut his mouth about anything related to me or my play or how my team treats me.
And most importantly, if Vokoun approves of his agent using these tactics, I don’t want him on the Leafs.
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by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
I doubt that Walsh did this without informing or discussing it with Vokoun. I don’t mind discussing player happiness with the media, but Walsh relies on it way, way too much. He’s done it with Halak and a couple others – I’d be treating him as the agent that cried wolf, if I were in the press. He’s just using it to increase negotiating power and public opinion without being directly confrontational.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
Well, if Vokoun approves this then I’d view it the same as if Vokoun said it himself and the “win as a team, lose as a team” theory holds true as well. No well respected team player would publicly throw their coach under the bus like Walsh/Vokoun did. I hope he never becomes a Leaf. For that matter, I hope no Allan Walsh represented player becomes a Leaf (do we currently have any we can use as trade bait?).
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by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
I think that’s quite the strict stance, and given Walsh’s successes as a player agent in the league, not one that many GMs hold. If we’re getting .920 goaltending, I’ll take a player agent screaming directly into my ear for every single game.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:36 AM EST up reply actions
Exactly
I don’t really care what and agent is saying, especially on an expiring contract. If he can come in and keep the puck out of the net , I don’t care whats being said!
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
It something an agent says on behalf of his client becomes disruptive in the dressing room, I care. I think what Allan Walsh said goes beyond defending his player to criticizing the coach and that can be disruptive.
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HockeyAnalysis.com - Taking a Deeper Look at the World of Hockey
by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 10:43 AM EST up reply actions
given it’s Allan Walsh, and he has a history of being a complete douche canoe in public regarding his clients, I think anything he says is probably disregarded in the room … other than the guys using it to rib Vokoun about it.
He likely doesn’t have a lot of credibility with players when he’s shooting his mouth off.
This space for rant...
by fair_n_hite_451 on Feb 23, 2012 12:19 PM EST up reply actions
It something an agent says on behalf of his client becomes disruptive in the dressing room, I care
Prove it
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Well, we’ll see how it pans out for him. He seems to have been much more vocal the past couple years. Personally, I think agents should be more behind the scenes.
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by HockeyAnalysis on Feb 23, 2012 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
I’ll take any goalie on the Leafs on an expiring cheap contract that can put up good numbers.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 10:56 AM EST up reply actions
There’s only 2 goalies that fit that criteria…. Vokoun and Nabokov.
Vokoun likely isn’t available.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:57 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah I wasn’t saying there were a lot or really any good options, just saying I dont give a fuck what Vokoun said about his coach in WSH if he’s a guy we have for 20 games to get us into the playoffs.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 11:01 AM EST up reply actions
I agree with you, but players apparently don’t. Friedman discussed Walsh’s tactics in 30 Thoughts once, and he was told by one of Walsh’s players they’re fine with him doing that sort of thing.
The plural of "anecdote" is not "data".
Internet Champ. I'm on Twitter too! - draglikepull
by Draglikepull on Feb 23, 2012 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
If it were up to me, I’d say Gus has an injury, do an emergency call-up, and see if Owuya steals the show.
Owuya
Some with a name like that and has mad rapping skillz , yeah with a z , has potential. Gus’ injury is not being an NHL goalie…
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
Oh ya, Mark Owuya, first year on NA ice, 22 years old, teams needs goaltending, NO PRESSURE KID
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
“Okay, bud. You’ve been doing well in the minors, so we’re going to put it all on you to stop this losing streak.”
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:09 AM EST up reply actions
I think you can reward someone with a chance to prove themself without saying ‘ALL IS LOST IF YOU DON’T STEP IN AND DELIVER RIGHT NOW"
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
Sure. But after being eliminated from the playoffs, not before.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
His reward this season was jumping to the AHL. IF he keeps playing out of his mind, next year we can MAYBE think about rewarding him by bringing him up. It’s his 1st season in NA… let’s give him some time to make the adjustment
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
Not to mention even just last night someone who makes his living scouting goalies (Justin from goalieguild) said Owuya is still just a ball of clay who needs 3-4 years of molding to be an NHL goalie.
THREE OR FOUR YEARS!
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions
He’s played a grand total of 16 games above the ECHL level in his career he must be NHL ready
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
He’s played a grand total of 16 games above the ECHL level in his career, there’s no possible way he could be successful.
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:42 AM EST up reply actions
He’s only played 3 games that matter (I’m dropping the first 13 games), that’s way to 3SA to make any assessment of him.
This space for rant...
by fair_n_hite_451 on Feb 23, 2012 11:00 AM EST up reply actions
He might not need that long given how well he has adjusted to the NA style, he already took Rynnas’ job (but will go back to the ECHL for starter time as the Marlies roll with Scrivens). But yeah, probably another 2 years.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 10:57 AM EST up reply actions
He took Rynnas job partly because Rynnas got a concussion
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
partly, but Rynnas hasn’t put up as good numbers this year, too.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
There’s a pretty large body of evidence that it takes months for goalies to regain their form after a concussion.
OPERATION TANK IS A GO.
In an unprecedented move 9 teams in the Eastern Conference have decided to officially "pass" on the playoffs
This is why I’m not worried about Reimer
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
yeah and I’m not worried about Rynnas either, but goalies can steal other goalie’s spots in the depth charts, as we well know.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t disagree with this at all. Right now Rynnas is deservedly 5th. But he can come back next year and be 3rd again. He has the talent.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 11:14 AM EST up reply actions
yup. Although we have goaltending problems right now, I’m actually not worried about longer-term. We got quite a few good prospects, and I have the feeling one or two (including Reimer, obviously) will be NHL goaltenders in the next few years.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
And this is why getting someone like Lindback is overkill imo.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
totally agree. Goalie that helps us right now or bust. If there’s nothing, fuck it we run with Reimer.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
You mean an injury can possibly affect a players performance? Since when?
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
I haven’t seen him play personally so I defer to the guy who gets paid to scout goalies
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
Like they did Gustavsson? I think that was a big stumbling block in his development, that and not being very good....
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 10:32 AM EST up reply actions
Disagree, the team comes before the player. If he gives the Leafs the best chance to win, you play him. Either way, it’s nice knowing Allaire wouldn’t be afraid to give a young goalie a chance.
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
Ok I’ll put it a different way… point me to all the goalies under 24 who have come over from Europe, played in the NHL in their 1st season and have turned out to be good goalies
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:35 AM EST up reply actions
ANDERS LINDBACK IS AN ALLSTAR RIGHT!?!
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:37 AM EST up reply actions
Also I don’t wanna say it but I need to prove you wrong…
Henrik Lundqvist was 23 his rookie year…
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:38 AM EST up reply actions
One player does not a point make.
Also I think you’re wrong on so many levels. I just like being a dick and ruining other peoples narritives
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
Oh god I would love to be wrong and have Owuya turn out to be Henrik freakin’ Lundqvist.
But I doubt it.
Point taken though
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
How is Patrick Roy trolling? he doesn’t fit as he grew up playing NA hockey…
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
because I know people are going to pile the fuck on. :)
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
Birthplace doesn’t matter… # of years playing in North America does. Different size rinks, different angles different style of play.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
Owuya… a 22 yr old who people (Justin from GG) says is 3 or 4 years away from being an actual NHL goalie as he is still raw as hell
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
As of right now, I have no idea. Play Reimer and hope a decent vet becomes available. Leafs have played themselves into the corner here.
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
I agree, but you can’t play Reimer for each game that remains, and at this point if it’s between Gus, Owuya, Scrivens, or giving up asset for a Nabokov, I’d say it’s pretty close between Nabokov and Owuya.
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
How is it pretty close. Leafs are in the middle of a playoff run and you automatically wanna hand the reins to a kid in his first season in NA. Seriously?
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Ugh, hand the reins? That’s what you’re getting from what I’m saying?
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:37 AM EST up reply actions
Yes because calling up a raw developing kid to sit on the bench and play 4 of the last 22 games is even dumber than giving him the reigns
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:42 AM EST up reply actions
see if Owuya steals the show
That means play him does it not?
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
That means give him a backup start, and play him until he’s anything less than solid.
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:48 AM EST up reply actions
sooo in other words… give him the reigns and toss him aside once he fucks up?
Great development strategy
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:50 AM EST up reply actions
because he’s hot garbage as soon as he’s had one bad game? This whole ’don’t spoil your goaltending prospects’ by giving them proper NHL experience reeks of Narrativist BS.
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:53 AM EST up reply actions
This is why Toronto cant have nice things. Once a player gets a little spotlight shined on them, fans get the idea that they are hot shit and should be in the NHL this minute.
Let Owuya develop naturally in the ECHL and AHL
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
See also Kadri, Colborne, Frattin, Zigomanis, Gustavsson, etc.
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:56 AM EST up reply actions
Zigomanis???
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Spotlight shined on him by Cherry, suddenly he’s the miracle solution….
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 11:11 AM EST up reply actions
Ya but he is also 30 years old
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Once a player gets a little spotlight shined on them, fans get the idea that they are hot shit and should be in the NHL this minute.
You didn’t set an age so I threw him in there. Either way.. I’m agreeing with you
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
I try to stay away from sarcasm, but you’re totally right – all these guys are scratched lottery tickets that we might as well throw in the garbage.
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
Since when did we say throw Owuya in the garbage? We said give him his time in the minors to develop. Allaire said just yesterday that the Marlies are going to roll with Scrivens. If Owuya was so good/ready why is he slated to go back to the ECHL?
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
wasn’t talking to you, but your response is a pretty good example of why I avoid it.
a) Owuya wasn’t in the list that I responded to.
but
b) you said directly below this thread “Why ruin Owuya’s development?” as if he would be garbage if we called him up for two games and he didn’t do well.
and
c) you go on to just repeat points that have already been made.
and with that, I’m done for the day
by A Lindros Jaw on Feb 23, 2012 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
Owuya is going back to the ECHL because the Marlies are Scrivens team and they are gearing up for the playoffs. He will get the majority of starts. Owuya goes back to Reading to play every game and hopefully make a long playoff run like Reimer did 2 yrs ago.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
That wasn’t sarcasm… those are all cases of players getting hype, getting called up (except for Zigomanis), not performing, and then people deciding they’re crap
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
Why not Scrivens? He’s had some good games for the Leafs playing will in the AHL. Why Owuya over him? Why ruin Owuya’s development?
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
I was just saying he has potential, and a mad rapper. Never said bring him up to save the day
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
Playing in the NHL comes with pressure. It’s not an easy job. If your prospects can’t handle the pressure they’re not prospects.
At this point I think we should give Owuya a start. “Show us what you got kid.”
Pension Plan Puppets*
* Blog contains less than 2% puppet content by weight.
by Chemmy on Feb 23, 2012 11:23 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions 2 recs
Once we’re mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, sure.
Until then? GBSR.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 11:25 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah that’s my view. If we’re eliminated, throw in in one of the last games as we have done with other prospects (Colborne, namely)
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
I disagree, let him have one full season of ECHL/AHL duty. No need to rush him
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Exactly
We rush our prospects way too fast. Many of the good European goalies had to spend some time in the A (like a year or two) to adjust to the NA game. He is young and according to Goalie Guild still pretty raw.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 12:22 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think there’s a big difference between “You’re playing the next 20 games. Better win them so we can make the playoffs” and “Reimer is still the main guy in net but we’d like to give you a couple of games to see how well you perform against stronger competition.”
The plural of "anecdote" is not "data".
Internet Champ. I'm on Twitter too! - draglikepull
by Draglikepull on Feb 23, 2012 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
Show us what you got kid
*Mark starts rapping
At least it's not Lebda.
by Nifty Mittens on Feb 23, 2012 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
Can we let Owuya just chill in the minors right now? He’s not even on the Marlies, he’s in the ECHL. Kid is doing great as a prospect. Keep it up.
Any callup would be Scrivens.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:45 AM EST up reply actions
He’s not even on the Marlies, he’s in the ECHL.
This is incorrect. Rynnas is in the ECHL, Owuya is on the Marlies.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:47 AM EST up reply actions
I was about to say… he played on the 17th…
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:48 AM EST up reply actions
He's going back though
The club will likely ride Scrivens as its No. 1 heading into playoffs. As a result, Owuya is expected to return to the ECHL to see more playing time.
“Mark will finish the season over there (Reading),” said Allaire. “He gets lots of action there and he’s going to try to make the playoffs with that team.”
http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=388552
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:50 AM EST up reply actions
CALL HIM UP TO THE LEAFS
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Yup. Rynnas was down on a “conditioning stint” – but my point was just that Owuya could easily be called an AHL-level goaltender at this point, and is sorta just down there by virtue of age/seniority.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:54 AM EST up reply actions
I was in the minority when it came to talking about SPC slots/who will be on the Marlies next year, but I’m not 100% sure Burke puts a QO for Jussi Rynnas. Both him and Scrivens are RFAs this summer.
Do they give Rynnas 1 more year and evaluate then? I don’t know how long Leafs can run 3 goalies between AHL/ECHL that are putting up decent number.
This is under the assumption that Burke goes and gets a Vet/UFA goalie next year and doesn’t run Reimer/Scrivens.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
This is under the assumption that Burke goes and gets a Vet/UFA goalie next year and doesn’t run Reimer/Scrivens.
Until I see otherwise, I’m pretty much expecting this to be our starting pair next year. That said, so what if the Leafs have a talented prospect in the ECHL? I don’t see how that’s any worse than letting them walk completely. I think the Leafs see too much potential in Rynnas to let him walk. He, Owuya, and Scrivens can fight it out, assuming one of them isn’t in the NHL, and may the best man start (although it’ll be interesting from a development perspective whether the team values high start ECHL or split start AHL).
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
I see this too… with the attrition rates of goalies who never quite make it I’d rather not give up on someone with Rynnas’ talent after 2 injury plagued seasons.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
yup. I think he’s speeding up his development. Instead of 3-4 years I could easily see him NHL ready in 2 years if he keeps this up. He’s killed it in BOTH the AHL and ECHL.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
I'm not good at anything, Sorry
"Pass to the Left, Cause the Right is Wrong!!"
Reimer........
@Scradam31
by LeafsLaughToo on Feb 23, 2012 10:05 AM EST up reply actions
Kipper. Unlikely the flames become sellers before the summer though.
by MolyHackinaw on Feb 23, 2012 10:05 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Even when the Flames become sellers, no way does Kipper move. He’s the MVP of the team and everyone knows it.
This space for rant...
by fair_n_hite_451 on Feb 23, 2012 10:09 AM EST up reply actions
True… but think of the value they could get for him… I know I’m willing to pay a decent amount to get him
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
yeah but what would you do with him? just toss things at him? have him play in your beer league?
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
I guess it’d be pretty fun to just pay him to stand in my apartment in his gear so I can throw things at him when the Leafs fuck up
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:16 AM EST up reply actions
OT
Someone is actually suing the Miami Marlins saying they bought the team for $10 million at an auction in 2008.
Over/under on how long this lawsuit takes to get thrown out of court due to stupidity… 9 business days. 8 1/2 days for the legal team of the Marlins to stop laughing, 5 minutes to right up “seriously wtf are they thinking” in Legalese and the rest of the day to take it to the court house.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
I don’t know, if they put the Marlins in, even as a joke, and someone bid on them with the minimum bid… he’s got an argument there. It’s a bad argument, but it’s still an argument. The Marlins could likely just say “Ok, we’d like that $10M now” (which the guy probably doesn’t actually have)
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:18 AM EST up reply actions
A) it was the president not the owner so he has no authority to sell the team
B) there can be reserve amounts in auctions so if it doesn’t hit a certain amount it doesn’t get sold. Auctioneers will still start below that # to bring more people into the auction hoping people get caught up in it going higher than they would’ve if they started at a higher amount.
C) I would not risk saying okay give me the money and its yours. Any bank in the world would finance that in a heartbeat. 10 million for a 500 million enterprise?
D) worst comes to worst and the MLB can step in and stop it due to being exempt from antitrust. They can stop any sale.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:27 AM EST up reply actions
A) Depends on if the dude can establish that the President had apparent authority in agency law to bind the team.
B) I was assuming his bid met the reserve amount.
C) You’re right
D) Yeah, it’d be very similar to the Coyotes case (though a South Florida judge MIGHT see it differently)
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
A South Florida judge can rule however the heck he wants the MLB is exempt from almost any law preventing them from acting “in the best interests of the league”. If the judge forces the sale through the MLB can still block it and assume control of the team. It would take a while but the MLB could sell the team back to Loria for 10 million in the end and they wouldn’t be breaking any laws.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:36 AM EST up reply actions
It’d still be funny to see this drag out… mostly because fuck baseball
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 10:37 AM EST up reply actions
I think it’d be funny not because fuck baseball but fuck Jeff Loria… he was the owner of Expos who gutted that organization so he could sell them to Washington and get a lot of money. And then he turned around and used that money to buy a different baseball team.
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:44 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
So with Ottawa and NJD winning every game has the “5 guys (TOR, FLA, WAS, NJD, OTT), 4 places” turned to “Toronto and the Southeast for division win and 8th”
Pretty much. As soon as we said it was 5 for 4, NJD went on an 8 game winning streak, effectively making it 4 for 3. Ottawa is pretty uncatchable right now too, and they’re playing really hot. Karlsson & Anderson are carrying them right now.
by Ben Schnell on Feb 23, 2012 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
I wouldnt say Spezza and Michalek are carrying them. If you want to say that the 5 core players are carrying the rest, that’d be fair, but I would just say that’s cuz they’re playing good. I would much sooner say its Karlsson and Anderson that are carrying them. They didnt expect much from Anderson, and Karlsson is the reason for Spezza’s big totals, i’d say
by Ben Schnell on Feb 23, 2012 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
Someone is going to offer sheet Karlsson for… a lot.
OPERATION TANK IS A GO.
In an unprecedented move 9 teams in the Eastern Conference have decided to officially "pass" on the playoffs
Predatory offer sheet? haha, no, this is the national hockey league.
RIP Former-and-forever Leaf Wade Belak
Me on Twitter
by Bower Power on Feb 23, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions
Predatory? No. He’s a PPG defensemen and i’m sure the Oilers will think that will continue into infinity… or some other stupid GM.
OPERATION TANK IS A GO.
In an unprecedented move 9 teams in the Eastern Conference have decided to officially "pass" on the playoffs
I wish they would, but if no one offer sheet’s stamkos, I dont think they’ll offer sheet Karlsson.
its a shame
by Ben Schnell on Feb 23, 2012 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
Oh baby is Karlsson ever going to get paid. How much did Doughty make? A lot, right?
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:47 AM EST up reply actions
If he ends up making more than Doughty it would be laughable… Doughty can actually play defense. Karlsson is the best 4th forward in the NHL but one of the worst defensemen
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:49 AM EST up reply actions
He won’t get more, but they’ll probably at least glance at Doughty’s contract and Tyler Myers contract.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:50 AM EST up reply actions
Doughty got 56 million so there’s plenty of room for Karlsson to get a lot even if he gets less.
OPERATION TANK IS A GO.
In an unprecedented move 9 teams in the Eastern Conference have decided to officially "pass" on the playoffs
Oh he’ll get money but if I were the Sens I’d go no higher than Mike Greens
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
Karlsson already has more points than Green had in his contract year, and the cap was 10 million lower or so…
OPERATION TANK IS A GO.
In an unprecedented move 9 teams in the Eastern Conference have decided to officially "pass" on the playoffs
he is going to get paaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaid
though I worry he may actually earn that contract
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 23, 2012 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2012/2/23/2818899/did-a-hockey-website-leak-leafs-trade-interests
http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2012/2/23/2818899/did-a-hockey-website-leak-leafs-trade-interests
http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2012/2/23/2818899/did-a-hockey-website-leak-leafs-trade-interests
Pension Plan Puppets
I hope YouTube comes down to film this.
by birky on Feb 23, 2012 10:16 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
playoffs
based on adj score fenwick, if regression to the mean occurs, then the thrashers and ottawa should get 7 and 8th, while florida claims their division (in effectively 8th).
And why must the NYR and NSH goalies ruin such a nice regression.
Ugh, your R^2 value is terrible. I can’t read anything from this!
So, apparently I can now be followed.. but no stalking. @alsonamedphil
?
Move along. Nothing to see here...
by Van Ryn's Neurologist on Feb 23, 2012 10:36 AM EST up reply actions
Pekka Rinne and Henrik Lundqvist destroyed jeffgm’s R^2…
OPERATION TANK IS A GO.
In an unprecedented move 9 teams in the Eastern Conference have decided to officially "pass" on the playoffs
by Ubiquitous on Feb 23, 2012 10:37 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Can someone explain this to me? Its just the top 8 x values right? So they think Nashville wont make it?
by Ben Schnell on Feb 23, 2012 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
In theory if we played the season a lot of times Nashville shouldn’t make the playoffs very often but its far too late for them to lose that much ground.
Also Pekka Rinne is just that good.
OPERATION TANK IS A GO.
In an unprecedented move 9 teams in the Eastern Conference have decided to officially "pass" on the playoffs
If you add PDO/10 + Fenwick, Rinne and Lundquist will follow a better regression but artic ice and company do not accept this because it is not as “predictive” as a the raw fenwick measure. That is, PDO (SV%+SH%) is generally not be sustainable above or below 1000 but sure tell that to Rinne, Lundquist and heck even Toskala or Mason. .
Nashville this year has a PDO of 1.013 (8.7% shooting, 92.7% ES Sv%).
Last year they were at 1.017 (8.6% and 93.1%).
It’s probably fair to say that their long-term PDO is above 1.000, maybe even above 1.010. So their goal differential might regress somewhat, but not necessarily all that much.
There are other kinds of luck though. Their goal differential of +13 would put them about two wins better than .500 win% in the long run, but they’re 35-25. They’re 20-8-6 in one-goal games (excluding empty net goals), so they’ve been fortunate to have all their goals against pile up in blowouts and eke out wins in the close games. Winning close games does not appear to be a long-term talent (I’ll dig up a link for that in a bit).
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
by Eric T. on Feb 23, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It is unlikely that a team will maintain a PDO significantly above or below 1000 on a long enough time scale. Teams can, and do, maintain PDOs above or below 1000 over the course of a full season.
The plural of "anecdote" is not "data".
Internet Champ. I'm on Twitter too! - draglikepull
by Draglikepull on Feb 23, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
/nod
Basically, it’s a matter of degree, and also goaltending.
Teams don’t maintain a PDO of 1.030, which is where the Wild were after 30 games, before they started their losing streak.
An exceptional goaltender (and I mean the elites like Thomas or Rinne, not the Backstroms of the world) might be worth 10 points in the long run. An equally exceptional group of forwards might be worth that much, though that’s less common. But not many teams will be outside the ~0.990-1.010 range in the long run.
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
This is basically my problem wtih PDO. I think it needs to be calibrated to the goaltending tandem of a specific team if we want to call it a measurement of luck.
The PDO of a team with Mason/York in net will likely remain lower than 1000 while one with Luongo/Schneider will likely remain above.
I almost feel it would be better if instead of just using the team ES S% it would be more accurate to adjust for the teams’ goalies career ES S% vs this years ES S%
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 12:28 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, this is definitely true. On the other hand, the simple system isn’t that far off.
I mean, league average save percentage is .919. How many teams have a goalie tandem with a long-term expectation as high as .929? Coming into this year, only three goalies (Hiller, Thomas, Luongo) had career ESSv% that high, and factoring in backups pulls Vancouver below that threshold.
So while it’s true that it’d be better to make the corrections, and I agree with you that it should be done, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to just use the simple numbers and remember that a very select few will outperform them by a bit.
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
Fair enough. I just think people need to keep this in mind when looking at things like PDO (and comparing teams by Fendwick). It has an impact.
As draglikepull said below it is all about context. It is a very useful tool for such a simple calculation (as you point out), we just need to keep the context in mind.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 2:03 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree – if you have Toskala in net, like the leafs did in 2008, the team PDO was not going to climb that season. And many people understand this but if you don’t follow the leafs closely you might think the team and goaltending could regress upwards, especially given his career SV% wasn’t that bad to that point.
The problem with using Fenwick alone to analyze teams like this is that if you have really good (or really bad) goaltending you can play way outside your predicted outcomes (see Van, Nash, CBJ, and to a lesser extent Edm and Cgy)
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 12:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Using any stat without context is problematic, but I think as far as individual statistics go, especially on the team level, Fenwick is one of the most reliable.
The plural of "anecdote" is not "data".
Internet Champ. I'm on Twitter too! - draglikepull
by Draglikepull on Feb 23, 2012 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
If Grabbo does leave
You would have to think its only because Burke is going hard after Parise or Carter in the offseason. I know we don’t have wads of cap space but aside from Kessel and Brown, none of our forwards are signed past 2013 – if Burke wants Grabbo as part of the core going forward, he’s not going to let 1 year of cap concerns change that.
If Burke lets Grabbo go on the hope that Parise “might” make it to July 1 then he’s dumb.
If he lets him go, the only reason I can think of is that Grabovski’s agent priced him out of a deal with Toronto. And I’ll be sad.
If Burke really wants Parise he’ll find the cap space.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
Makes sense. He’s been really good for them this season. That and his shootout moves are always entertaining (to the extent that that matters)
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 11:04 AM EST up reply actions
It’s only $2million per. Not huge and crippling.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 12:20 PM EST up reply actions
Wilson: We were thinking about playing Gus, but decided that we’d like to keep the puck OUT of our net
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
See the puck. Stop the puck.
BE THE PUCK.
I'm building a beautiful statue, to make sure that no one forgets you
by jimmyp22 on Feb 23, 2012 11:35 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
cont....
Gus: Where’d it go?
Burke: Right in the lumberyard.
I shot a moose once, in upstate New York.
by not norm ullman on Feb 23, 2012 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
Caption it.
At least it's not Lebda.
by Nifty Mittens on Feb 23, 2012 12:50 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Transforming into Optimus Reim can take a lot out of you
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 12:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
From left to right
GREAT GOOGLY MOOGLY THAT’S AWFUL!
Hey guys, you smell something funny?
/smug
The First Certified Grabbo Lover
by SkinnyFish on Feb 23, 2012 12:53 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Boyce can still smell with a nose like that?
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Reimer is really selling it
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 12:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
After two girls one cup was accidentally shown on the jumbo-tron.
Reimer : OH GAWSH, MY EYES!
Boyce : What are they doing with the cu… ewwwwwwwwwwwwww
Lombardi : Mmmhhmmmmm, yeah, oh yeah, that’s nice.
At least it's not Lebda.
by Nifty Mittens on Feb 23, 2012 1:01 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Gustavsson OT goal, it buuuuuuuuuuuurns
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 23, 2012 1:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Lombardi’s thoughts:
Ahhhhh, got Reimer with the old “ice cube down the back of the jersey” trick again..
The plural of "anecdote" is not "data".
Internet Champ. I'm on Twitter too! - draglikepull
by Draglikepull on Feb 23, 2012 1:46 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
AHH SPIDER GET IT OFF GET IT OFF!!
Kadri Fanboy since 2006
by WizardofNaz on Feb 23, 2012 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I got the feeling that something ain’t right
I’m so scared in case I fall off my chair
And I’m wondering how I’ll get down the stairs
Concussion to the left of me
Whiplash to the right
" No one wants advice - only corroboration " - John Steinbeck
by GreatKingRat on Feb 23, 2012 2:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Lombardi: It was me.
Pension Plan Puppets
I hope YouTube comes down to film this.
by birky on Feb 23, 2012 2:28 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Unsure if this has been mentioned yet
But what about Sanford? He’s managed a .915 in 29 games in fucking Columbus, is a UFA this summer, and Howson is an idiot.
well, that escalated quickly
by aelanK on Feb 23, 2012 1:02 PM EST via Android app reply actions
So Gustavsson is just being thrown under the bus now. We are just going to forget that he is reason we got this far when Reimer was injured? Didn’t Burke personally thank him for stepping up and coming through earlier this year?
At least it's not Lebda.
He had one good month, 2 tops.
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Dramatization
At least it's not Lebda.
by Nifty Mittens on Feb 23, 2012 1:09 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
if that’s gustavsson than he’s also the one who lit the car on fire
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 23, 2012 1:09 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
it’s going to get a lot of miles
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 23, 2012 1:12 PM EST up reply actions
Burke said he saved the season. that’s pretty good praise, but he has also stunk it up lately. And he blew a really important game the other night. Really important.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 1:10 PM EST up reply actions
Brian Burke says a lot of things
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 23, 2012 1:12 PM EST up reply actions
He’s played 3 games in February. The last 2 were stinkers but the first was a 2-1 loss where he stopped 27 of 29. He went 7-4 in January with 3 shutouts (should have been 4).
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 1:23 PM EST up reply actions
yes, but are you watching the same goaltender I am? I’ve had enough of this hot/cold on/off
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 1:26 PM EST up reply actions
The team won 7, how was Gustavssons performance?
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
He had 3, nearly 4, shutouts with a .926% svp so he must have sucked. Give the defence all the credit.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
BUILD HIM A STATUE
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
even the goal he let in to not get the 4th shutout was a big stinker too. Unless he gets a shutout, you’re pretty much guaranteed one stinker.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
Good for Gus for somehow not playing like himself for an 11 game stretch, thanks for keeping up out of the lottery….so far. But he’s returned to his crappy form, which is just dreadful.
The First Certified Grabbo Lover
He was also 5-2 in November but we can choose to forget about those games too.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
how about all the times where he sucked so bad it cost the team games they should have won?
I mean you can say he played well, but how many games can you think of where gustavsson was the reason the Leafs took home 2 points?
because I can think of over a dozen where he was the reason they went home with none
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 23, 2012 1:39 PM EST up reply actions
( ♥ )( ♥ )
You are correct sir. None of the wins should be credited to him yet all the losses should.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 1:44 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
How many games did he really steal a win for us? How many did he lose the game for us by letting in one or more crappy goals?
One of those two is larger than the other.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
that is exactly what I said, I love it when people take context out of context
you also ignored the question, ill make it easy, name ONE game where gustavsson was the main reason the Leafs won
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 23, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
The first game against Pittsburgh where the Leafs won 4-3. Either of the Rangers games both 4-2. The 2-0 win over Buffalo.
I get it, the Reimer apologists and Gus bashers out number those trying to look at this yr’s performances of both goalies without recalling last yr.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
Gus has earned the team several wins.
Gus has earned the team several losses.
Gus’ earned losses outnumber his earned wins.
The First Certified Grabbo Lover
by SkinnyFish on Feb 23, 2012 1:46 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Those numbers will vary greatly depending on whether you like or loathe Gus as a goalie. Loss earned is easy to quantify as you can see a clearly bad goal like the OT winner. A win earned is much harder to quantify. Even if a goalie stops 40 shots are they 40 shots that any NHL level goalie should stop or are were there 10 that only an elite few would have stopped in exactly the same situation.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
It’s really easy to quantify when the small rubber disk continuously slides between his legs on saves your average 5 year old can stop
Yes that was hyperbole… but seriously there’s no excuse for a lot of the goals he lets in
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 2:37 PM EST up reply actions
lets double check this just to be sure
Gus has started 28 games. Lets say that games in which he earned the team a loss are 1-2 goal games in which he posted < .900 OR less than .860 regardless of the score. Now lets say that games he won are 1-2 goal games in which he posted >=.915 OR greater than .955 regardless of the score (.040 spread in both cases).
That would make his losses:
FLA
@BUF
MON
@PIT
@CGY
NJD
His wins would be:
@NYR
PIT
WAS
@TBL
@NYR
WPG
DET
BUF
NYI
Maybe my criteria is too loose. If you include 1-2 goal losses <=.910 you add
OTT
I think that might be it. Now obviously this definition may be overly simplistic, and there are probably some games in which his overall SV% was ok but he let in one really bad goal that essentially caused the loss. There may also be a win in there in which he posted an easy shutout. But to say that Gus’ earned losses are more numerous than his earned wins is maybe overly simplistic. At least this season.
Move along. Nothing to see here...
by Van Ryn's Neurologist on Feb 23, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
how is there not a boston game in his losses?
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
started 2 games, both greater than 2 goal difference.
i might give you the 6-3 game with a .872 SV%, especially since the Leafs managed to score 3 goals. But he still managed to stop 34 shots that game. I don’t see how a team wins many games against Boston giving up 39 shots against. The truth is, Boston seems to have our number this season.
Move along. Nothing to see here...
by Van Ryn's Neurologist on Feb 23, 2012 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
Sorry my reading comprehension isn’t so good today.
Finally got twitter...@mapleleafmjt
by Chi-town leafs on Feb 23, 2012 2:48 PM EST up reply actions
no no. no worries. this is exactly why i dug up this data. it’s worth considering which games, in fact, Gus bears the responsibility for the loss, rather than just saying he’s been to blame more often then not.
i should also be clear, i’m not really defending him here. I’ve given up on him. But once again I fear that it’s becoming too easy to just shift all blame onto one player. If the Leafs don’t make the playoffs this season, it’s not going to be just because of Jonas Gustavsson.
Move along. Nothing to see here...
by Van Ryn's Neurologist on Feb 23, 2012 2:58 PM EST up reply actions
It will likely be, because our goaltending has been poor. But frankly I don’t blame Gus for not being that good (he simply isn’t), or Reimer who is a sophomore (after only a half length rookie season) who had a major injury. I blame Burke for taking the huge gamble that a tandem of the of them was.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 3:07 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
exactly. I mean, there’s a reason that a guy with a career SV% of <.900 started 28 games this season. its because there weren’t any better options available. considering how bad he can be, we should be thrilled that he’s given us as many of those won games above as he has. but the blame lies at the feet of Burke. and to some extent, Wilson, for not doing a better job of sheltering sub-par goaltending with a half decent defensive system.
Move along. Nothing to see here...
by Van Ryn's Neurologist on Feb 23, 2012 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
I agree but I just don’t know who we realistically could have gotten in the summer. Theodore maybe.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
oh our defense has also sucked for sure. there’s plenty of blame to go around. It’s just when you whiff on weak shots repeatedly over a season, you know, people will blame you even if you held us in a game we easily could have lost.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
If VRN has given up on Gus then all hope is lost.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
I stuck to Gus for a while too. Not as long as VRN but into this season. I just can’t anymore. It’s not right, he’s got to go in the off season.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 3:18 PM EST up reply actions
Boston games were blow out and by more than 2 goals.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
The way I see it
Gus has played like a slightly below average backup. He has had a few great games, more bad games, and a bunch of average games.
Had he been given a typical backups job we probably wouldn’t mind much. He played really bad in his last game so he is taking a lot of heat, but once cool heads prevail we’ll realize he is likely what he has appeared this year: an okay but not very good back up. A Brent Johnson or Mathieu Garon if you will.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 2:11 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Here are a bunch of guys with similar career numbers to him ( http://www.hockey-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=combined&year_min=2003&year_max=2012&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&birth_country=&franch_id=&is_active=Y&is_hof=&pos=G&handed=&c1stat=games_goalie&c1comp=gt&c1val=60&c2stat=save_pct&c2comp=gt&c2val=0.8975&c3stat=save_pct&c3comp=lt&c3val=0.9025&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=save_pct) . It definitely isn’t a great list, but it has a bunch of backups and a couple of AHL/NHL tweeners. And Toskalol
PS sorry about the inability to embed links. On mobile.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 2:17 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
When you look at that list Boucher jumps out for me. Like Gus can be lights out or a sieve depending on which version shows up for the game.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 2:22 PM EST up reply actions
If you expand it to 0.905 (instead of 0.9025) career you get guys like Johnson and Garon. I think Johnson may act as a similar career progression.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 2:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Why did you set the filter for only Toronto-Philadelphia-Columbus goalies?
Oh…
O! To join the rush / As the season builds
by Back In Black on Feb 23, 2012 3:39 PM EST up reply actions
Want to hear something crazy
Detroit, that team who just set the home winning record, has a LOSING record on the road.
Home
26-2-1
53 points in 29 games
150 point pace!!
Away
15-16-1
31 points in 32 games
79 point pace
THAT IS ALMOST TWICE THE PACE. Wow. Talk about Jekyll and Hyde.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 2:08 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Just can’t get octopus away from the Joe.
"They build a statue, they knock it down and piss on it, and now they will be out there building it again."
by ThickSkinnedAlive on Feb 23, 2012 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
So Hamrlik just called out Hunter (in no vague way). I think he is out the door soon (also the sky is blue).
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 3:17 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Saw it. Wonder if he goes to NJD who don’t seem to want to pay for what it would cost to get Zidlicky.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:18 PM EST up reply actions
Hunter’s been baaaaad.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 3:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Why is all teh blame on Hunter? Why is George McPhee getting off free? McPhee has assembled this team, he should face the music as well
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Blow it up. Blow the whole damn thing up.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
No they dont have to blow it up. They have a lot of pieces in place. Unload Semin on Monday, hope for 2 top 10 picks, trade up for one of the top 2 guys and retool for next year
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
“Retool” ie ship out everything that isn’t going to help you and/or is causing problems. Hamrlik dissing the coach seems to be a good reason to ship him the hell out.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 3:33 PM EST up reply actions
I agree. However his 3.5M contract may make it difficult
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
Swap bad salaries! Komisarek for Hamrlik!
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Ya I was being snarky. They clearly have a good core.
Backstrom/Ovechkin/Green are good pieces to have. I wonder if Vokoun stays next year or not (I’m thinking not).
Not 100% solve on Neuvirth but they also have Holtby coming up in the wings.
No idea what they can get for Semin but if they expect him to bolt to the KHL this is a good time to try to get anything for him (kind of like they did with Varlamov)
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:35 PM EST up reply actions
Unload Semin (heh), Green. Build an actual second line.
Pension Plan Puppets
I hope YouTube comes down to film this.
by birky on Feb 23, 2012 3:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
better than a shot in the mouth
Resident Internet Tough Guy
by JaredFromLondon on Feb 23, 2012 3:41 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
if they don’t get enough assets back though it could leave a bad taste
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 3:50 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Sounds like a deal that would be hard to swallow.
At least it's not Lebda.
by Nifty Mittens on Feb 23, 2012 3:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Trade Green now while he value is at it’s lowest? I dunno.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:39 PM EST up reply actions
Kind of screams Phaneuf deal v2.0 no?
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:39 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but if his value goes up then they probably won’t want to trade him anyway. It’s a bit of a catch 22
Professional cusser causer.
by T is for Truculence on Feb 23, 2012 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
I shouldn’t be the one to answer because I thought he built a great team.
It had a top goalie, a top goalie prospect.
It had two top puck movers on D.
A good mix of veteran and young D.
A great young all around guy (Carlson)
2 good defensive D (Alner and Hammer)
At forward:
It had one of the top two forwards in the game
One of the 10 best C’s in the league
Another very talented winger (Semin)
Good 2-way forwards who can put up offense (Laich, Brouwer, Ward)
A couple of good young guys (Johansen, Eakins, etc).
So yeah I was very wrong on this team.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 3:30 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think Carlson, Alzner and Orlov get a lot more hype than they might be worth.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
I really like Carlson. The other two may very likely be true.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 3:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
The team had reasonable underlying numbers when Boudreau was the coach but they weren’t getting the level of goaltending Vokoun usually provides. They’ve been awful since Hunter took over, even though Vokoun has played excellently. If McPhee deserves to be blamed for something, it’s for firing a good coach and replacing him with someone who doesn’t seem to be very good.
The plural of "anecdote" is not "data".
Internet Champ. I'm on Twitter too! - draglikepull
by Draglikepull on Feb 23, 2012 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
Oh snap one more season at $3.5M.
Hmm. Maybe not going anywhere.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
hence my post of Friedman’s tweet. That team is going to implode if they lose a few more.
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 3:19 PM EST up reply actions
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:23 PM EST up reply actions
Where is this tweet?
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 3:26 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
its at backhandshelf
Championships = Money. Companies love making money. Except ML$E apparently
by elseldo on Feb 23, 2012 3:31 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
also FYI:
Tweet was:
Geez, it’s getting ugly in Washington
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
The Hockey News has a poll up asking who you think is the best player in the NHL. It has 30(!) choices, and includes the likes of Jagr, Karlsson, B Richards, Kopitar, Kovalchuk, Getzlaf, Backstrom (WAS) and even Kessel.
Are there even more than maybe 5 or 6 choices for the best player in the league when you factor in the uncertainty surrounding Sid?
Don't trade Grabbo
30 choices
I’m assuming that’s 1 from each team.
No no, dig UP stupid.
by nhlcheapshot on Feb 23, 2012 3:53 PM EST up reply actions
IMO it goes Malkin or Datsyuk. Those are the 2 best
Fairweather fans can go to hell
Equal oppurtunity asshole and a proud member of the PPPPP
Follow me on twitter: leafer1984
I feel like Thomas has to be in this conversation as he basically carried a team to the cup last year and Lundy who is just so damn good and holding his team in first in the east this year.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 4:01 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
best player in the NHL isn’t playing right now – Crosby, as you said. best player currently playing? Hmm…..
by Goosemonster on Feb 23, 2012 3:53 PM EST up reply actions
Best player this year?
Lundy followed by Quick.
On the ice? Malkin or Giroux. Stamkos is doing pretty damn well.
Best in the league period if you forget Crosby? With Ovi on a 1.5 year slump I feel like Malkin or Lundy or Thomas (though he is obviously pretty damn old so his value isn’t as high as the other two) would be the best answer IMHO. Chara, Lidstrom, and Weber are all fucking incredible too.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 3:54 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Fuck I completely forgot Datsyuk. He can go up against Thomas/Malkin/Lundy. One of those 4.
About time that people finally realized how awesome Gunnar is...
Certified Gunnar & Kule lover!
My new goal: To get the nickname Hebrew Hammer for Mike Brown to take off.
by BCapp on Feb 23, 2012 3:54 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
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